Can I paint across seams with Hexagon?

Oso3D

Been poking at Substance painter and it's big limitation is that it doesn't have a way to touch up effects that cross seams between materials mapped differently. Carrara can, but the tools are really limited.

Hexagon paint and displacement paint tools look good (I haven't really delved into Hexagon too much), but before I bother, well... does it? :)

 

Morkonan

Yes and no. It can, but it's not really "clean" where that's concerned. And, there's a HUGE limitation, there - The resolution of textures applied to brushes can NOT be resized. IOW - You can create a custom texture/pattern in a paint program, save it out as an image, and then apply it using Hex. But, you can't resize it. So, if you don't want it at that resolution, you have to go and create another at the desired resolution. Basically, it's a "paint from locked image map" process.

ie: You have a bumpy texture you want to use to paint a bump map. But, you'd like it a bit finer. You can't "shrink it down" so it's smaller using Hex - You have to do it yourself in an applicable app.

I've limited experience using Hex for its painting, since it was so difficult to get working properly on my last machine. Now, it's a bit better, and I've experimented with it a bit. I have seen some issues with painting across seams, though. But, I haven't deeply explored techniques/fixes for that in Hex.

When you say "mapped differently" in regards to Substance Painter, do you mean using a different projection or just across material groups that aren't adjacent on the UVMap? I'm about to grab Substance Painter (And, perhaps, Substance Designer) and painting across seams, with all the tools and tweaks necessary to make that viable, is a big concern for me.

Oso3D

Specific example, Genesis/Genesis 2. Substance Painter will not cross seams between difference surfaces, like Lips to Face. But you can use geo editor in Daz Studio (or elsewhere) to consolidate all limb stuff into one surface, then do the same for torso and face. (Face/Nostrils/Lips - > Face, Torso/Nipples/Hips/Neck/Head -> Torso, etc)

But since you can't consolidate face and head (at least not with any standard UV map), you absolutely cannot paint across the seam.

Best bet is using a set of procedurally generated layers and then very carefully painting up to the seam with the mask. Meh

 

Morkonan

timmins.william said:

Specific example, Genesis/Genesis 2. Substance Painter will not cross seams between difference surfaces, like Lips to Face. But you can use geo editor in Daz Studio (or elsewhere) to consolidate all limb stuff into one surface, then do the same for torso and face. (Face/Nostrils/Lips - > Face, Torso/Nipples/Hips/Neck/Head -> Torso, etc)

But since you can't consolidate face and head (at least not with any standard UV map), you absolutely cannot paint across the seam.

Best bet is using a set of procedurally generated layers and then very carefully painting up to the seam with the mask. Meh

 

 

Ah! So, you're saying it has difficulties with "multi-mapped" or "layered" UVMaps? Or, is it an issue with translating the space relationships of multiple maps?

Are the resolutions of the mapped areas exactly the same? (ie: Share the same relative space mapping?) ie: Have the differeing material zones been "resized" to p[rovide for more relative detail in one material zone than another?

If so, that's not, necessarily, a problem with Substance Painter. It's only "doing its job" at painting across the seams exactly as you're telling it to do. However, if the material zones have different UVMap spacial resolution, then that is a mapping issue you have to take into account.

A multimapped/layered map object: V4 head - http://i.imgur.com/MLQDeOK.png

See the "yellow" bits? Those are the eyelash maps. Why are they so large? So that really detailed transmaps can be created. There's a big "baby blue" section running across this multi-map at a -45 deg slant, from left to right. That's the "tear" mat. Why is it so big? I have no friggin idea... :)

So, I assume that Substance Painter has no real issue with multimapped/layered/stacked mapped objects. I'm guessing that if that is the case, what you might be experiencing is that some of the material maps cover a different amount of relative space in the uvmap and that Substance Painter, since it can't be expected to dynamically interpret that for every face, is simply doing exactly what you are telling it to do.

Can you post a pic of the figure's UVMap for the materials you're covering? I don't have Gen2, so I can't look at it for myself.

 

Edit-Add: Dynamic Materials, however, see things a bit differently and can be created to very much rely on the UVMap. So, dynamic materials may, in some way, be able to accurately reproduce themselves across differently proportioned UVmaps/Mats.

Morkonan

PS - Adding a separate post in case you're already responding to the above.

Since I'm going to be buying the Substance pack, I'm going to look into this multi-map stuff to see what I can find out. Will report with any intel as soon as it becomes available. :)

 

Found some intel!

https://forum.allegorithmic.com/index.php?topic=1862.0

Still continuing to pursue.

And... this vid:

Morkonan

OK, if this is an issue you're encountering with a multimapped/layered UVMap object, here's a solution offered by Sickleyield: http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/84081/how-to-use-models-texture-templates-from-ds-in-substance-painter

"    In my admittedly limited experience so far (just bought the program this year, am loving it), you can paint a multi-map model, but only if the different UV tiles are on separate material zones.  I edit mat zones in Blender before importing into Substance Painter now to ensure this works."

So, basically, make sure that each material that has its own UVMap on the same object has been set up as its own material zone. I don't know how G2 is set up, but you should be able to just edit the base object in Blender or Hex to be sure each map layer is, indeed, it's own mat zone.

As long as you don't actually change the UVMap or edit it, whatever textures you paint should work fine and should export correctly from Substance Painter. (PS - Still examining this, but you may want to also look at 3DCoat, which I'll probably purchase as well, due to some features it has that SP does not.)

Note for Hex: Doublecheck your finished, remapped, object, for spurious/empty material zones. Either reload it by itself in Hex and correct any export issues with "bad mat zone information" or use something like UVMapper to check it. In my experience, Hexagon can get a bit buggy when exporting objects and it won't always export mat zones entirely correctly, as they appear in the mapper.

 

Oso3D

I'm done with cgi, but that link doesn't really help, FYI.

 

Morkonan

Oh well, sorry I couldn't be of more assistance. Be well! :)