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AllenArt

LeatherGryphon said:

AllenArt said:

I'm working off a workstation that was manufactured in 2012 and have had it for nearly 4 years. It's a dual eight core Xeon with 64 gigs of ram, cost me 1000 bucks (with a 500 dollar 980ti-the cost at the time). It still meets my needs for the time being. When it comes time to get a new system, I'll do the same again if possible except perhaps this time I will spring for a used Quadro. Not sure on that yet. At any rate, I seem to be doing fine with what I've got for now ;). I may add 16 gigs of ram to my laptop (increasing to 32 gigs), but those are my only plans for now ;).

Laurie

Hmmm... the math confuses me. 64+16 not equal to 32.  Do you presently have 16GB instead of 64GB? 

Oops, nevermind, I just reread and realized that you're talking about two different machines. (*slinks away*)

Yes, two different computers...lol. I have a desktop where I do 99.9% of my renders and a gaming laptop, mostly for small, quick renders or just so I can sit my butt in front of the big TV in the living room and multitask. LOL 

Torquinox

AllenArt said:

Torquinox said:

AllenArt said:

Torquinox said:

It seems the only good news to buying an ots box right now is that you can actually get a 3000-series gc in it. I'm not seeing anything for sale like what @AllenArt describes, let alone at the price paid. Also, most of the reasonably affordable new machines I see for sale only have 16gb ram.

Newegg in the computer refurb section. :) 

Not at the present time. Section contains only single processor boxes mostly with 16Gb ram.

 https://www.newegg.com/p/1VK-001E-168F6?Item=9SIAC0F7VG8046

I'm not sure where you're looking, but I'm finding quite a few like I described. :)

Thanks! I see how I missed it. Those are not actually sold by Newegg. That's a marketplace seller. I've seen that seller on ebay, too. Do you have experience with their marketplace sellers? Are they reputable?

AllenArt

Torquinox said:

AllenArt said:

Torquinox said:

AllenArt said:

Torquinox said:

It seems the only good news to buying an ots box right now is that you can actually get a 3000-series gc in it. I'm not seeing anything for sale like what @AllenArt describes, let alone at the price paid. Also, most of the reasonably affordable new machines I see for sale only have 16gb ram.

Newegg in the computer refurb section. :) 

Not at the present time. Section contains only single processor boxes mostly with 16Gb ram.

 https://www.newegg.com/p/1VK-001E-168F6?Item=9SIAC0F7VG8046

I'm not sure where you're looking, but I'm finding quite a few like I described. :)

Thanks! I see how I missed it. Those are not actually sold by Newegg. That's a marketplace seller. I've seen that seller on ebay, too. Do you have experience with their marketplace sellers? Are they reputable?

The computer I have now I bought from a Newegg seller and it's been working faithfully, without fail, for nearly 4 years :). However, I will say, that even though I've only had one bad experience in all the years I've had and bought computers, that refurbs are always a gamble. You need to weigh the risks for your needs. I was glad I bought mine. It's a good computer :).

Laurie 

Torquinox

AllenArt said:

Thanks! I see how I missed it. Those are not actually sold by Newegg. That's a marketplace seller. I've seen that seller on ebay, too. Do you have experience with their marketplace sellers? Are they reputable?

The computer I have now I bought from a Newegg seller and it's been working faithfully, without fail, for nearly 4 years :). However, I will say, that even though I've only had one bad experience in all the years I've had and bought computers, that refurbs are always a gamble. You need to weigh the risks for your needs. I was glad I bought mine. It's a good computer :).

Laurie 

Thank you for your insight :) 

daveso

DELETE

AllenArt

daveso said:

AllenArt said:

Torquinox said:

AllenArt said:

Torquinox said:

It seems the only good news to buying an ots box right now is that you can actually get a 3000-series gc in it. I'm not seeing anything for sale like what @AllenArt describes, let alone at the price paid. Also, most of the reasonably affordable new machines I see for sale only have 16gb ram.

Newegg in the computer refurb section. :) 

Not at the present time. Section contains only single processor boxes mostly with 16Gb ram.

 https://www.newegg.com/p/1VK-001E-168F6?Item=9SIAC0F7VG8046

I'm not sure where you're looking, but I'm finding quite a few like I described. :)

is that still a viable machine in today's world? I've never looked at workstations such as this ... but the GPU is 2013 vintage.  The only other thing I can say is that my son bought a refurb from Newegg, a vendor, and it lasted less than 6 months. 

As I said, a refurb is always a gamble. Mine has been chugging along great for 4 years. I put another video card in mine. A much newer one.

