Loading...
> >

iRadiance - HDR Mesh Lights Volume 2 for Iray

TooncesToonces Posts: 919
in The Commons

How are these HDR Mesh Lights different from ghost lights?

I thought HDRs were just used in render settings in the 'environment map' property, i.e., light that comes from the Dome itself. I thought mesh lighting was light from an emissive object.

So you see my confusion...how is it possible to have both on the same lighting source? Are these iradiance lights physical skydomes with the HDR image mapped to them somehow? Or are they tangible smaller objects like ghost lights you can move and position in the scene?

«1

Comments

  • Kevin SandersonKevin Sanderson Posts: 1,643

    They are not ghost lights. They work as HDRs because they are. Imagine an HDR that's of a lighting setup or rig instead of an outdoor sky.

  • TooncesToonces Posts: 919

    Yeh, but traditional HDRs only apply to the dome (or so I thought). They can be tricky to use indoors unless you hide walls.

    The HDRs in this product are described as:' mesh light panels'. Normal HDRs, you set draw dome off to hide it and just get the lighting. For this product 'This set also comes with a preset that will turn any of the mesh lights "invisible" while retaining their lighting.'

    So it makes me think this product has moveable square panels like ghost lights...physical squares you move around and turn invisible. That would be pretty cool (easier to use indoors), but I'm not sure if that's what it really is. 

  • greymouser69greymouser69 Posts: 501

    I'm with @toonces in that typically "mesh lights" are emissive surfaces and directional while HDRs are global 360 degree illumination so this does seem quite confusing.

  • Serene NightSerene Night Posts: 17,672

    I don't own this but some sets load an hdr and standard lights too could that be the case here?

  • greymouser69greymouser69 Posts: 501

    Well I did some digging and I do have https://www.daz3d.com/iradiance-pro-series-16k-hdris-photo-studio-for-iray which says it includes "4 HDRI mesh lights" so I guess I will have to poke around and see.  Now https://www.daz3d.com/iradiance-studio-hdris-volume-2-for-iray says it includes "20 HDRI spherical mesh lights" to provide 360 degree additive lighting which makes sense to me.

  • Kevin SandersonKevin Sanderson Posts: 1,643

    I was confused. He also has a product which is 360 degree studio HDRIs here: https://www.daz3d.com/iradiance-studio-hdris-for-iray

     

    This is his 1st set of HDR Mesh Lights here: https://www.daz3d.com/iradiance-hdr-mesh-lights-for-iray  It gives you a better description.

    SickleYield explains it a little here: http://sickleyield.deviantart.com/journal/Mind-Blowing-Mesh-Light-Tip-For-Iray-554018547

  • TooncesToonces Posts: 919

    Ah yes, the first version does have pictures of the 'panels':

    https://www.daz3d.com/iradiance-hdr-mesh-lights-for-iray

    So I'm concluding this is the same as 'ghost lights' -- the difference being that iradiance has hdr patterns on the panels which can cause more interesting reflections, whereas ghost lights are squares of color.

    I love ghost lights and use them all the time...so I'm adding these to my wishlist.

    But it would've been helpful if the author included some pictures of the panels themselves. The video seems to be a canned/generic video that's on many of his light sets.

  • NovicaNovica Posts: 23,905
    edited May 2017

    There was a thread about that .001 (note not .01) trick not working in 4.9, I'm looking but can't find the darned thing. It was probably half a year ago. Has anyone tried it in 4.9?  (aka, the mesh lights didn't transmit.)

    Post edited by Novica on
  • TooncesToonces Posts: 919
    Novica said:

    There was a thread about that .001 (note not .01) trick not working in 4.9, I'm looking but can't find the darned thing. It was probably half a year ago. Has anyone tried it in 4.9?  (aka, the mesh lights didn't transmit.)

    It works in 4.9. Basically it's how ghost lights product operates.

    In the surfaces tab for the panel, I can see 'cutout opacity' set to 0.0000001. The panel is invisible but the light works great.

