The Aftertaste
Dream Cutter
Posts: 1,222
You know when you try one of the new energy drinks that looks so delicious in the fancy bottle, only to find it leaves a nasty aftertaste....
Well this is what I am experiencing since the DAZ store upgrade.
Let me explain: I'm an active participant in the community and frequent consumer of DAZ and other 3D products. I shelled out full price for DS4 Pro when it arrived, jumped in with two feet. Was perplexed when the core product of this company started shipping free, but came to embrace the concept and and jointly invest in the community. So I set up some theme oriented niche sites so like FarmPeeps.com so fellow artist peeps could focus on their favorite rendering topics and learn and share techniques. Add lots of links to DAZ and the busted CJ ads. I invested in Genisis products to learn their capabilities and identify further ways for users to leverage the power of the new technology and how it can be integrated in 3D pipelines. In total, I spent well overt $1500 in DAZ products the last 12 mos, with $400 since the launch of the new store. So I'm like a dedicated enthusiast - right? You would think DAZ would like lots of consumers like me... However its the loyal, dedicated peeps like me that feel slighted when DAZ makes drastic change without planning for mitigating the consequences. We need some consistency and care on the details....contractual and communication of expectations. The consumer has been very flexible and patient, however were reaching the limits of tolerance.
Finally, Perhaps the business (Store / PA / PC Club program) were run as efficiently and strictly as the discussion forum, the consumers would not feel like they are being disregarded. The strictly adhered forum TOS and overzealous forum admins delete, move and lock more of my messages almost the minute I post them, but Customer Support can't answer my 2 week old email where I was charged wrong item prices, and sales tax? We cant get proper documentation for professional grade apps? And we need to put up with Stalinist's running the forum? Sure I love Rendo, but I used to like DAZ too. It disappoints me my voice is frequently snuffed, and that my positions are recast towards prejudged topics and the thread locked before without allowing for debate. I hate it that when I offer to share something (link to site page ) to the community my message is deleted.
Admins before deleting this post, I hope you get the point: Its a respect thing. I'm not seeking a coupon for satisfaction. Stop treating us like corralled dolphins. Start treating us like your partners in the industry.
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Comments
what on earth were you linking to that it got deleted?
Warez? porn? Renderotica?
As long as the posts adhere to the TOS they stay. If they violate the TOS then they go. Please review the TOS before posting and you won't have any problems.
Multiple posts, plugging the same thing will always be removed, particularly if they are in Official Daz threads, or someone elses Charity thread.
UPDATE : Plugging same topic in multiple times, in the threads you mentioned. OK I understand your point, didn't see it from that perspective. I suppose that dilutes their point - that would be bad. I just wanted to share the freebies at farmpeeps.com, but tried to find thread that would be appropriate. Not trying to exploit the PC Club "official" thread, nor that it was an "charity" post. The intent was rather that the readers were either seeking their missing freebie / coupon and in the case of the charity, it is really just sales pitch to buy a game. I wanted to offer the readers to get download or make their own free indy games as the subject suggested. Apologize about the misunderstanding.
Kind of makes my point though...because this shows topic consolidation confuses (me) more than it fixes. How is one to know what to classify a thread under? From who's perspective? What if multiple topics are covered.
I guess I prefer the wild west including spam, scam and opinions of all dimensions over a restrictive, white washed, I-Pod world.
Sorry bub, you have it all wrong. When you purchase something from the store (no matter the value or how often) you enter into a purchase agreement with DAZ that basically states you give them x amount of money for product y and they deliver product y to you in a fully working condition and with all the bells and whistles that was promised on the product page. That is it. No more and no less. So what on earth does the amount of money you spend have to do with the website changes? Your purchase agreement does not state that you are buying a guarantee that the store or the forums will be to your liking 100% of the time or that they will be available 100% of the time. So in other words, you have a false sense of entitlement.
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That being said, many people are currently frustrated and we are venting those frustrations in the hopes that it will irritate DAZ enough to speed up the process. We do not however start breaking the rules and crucifying the forum staff because of those frustrations. I have not had one complaint deleted thus far and I'm one of the people complaining the most. But it's done in good spirit and within the rules. The forum staff is probably just as frustrated by now so nothing is achieved by making it harder for them. Follow the rules and behave and you won't find your posts in the dustbin. If you do find them deleted please keep in mind it has nothing to do with how much money you spend in the store. The moderators wouldn't even know or care about that when evaluating a post.
There has been next to no removing. We are letting people vent their frustrations. We know it is a stressful time.
I have to agree with some of the OP however the Mods here are in the same boat as all of us and unfortunately have the brunt of complaints here on the forum with just about the same info that we have. It's obvious at this point that the situation is messed up and will take time for all of us to get over. I'm sure DAZ will learn from this but this is in my experience is the only site that has taken as long to get back up to speed. I used to host my own site along with a forum (no store) and never had a problem like this. That's not to say I know better but a store is a different thing, must be secure and requires more attention.
When the dust finally settles this issue I'm sure will carry on longer and that is quite unfortunate.
RE: So what on earth does the amount of money you spend have to do with the website changes? - It doesn't, that was not my point. My point has nothing to do with DAZ making improvements, it has to do with changing expectations mid-stream. Let me explain it another way as my issue does not surround a single transaction, or agreement.
