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http://www.rules.utah.gov/publicat/code/r152/r152-11.htm#T8
Utah Law
The only part of the law I found regarding consumers was related to the initial purchase- the original content NEVER being offered. In this case, it was- then changed. But that last sentence implies the consumer must approve any changes in merchandise that was purchased.
This isn't the first time DAZ changed products- remember there was a product with Lisa's items in it, and when she went to another site, one of the items was taken from the bundle? Can't remember how that worked out- but no mention was made to us, some eagle eyed person spotted it.
But the bottom line, DAZ should do the right thing because it's the right thing to do!
R152-11-8. Substitution of Consumer Commodities.
A. It shall be a deceptive act or practice in connection with a consumer transaction for a supplier to furnish similar consumer commodities of equal or greater value when there was no intention to ship, deliver or install the original consumer commodities ordered. (But DAZ did that originally.) The act of a supplier in furnishing similar merchandise of equal or greater value as a good faith substitute does not violate this rule if such substitution is first approved by the consumer.
I am speaking here as an individual, not as a forum moderator, and IANAL.
The last sentence you cited still only applies to the original deliverable -- since the product as originally delivered contained what was promised, there was no substitution. While DAZ 3D allows you to redownload products, it is under no obligation to do so, and under no obligation to provide the identical product if you lose the original download.
In the case of the bundle containing Lisa's products, DAZ 3D had no choice but to stop offering that bundle, as Lisa owned those products and withdrew her permission to DAZ 3D to sell those products. If you purchased them prior to Lisa's doing so, they are still in your Product Library, but DAZ 3D can't continue to sell them, either individually or as part of a bundle.
All that said, I agree with the sentiment that DAZ 3D should continue to provide the older version as a courtesy, but they aren't obligated to do so. I have no idea what the reason was in this particular case -- it may be that the older version required more support, as the legacy Poser file structure can be confusing for those unfamiliar with it, but that's just a WAG.
Yeah, that's the way I interpreted it (and noted that DAZ had delivered the original product.) There really aren't any laws about digital content in regards to this issue, that I could find anyway. I don't use Poser and files still boggle my wee little mind, but I hope this gets sorted out. I try to give Daz the benefit of doubt that they'll take a look at it anyway. :)
I could get the duf of his nettles in C8.5 but I use 8.1 too and would have to save it to my browser without mipmapping to use there, is reason I have not bought any of his other plants since. is acceptable as know but stuff that DID have legacy files not having now is not so acceptable.
The people who bought the product before Lisa went away have the full download in their product library, new buyers get the product without the plants.
Good to know.
Someone posted about Poser files boggles their minds...I say the same about Studio files. I am trying to navigate myself through the program and have stumbled on some head scratcher moments, like I have to often wonder why I have access to the same content on both sides of my screen [the UI] being one of them. There seems to be a ton of little nooks and crannies Studio files hide in that are scattered all over my drive, compared to Poser located in a nice neat Runtime folder. It took me probably a better part of an hour to try and find the skin textures in the Studio folders, I admitted defeat and had to use the windows Search feature to find them. I think I found them in the Data folder....Data? Really?! But it's a learning curve I guess. I guess it's like learning to speak Spanish when English is my primary language. I'm fortunate [or unfortunate...it's a family curse] enough to tackle the challenge and try to conquer it...even if it takes a lot of cussing and temper tantrums.
I am switching to learning how to use Studio because I didn't want to use Dson in Poser, as my last foray with that when it rolled out brand new, totally screwed up my Poser Runtime and so pretty much anything I get off DAZ site I was only going to use in Studio which is located on another computer. Compared to my other PC that has just my Poser content on it.
I was always under the impression that with Dson, Studio items can be used but you lose most of the morphing/posing functions when in Poser. If that is correct, items that used to work in Poser fine but are now converted to Dson now have limited use that is pretty stinky.
I could get the duf of his nettles in C8.5 but I use 8.1 too and would have to save it to my browser without mipmapping to use there, is reason I have not bought any of his other plants since. is acceptable as know but stuff that DID have legacy files not having now is not so acceptable.
Thanks Wendy, I have it working now, & have a nice hillside covered in replicated poppies. Dunno what it was, but the next day the prop opened good as gold! (don't think I can post a render as the main scene is likely to become a commercial product)
I have a similar issue with the tall weeds product, which will only load as cr2 through the "content" hierarchy, but I think it's because that's a Poser prop with a Studio CF. Anyhow it's no big deal for me as Carrara tends to prefer Poser format props over DS.
Tip: Use Content Library and start with Products section. Things are listed alphabetically and although it's not perfect all the time (some things might not show up in entirety) I usually start there. You do know that using DIM is a fast way to get to the ReadMes? Click on the Installed tab, then the little "i" (for information) over on the left by where the downloading shows up while in progress. The ReadMes tell you where to find the products (although many are incomplete). I'm probably telling you things you already know :)
Very badly handled Daz staff. :(
And let's not forget that the Readmes are no longer packaged with the products; you have to go to the documentation 'wiki' for them now. (Although I've gotten into the habit of downloading the PDF version of any Readme I have to reference, because I'm not always online.)