  • DimensionTheoryDimensionTheory Posts: 434

    Ths HDR mesh light products are light panels and not 360 degree maps.  HDRIs describe the amount of color / lighting information in the image rather than the type of image it is (the spherical HDRIs I do are only called "HDRIs" and not "skydomes" because they contain lighting information).  Using HDRIs for mesh light panels allow them to produce more lighting information, mostly pertaining to the shape and intensity of the lights, which makes them much better for reflections and realistic shadows.  You can essentailly capture the lighting information of real world light sources and use them in render as a texture.

    There's a Youtube video on the product page that describes the benefits of HDR as an image format in various situations, at 1:44 there's a section that explains what they can add to mesh light panels which is what these sets are based around.

    These presets are different from ghost light products in that they aren't exactly intented to be used as invisible light sources, they just have the option for it in case it is needed.  By default you will be able to see the panels in your scene.  Once you turn them invisible you will lose their reflections on any specular surfaces in your scene, because objects need to be visible to be reflected there's no way for "ghost lights" to show up in reflections.  Since one of the major selling points of HDR in these products ius improved reflection detail it's suggested that you leave them visible if possible.

  • TooncesToonces Posts: 919

    Ah, well that makes sense.

    Thanks for the explanation! I want them now. :)

  • dragotxdragotx Posts: 1,138

    Thanks for the explanation DimensionTheory, that just added them to my must buy list when I get paid friday.  Friday is going to be expensive for me 

  • BruganBrugan Posts: 365

    I own Volume 1 and they are excellent. To be honest, I love all of DTs lighting solutions, I wish I had known about them sooner.

  • BruganBrugan Posts: 365

    @DimensionTheory will the "Hide" feature in Vol2 work on the lights from Vol1?

    I have figured out how to put the HDRs from Vol1 on the Ghost Light kit but it's very time consuming and the results are mixed. Would be nice to have a one-click solution for Vol1 :)

  • DimensionTheoryDimensionTheory Posts: 434

    Thank you, Brugan!  I'm glad to hear that you like my light sets.  The preset for turning the panels invisible will indeed work on the mesh lights from Volume 1, it should work on any and all mesh lights actually.  If the light emissive part of the model is it's own surface that is...  I imagine it will turn things invisible that shouldn't be if you apply it to something like a sci-fi wall that has lights texture mapped onto it.

  • TaozTaoz Posts: 9,973
    edited May 2017
    Novica said:

    There was a thread about that .001 (note not .01) trick not working in 4.9, I'm looking but can't find the darned thing. It was probably half a year ago. Has anyone tried it in 4.9?  (aka, the mesh lights didn't transmit.)

    The Iray Ghost Light Kit works fine in 4.9.3.166, with Cutout Opacity set to full 0.  

    Well apparently that's not correct - you just can't see the setting, which is <?> if you select the whole light. But the subnodes for the Arrow and the Light are both set to full 0.

    Post edited by Taoz on
  • TooncesToonces Posts: 919
    Taozen said:
    Novica said:
    Well apparently that's not correct - you just can't see the setting, which is <?> if you select the whole light. But the subnodes for the Arrow and the Light are both set to full 0.

    Hmm, not for me. The arrow is full 0 and the light is 0.0000001.

  • supernoobsupernoob Posts: 154
    edited May 2017

    Question about the promo images for you DimensionTheory

    Which female character is it that you've used in the middle four images? Is it one that's available in the store (or another store), or is a custom one that you've created?
    I'd like to replicate this character so any light you can shed on this would be greatly appreciated (haha, light, funny me, ahem).

    Could I also ask which hair she has too please?

    sorry if i'm not supposed to ask this in here

    Post edited by supernoob on
  • DimensionTheoryDimensionTheory Posts: 434

    You're welcome to ask for any info you want, Supernoob.  No worries!