Laurie 

kyoto kid

LynnInDenver said:

Yeah, I've been watching the factors on the price increases, even though I built my current rig around this time last year:

Increased demand for systems for working from home or the need for options for home entertainment. Not just laptops anymore, but the whole range.

The tariffs are now hitting full force, and in such a way that it's literally cheaper (and easier with video cards) to buy something off the shelf completely assembled than to try to build it now. (I have 32GB of RAM, I was intending to buy another 32 to go in it, but since it's not really necessary, it's now on the back burner until all this is finally over.)

Reduced supply of components in certain areas, partly because of the unanticipated shifts in demand, partly because of supply chain disruptions due to lockdowns. This also drives up prices.

Cryptocurrencies are in another peak, which has massively increased the demand for graphics cards again because it's viable to mine it again. This is compounded by scalpers buying up what they can and reselling it at an obnoxious markup to those who need it right now because they can. I have another system in the house I'd like to upgrade the video card on (virtual pinball machine), and that is also on the back burner because I'm not spending that much on three year old technology (the upgrade would be to be able to run a playfield screen at 4K instead of HD 1080), and the cryptocurrency thing means that buying a used video card of any flavor is now an incredible gamble.

In other words, multiple factors have reduced supply (in some cases dramatically) and increased demand and have increased the prices that the market will bear now.

...near the end of the last cryptomining craze, some companied offered dedicated "minimg cards" that didn't have video output.  They need to do that again but implement ig much earlier..  

Asari

I am under the impression that by the time the 3090 becomes affordable (it is currently still at 2.000€ here but at least in stock) the 4090 will be right around the corner.

I left rendering in Iray because of Nvidia dependency and landed with a renderer that too only supports nvidia GPU and isn't even faster. I need to do better ...

outrider42

If 2020 had been a more normal year, now would have been a fantastic time to upgrade. New GPUs will always be hard to get around launch, but not impossible. And certainly not so impossible 3 months after launch. Then the used market would be flooded with now last gen products, causing their prices to fall. It even started out that way. When the 3080 was first announced, Turing cards took a nose dive on eBay. You could have bought a 2080ti for $600 or less. They were there for the taking. I saw the listings, I even posted some here. Then the 3080 actually launched, and all hell broke loose.

So 2020 was not a normal year, and it is extending into 2021. More people are home, and more people are using their computers. Video games set records in 2020. Steam broke its record for concurrent users. So many people want to upgrade. But they aren't alone. The pandemic has also helped fuel a new crypto mining boom. It had been uneconomical to use desktop GPUs to mine, but the value of crypto went up so much that it became feasible again. And it turns out that Ampere is decent at mining. Then you add the scalpers and their bots, and there goes the supply. This new demand has shifted everything. Even old Pascal cards are selling way above the prices they should be at their age. I just looked up 1070 completed sales, they are going above $300. The 1070 was $330 at launch in 2016! That is pretty ridiculous.

And this is before the new Trump 25% tariff kicks in. At least it doesn't apply to used parts, but it could still impact those prices.

So what should have been a great time to buy and upgrade has turned into a nightmare, and one of the worst times to upgrade unless you get lucky. Or get your own bot.

I read that Nvidia might consider making a new mining card like they did with the 1060 a few years ago. They would be cheaper to make since they have no video ports. From our perspective such cards could be interesting as rendering cards, particularly if they are based on the newly announced 3060 that has 12GB of VRAM. However, I remember the mining cards in 2016 had very short return policies, like 30 days.

richardandtracy

daveso said:

...

is that still a viable machine in today's world? I've never looked at workstations such as this ... but the GPU is 2013 vintage.  The only other thing I can say is that my son bought a refurb from Newegg, a vendor, and it lasted less than 6 months. 

My machine is a 2013 vintage machine. It was pretty high spec when new, an HP Z220 with 4 core 3.2 GHz Xeon, 16Gb RAM + 1Tb disc and a 1Gb Quadro Pro 2000 GPU. I used it at work for 6 years and then was able to take it home when the company got new machines. The new PC at work is a Dell, 6 core 3.8GHz Xeon, 32Gb RAM, 1Tb disc and a Quadro P 4000. There is no detectable difference in performance between the two in my engineering design and analysis work - and I use the thing over 8 hours a day so any difference would be noticeable. For my hobby, I fitted a GTX 1060 to the old machine and graphically it now seems to outperform the new one by a fair bit with that card.

So, in conclusion, a 2013 machine can hold its own against new machines. Rendering time for a US scene is around 2 hours, and a simple G8F scene can be as low as 5 mins. I don't get the rendering speed of a GTX 2070 or newer card, but the whole system cost me the cost of the second hand GTX1060 - equivalent to $140 - so I'm pleased.

Regards,

Richard.