ZBrush, Why Bother?

2

Comments

  • TaozTaoz Posts: 9,979
    ebergerly said:

    Just to give you a brief sample of the ZBrush insanity...

    In a 3D modelling application, what do you think a "tool" is? 

    Something that performs a function on an object that you're modelling, right?

    Wrong. A tool is the object you're modelling in ZBrush. 

    Incredible. 

    I wonder what logic (or lack of same) that is behind that choice. Maybe they're just bad at english and haven't discovered the error yet...

     

  • InkuboInkubo Posts: 745
    edited July 2017

    Let me ask if ZBrush Core might help me. I'm learning Carrara and Blender at the same time, but I suspect with the new realtime PBR rendering engine coming in Blender, I'm gonna want to use my DAZ content there realsoonnow.

    Currently the export options from DAZ Studio all seem hobbled in some way: you can export as OBJ for a high-quality mesh or FBX for rigging and animations, but as far as I can tell there is no export that gives both at the same time.

    So I'm wondering if it's possible to export to OBJ and weld all geografts to make one "best" model, then import that into Blender and do my own rigging for animation. I suspect that if I merge the model's parts in Blender, the UVs--and therefore the textures--will be lost.

    Could ZBrush be used to take the parts of a model and put them together as one, keeping the old UVs or transferring the textures to new UVs?

    Post edited by Inkubo on
  • dreamfarmerdreamfarmer Posts: 2,128

    I don't think ZbrushCore will serve your needs, since it scoffs at the idea of UVs, or indeed the idea that you might want to paint your from-clay model in some way allowing you to generate any map. 

    Dunno about Zbrush morethanCore.

  • Taoz said:
    ebergerly said:

    Just to give you a brief sample of the ZBrush insanity...

    In a 3D modelling application, what do you think a "tool" is? 

    Something that performs a function on an object that you're modelling, right?

    Wrong. A tool is the object you're modelling in ZBrush. 

    Incredible. 

    I wonder what logic (or lack of same) that is behind that choice. Maybe they're just bad at english and haven't discovered the error yet...

     

    I don't think it's an error; it's a matter of how you choose to view things. I suspect that at least some of the developers came from a painting artist background since the "tools" used to sculpt an object are called brushes. You also overlook the fact that the object isn't limited to being a sculpted model for a game or program like DS; it can also be the basis of a new brush for zBrush.

  • Fixme12Fixme12 Posts: 589

    If there where more Zbrush vs Dazstudio tutorials in dazshop, people would like to see that zbrush is more fun.
    Almost anything great is done with Zbrush/3dcoat these days and no more only box/polymodeling like hexagon,silo,wings3d

  • Fixme12 said:

    If there where more Zbrush vs Dazstudio tutorials in dazshop, people would like to see that zbrush is more fun.
    Almost anything great is done with Zbrush/3dcoat these days and no more only box/polymodeling like hexagon,silo,wings3d

    Most of the folks doing such tutorials aren't interested in selling them; they tend to post them for free viewing on YouTube, usually. They even let you see it when zBrush or DAZ Studio mess up for some reason and show how to deal with that.

  • marblemarble Posts: 7,500

    From my limited and amateurish experience, I find Blender meets my needs so far. I had access to ZBrush for a while a few years ago and loved the convenience of GoZ but, like others, I found that understanding the interface beyond the simplest of sculpting tasks was beyond me. Blender's interface is daunting but, again, if I stick to the task at hand and don't try to figure out the rest of what it can do, I get by. Sculpting is very similar to ZBrush and I found that if I combined what's available in Sculpt mode with proportional edit in Edit mode, I can do most of what I need to do. There's always a tutorial for every aspect of Blender.

    I tried 3DCoat for a month on trial but had problems with import/export of objects (I could find very few tutorials on working with DAZ Studio). Otherwise, I realised that the emphasis is on Voxel modelling from scratch rather than importing objects to make morphs. There is a "Surface Mode" which is similar to sculpting as I understand it but I didn't think the tools were much of an improvement over Blender, so why pay? 

    If money was not in short supply, I would buy ZBrush and make an effort to learn it. But I can't afford the price and ZBrush Core is missing so many features (including GoZ) that Blender is still a better option for me. 

  • zombietaggerungzombietaggerung Posts: 3,760

    I would recommend downloading a free trial of every 3d modeling program you can find. They all have different UIs and they all have steep learning curves. What works for one may be the most confusing thing in the world to another. I tried ZBrush a few years ago and it was the most unintuitive, confusing thing I've every attempted. On the other hand I started with Blender last year and it makes perfect sense to me. So try them all and see what works for you.

  • TaozTaoz Posts: 9,979
    Taoz said:
    ebergerly said:

    Just to give you a brief sample of the ZBrush insanity...

    In a 3D modelling application, what do you think a "tool" is? 

    Something that performs a function on an object that you're modelling, right?

    Wrong. A tool is the object you're modelling in ZBrush. 