I, too, have found myself in the unfortunate position of having to restore a lost content archive (in bed with laptop + external hard disk + long signal cable + "Man, I gotta pee like a Peruvian Pack Mule!" = "OH, CRAP!!!") I still don't know how fully I've recovered from that little mishap -- a lot of my original archive consisted of Renderosity/ShareCG free stuff, and DAZ content I acquired between 2005 (when I started this 'Prime Obsession') and 2009, when my current customer relationship with DAZ re-commenced -- but the experience taught me a valuable lesson, to wit:
Download everything I buy, from whatever vendor. For DS stuff, I run DIM offline, and point it to a 'DAZ Staging' directory, that contains the content I want to install. Once installed, I move it to at least two network-attached locations (because it ain't paranoia when somebody really is out to get you!) (And remember: even a paranoid has at least one real enemy! In my case, it's my network.) Periodically back-up your runtime(s); I am now juggling a total of nine: one DAZ Studio-specific, one DSON, that is shared between DAZ and Poser Pro 2012, (these two are the only ones DIM knows about), and seven "legacy" runtimes, from my Poser 6/8/9 days (Poser 6 and 8 no longer run under Windows 8, and 9 has "compatibility issues"). You can get a 1-TB SATA disk from Fry's -- at least, I did -- for about $80, and an external case can be snagged from Best Buy for about $30. After that, all you need is time; pushing 300+ gigabytes of content down a wire -- even at USB3 transfer rates -- takes a while.
Better safe than sorry....
•I've noticed a lot of product updates lately. I didn't think much about it I just download them. Figured maybe they fixed a seam or something.
•Now you have me wondering if these are overwriting my backup installers that I have dim pointing towards, but most of the updates appear to be products that are not too very old. So I don't know if those products had poser content installers originally or not. I have not tried opening any of the new installers to check. Quite frightening to think that the program I came to love for getting content organized may cause pain down the road.
•Good ideal now I guess to point the dim to a new placeholder for installers, and keep an old backup free of any more new installer updates. Sure hope I had an archive of the older installers. :-) sure I do.
•On that note at least I finally learned to point Daz content to its own runtimes instead of pointing clothes to my clothes runtime and such. I have some really unclean runtimes, and it takes time clean up after mistakenly combining them with Daz content over time.
•Someone mentioned 10-12 runtimes, wish i had that problem I have over twenty some based on product by company some based on free items, and some even some dedicated to nothing but base figures and base content of my favorite most often used figures like V4.2
Something's definitely amiss -- textures shouldn't be in the Data folder, they should be in Runtime/Textures just like they are for Poser-format content.
This is incorrect -- you still have the morphing/posing functions. The problem with only having DSON is that (a) it doesn't work in Poser 8 or earlier (although Smith-Micro doesn't support Poser 8 anymore either), and (b) because it has to operate through a plug-in rather than being handled natively by Poser, it isn't as efficient -- for some people it works fine, for others the performance is unacceptable.
I have been archiving all my zips and if they have been overwritten without Poser native files that makes this rather pointless.
I shall point DIM to a new folder now to prevent any further corruption and test some of the newer zips to see if Poser native files have been omited.
As a carrara user this is a very serious issue for me as DSON is useless and not all duf is useable.
If you have textures in your data folder, then your problems are due to content installation being in a bit of a mess, nothing to do with how D|S organises content. Anything in your data folder is third-rail-do-not-touch territory, and should never be directly accessible from inside the program at all. Data files are always loaded automatically by other content files (usually scenes or figure/prop assets), they're never loaded by themselves.
Note that there are two things called "textures" — the actual image files that get painted on to the object mesh, and the script files that call up those textures and tell the program how to apply them and how to set all the parameters for the object's materials. It's confusing, but this naming has been used for so long (since early versions of Poser) I don't think we'll ever completely get rid of it.
After reading this thread, I was worried this might be happening to my own products, so I spoke to DAZ about it.
I was told that this issue is specific to the PA(s) in question, and NOT to all products. They told me that as long as I continue to submit Poser versions of my products, the Poser version will always be available.
mac
Well, this is good to know. Thanks.
Thank you very much!
I am using Poser AND DazStudio - and I really do prefer special versions for each!
DSON is slow and slows down Poser, as simple as that ...
DAZ is aware of this thread and they are working on a solution. But remember DAZ doesn't always come in to comment.
That's good to know.
Thanks for the info Mac!
Admin, mods, whatever, whoever, there is only one way I can now be contacted, as my efforts to set up an email have come to futility, I'm not trying now either, give up if you don't succeed.
Doric
Hopefully, the solution will involve providing Poser downloads for products which were originally sold as Poser products. I bought many of Predatron's products specifically because they were Poser products. So, if something catastrophic were to again happen to my computer and archived files, I'd lose those Poser products if I was not able to download replacement files.
I'm already extremely limited in what I'm able to purchase from the DAZ store. Given I spent a shocking amount of money here over the years before the change in content format, there aren't a lot of back products I'm interested in purchasing. But, it would be a shame if I could no longer purchase Poser products fearing I'd lose access to future downloads.
Yes good to know
by all means if vendors choose to only support DAZ studio or use DSON in future products that is their perogative
I would buy those products aware I have to export from DAZ studio to use in Carrara and do some work myself, I indeed do and can tell you some require a fair bit!!!
But please please please do not remove previously existing files that were compatible.
The duf route often adds visible difficult bones to props in carrara I find extreemly annoying at times that are not present in cr2, pp2 etc figures are one thing but an example is if I try to use say a room or building figure in duf format all the doors and windows have a skeleton in carrara with a root bone!!!
Honestly I just want to use a slider to open the damned door or pivot it!!!