     

    That character's texture is Claudia for Eva 7 and I believe her morph is a blend between the ones that comes with the Claudia product and Olympia 7.  I can get you specifics a little later after my render finishes and I can open the scene I used.

    https://www.daz3d.com/gdn-claudia-for-eva-7

     

    The hair is Galene with some edits (texture etc) I did personally

    https://www.daz3d.com/galene-hair-for-genesis-3-female-s

  • DimensionTheoryDimensionTheory Posts: 434

    The character morph actually appears to just be the Claudia character per default from the product I linked to :P

  • TaozTaoz Posts: 9,973
    Toonces said:
    Taozen said:
    Novica said:
    Well apparently that's not correct - you just can't see the setting, which is <?> if you select the whole light. But the subnodes for the Arrow and the Light are both set to full 0.

    Hmm, not for me. The arrow is full 0 and the light is 0.0000001.

    OK, apparently you have to mouse over the value to activate the tooltip to see that. The box only says 0.0000. 

  • BruganBrugan Posts: 365
    DimensionTheory said:

    Thank you, Brugan!  I'm glad to hear that you like my light sets.  The preset for turning the panels invisible will indeed work on the mesh lights from Volume 1, it should work on any and all mesh lights actually.  If the light emissive part of the model is it's own surface that is...  I imagine it will turn things invisible that shouldn't be if you apply it to something like a sci-fi wall that has lights texture mapped onto it.

    Thanks for the response DT!

  • supernoobsupernoob Posts: 154
    DimensionTheory said:

    You're welcome to ask for any info you want, Supernoob.  No worries!

    DimensionTheory said:

    The character morph actually appears to just be the Claudia character per default from the product I linked to :P

     

    That's perfect, I would never have worked that out on my own, thank you so much DT.

    Going to buy myself some mesh lights now :)

     

  • ScavengerScavenger Posts: 2,674

    I;m gonna really need to sit down and watch your videos, DT...maybe I'll get a handle on what I'm doing.

    (spent a ridiculous amount of time fighting with the daz original Inside Hdri's tongiht :(

  • supernoobsupernoob Posts: 154
    edited May 2017

    Worked it out now - would delete this post but i don't know how

    Post edited by supernoob on
  • GeffeGeffe Posts: 63

    Since the 4.20 update the lights in this product are crazy bright. It seems to be something to do with the image in the luminance setting. Both of the pics attached are done with the environment set to scene only lighting, so the mesh light is the only light source. Even with the luminance turned right down to 1 (second pic) the light is still very bright.

    ss02.jpg
    1920 x 1080 - 341K
    ss03.jpg
    1920 x 1080 - 366K
  • DimensionTheoryDimensionTheory Posts: 434
    edited March 2022

    Geffe said:

    Since the 4.20 update the lights in this product are crazy bright. It seems to be something to do with the image in the luminance setting. Both of the pics attached are done with the environment set to scene only lighting, so the mesh light is the only light source. Even with the luminance turned right down to 1 (second pic) the light is still very bright.

    There is currently a product update going through QA that will fix this issue.  Iray had a recent change that modified the qay HDR textures work in opacity, so brightness values were getting multiplied by like 1000x.

    The update just uses LDR JPG textures for opacity (slightly more memory consumption due to two textures being used per light).  If you want to use the lights now you can convert the HDR maps to 8-bit and plug them into opacity, otherwise the update should be coming soon.

    Post edited by DimensionTheory on
  • barbultbarbult Posts: 24,773
    But wait a minute. If you convert all these to 8 bit JPEG, they aren't HDR anymore. They are exactly the LDR that you say is not as good, aren't they?
  • UthgardUthgard Posts: 866

    I think what they are saying is that they will use LDR for opacity and HDR for luminance (thus the increased memory consumption).

  • barbultbarbult Posts: 24,773

    Uthgard said:

    I think what they are saying is that they will use LDR for opacity and HDR for luminance (thus the increased memory consumption).

    Thank you for the explanation.

Sign In or Register to comment.