The reason I shared my stake in the DAZ product, support of its affiliate program and exploration of PA is so that the totality of my position is understood. So that DAZ recognizes that I have swallowed the kool aid and I am rowing the boat. However its frustrating as they keep changing the direction of the stream (various marketing program changes, and consistency in product offering )... and that since investment is substantial, the individual implied and actual contractual obligation should be recognized and treated as such from that perspective.
Ninja teams to gain market consensus... instead how about business round tables and teleconferences?
This aint no $50 game that's broke...to some customers of DAZ it may be as a small business livelihood.
And to a PA it's their livelihood. We support our family on doing content, so we are going through the same stuff everyone else is. In some cases even more. We are hanging in there cause we know it will be fixed. Things don't happen over night like some seem to think.
Wait... Thats what we are doing?
I was just POed and trying to irritate DAZ... I never imagined it could actually have results... cool...
I thought I was being independently annoying... I never thought I was part of a movement!
Cool.
I never get the memos... If there is going to be a riot/revolution could someone please inform/email me beforehand?
Thanks!
Wait... Thats what we are doing?
I was just POed and trying to irritate DAZ... I never imagined it could actually have results... cool...
I thought I was being independently annoying... I never thought I was part of a movement!
Cool.
I never get the memos... If there is going to be a riot/revolution could someone please inform/email me beforehand?
Thanks!
But sadly no amount of complaining makes a persons fingers type faster.
Nope. But lack of complaining will create the idea that we are quite happy with the status quo which might stop the slaves from being whipped day and night to get results. We are sending a message to the overlords. DAZ soon is no longer good enough. We want results! We shall not go quietly into the night! Oh wait, that was another fight. :cheese:
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Salt in the wounded website? Ouch!
Hehe...that too. Humans are weird creatures. No matter how futile it is we will loudly voice our displeasure at every opportunity we get when we are moved out of our comfort zones. Heck, politics depend on that quality. :lol:
....I thought I was being independently annoying... I never thought I was part of a movement!
Cool.....
"Independently"? :gulp: Don't go thinking you got a monopoly on being annoying, some of us pride ourselves on our sarcastic and annoying posts. Heck, there's a whole bunch who actually keep track of their annoying posts. (notice how impersonal "a whole bunch" is) ;-)
To the OP; "this too shall pass". Everyone is frustrated; I would think the folks at DAZ most likely are the most frustrated. I think they sort of count on people spending money in the store... From what I'm seeing, there has been allot less of that lately. ...They'll get it fixed.... "soon" :-) I would think sooner than later, actually, I would think like, last week sometime, but eh - what do I know?
Actually, venting verbally, in type, or however, helps to reduce the stress. Medically, it has been proven to reduce, stress induced hypertension, and raise serotonin (the feel good hormone in the brain).
So, there are benefits to allowing people to do this. However, nuking their posts, esp if done in a rather blunt way just exacerbates the problem.
I'm just saying :exclaim:
We agree completely, which is why we aren't.
Venting made me feel better... but everybody left the room :red:
We all want to vent, but we have to remain professional.
I like this venting priviledges. Its Rare..when all is fixed, venting posts will not be tolerated:) Exploit the system while you can lol.
Pretty much. Though we do allow for venting. We just don't want it to turn into app, site or personal wars with each other. The general vent is more than allowed.
Sooo if venting verbally reduces stress and raises the seratonin level in the brain boy have I got things wrong. I will have to mend my ways, no more bottles of shiraz and I will from now on spend my days abusing the S#%&T out of everybody. Happy days are here again-------- :cheese:
LMAO
one could just start their own forum!
LMAO
LMAO
Which forum do I start my charity thread in? I didn't know we had any charity. I sure do need some. I'm a senior citizen widder woman trying to live on the piddly social security check. This month there is a 5-week wait between checks. I don't have a car, but I put gas in my daughter's car so she will take me around the block once a week. I support her, her good-for-nothing husband, her 2 kids, my 2 dogs, their 2 dogs, our cat, the neighbor's cat, numerous whitewing doves, far too many grackles, 1 couple of cardinals, and a nasty bluejay. Also a squirrel that I can't afford to buy tidy whities for. I also support coffee growers and tobacco farmers. And the jolly green giant in the valley ho ho ho.
Now back to the charity. I don't want no gift certificates or coupons or vouchers. They might not work. Just send me some real cash money. Mr. DAZ, I sure do want to thank you for this opportunity to get me some charity.
Which forum do I start my charity thread in? I didn't know we had any charity. I sure do need some. I'm a senior citizen widder woman trying to live on the piddly social security check. This month there is a 5-week wait between checks. I don't have a car, but I put gas in my daughter's car so she will take me around the block once a week. I support her, her good-for-nothing husband, her 2 kids, my 2 dogs, their 2 dogs, our cat, the neighbor's cat, numerous whitewing doves, far too many grackles, 1 couple of cardinals, and a nasty bluejay. Also a squirrel that I can't afford to buy tidy whities for. I also support coffee growers and tobacco farmers. And the jolly green giant in the valley ho ho ho.
Now back to the charity. I don't want no gift certificates or coupons or vouchers. They might not work. Just send me some real cash money. Mr. DAZ, I sure do want to thank you for this opportunity to get me some charity.
LMAO
Is venting like wearing mesh underwear?? *runs to put on mesh underwear* Oooo, I like venting! :P
RE: mesh underwear - Well its certainly easier on the laundry, although sure hate to be the seat. :sick:
Ah, but then others would be venting over the forum issues and the new forum proprietor would be the vented-upon. Though a team of mods could, of course, be recruited.