    Incredible. 

    I wonder what logic (or lack of same) that is behind that choice. Maybe they're just bad at english and haven't discovered the error yet...

     

    I don't think it's an error; it's a matter of how you choose to view things. I suspect that at least some of the developers came from a painting artist background since the "tools" used to sculpt an object are called brushes. You also overlook the fact that the object isn't limited to being a sculpted model for a game or program like DS; it can also be the basis of a new brush for zBrush.

    Well I was just joking about the english. But still, IMO calling a 3D object a tool just because it can be used as a brush is like calling humans food just because they can be eaten (unless you're a cannibal or a lion perhaps).

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,599

    I think its a tool simply as it can be used in the sculpt which is the actual job.

    I personally think part or component  may have been less confusing but it really is based on the concept you are sculpting something new not modifying and any objects you import are just starting points to do so, 

  • sapatsapat Posts: 1,735

    Every single one of my successful morph sets (the most successful being Faces of Asia) was made in Blender. ;)  Blender's Proportional Edit tool in Connected mode is a morpher's best friend, and with morph targets (which Blender calls shape keys) you can create multiple morphs on a figure and only dial them back on to export them.

    Here's a tutorial on loading the morph once you've got it made:

     

    That was a super helpful video, thanks so much!! 

  • TaozTaoz Posts: 9,979
    th3Digit said:

    I think its a tool simply as it can be used in the sculpt which is the actual job.

    I personally think part or component  may have been less confusing but it really is based on the concept you are sculpting something new not modifying and any objects you import are just starting points to do so, 

    You could call it a tool if you use it as a brush or whatever since a brush is a tool, but in a context where it is the main object (the thing you are creating) which it probably is in most cases "tool" makes no sense IMO. "Sculpture" would have been a better term here.

     

     

     

  • jaxprogjaxprog Posts: 312

    I don't think ZbrushCore will serve your needs, since it scoffs at the idea of UVs, or indeed the idea that you might want to paint your from-clay model in some way allowing you to generate any map. 

    Dunno about Zbrush morethanCore.

    In zBruish you can polypaint the model without a UV and then UV after polypainting. You can even polypaint and sculpt at the sametime if task calls for it.

    My personally I am zBrush man. Love the tool and I had no problem paying the price for it, espically when you get free updates with new features. Excellent tool. I also like Daz's easy to use and simple apparoch Hexagon product.

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,748

    Is there a way to make ZBrush remember your settings? Like EVERY TIME I enter Zbrush to do a new morph I have start a new document (the starting one is always too small), dismiss the Light Box window, activate the Edit option, go to Transform >> Activate Symmetry, etc. ...Every Single Time. Is there a way to save it so that when ZBrush loads up it remembers your settings so I don't have to do all that every time ZBrush loads?

  • AllenArtAllenArt Posts: 7,172

    The personal version of 3D Coat is only around a hundred bucks. It does most of the stuff Zbrush does and also does painting and has a great uv mapper.

    Laurie

  • Zev0Zev0 Posts: 7,098
    edited July 2017

    Why Bother? GOZ! Apart from the fact that Zbrush is an amazing Sculpting app, sending morphs back to Daz dynamically is crucial to my workflow. I can test dial on the spot, and send back to zbrush if anything needs an update. I can get things done and verified twice as fast.

    Post edited by Zev0 on
  • Is there a way to make ZBrush remember your settings? Like EVERY TIME I enter Zbrush to do a new morph I have start a new document (the starting one is always too small), dismiss the Light Box window, activate the Edit option, go to Transform >> Activate Symmetry, etc. ...Every Single Time. Is there a way to save it so that when ZBrush loads up it remembers your settings so I don't have to do all that every time ZBrush loads?

    For most of this I use the following keyboard shortcuts: T (Edit mode) F (Full size; this makes the tool fill the document area) X (Symmetry on). These will be saved if you save a project. I'm not sure if they can be saved a startup defaults though. And I don't think there is a way to stop the Lightbox from opening up as its actually how many folks start projects from within zBrush.

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,748

    Is there a way to make ZBrush remember your settings? Like EVERY TIME I enter Zbrush to do a new morph I have start a new document (the starting one is always too small), dismiss the Light Box window, activate the Edit option, go to Transform >> Activate Symmetry, etc. ...Every Single Time. Is there a way to save it so that when ZBrush loads up it remembers your settings so I don't have to do all that every time ZBrush loads?

    For most of this I use the following keyboard shortcuts: T (Edit mode) F (Full size; this makes the tool fill the document area) X (Symmetry on). These will be saved if you save a project. I'm not sure if they can be saved a startup defaults though. And I don't think there is a way to stop the Lightbox from opening up as its actually how many folks start projects from within zBrush.

    Those short cuts will help. Thanks, daywalker03. :)

  • RKane_1RKane_1 Posts: 3,037
    Taoz said:
    ebergerly said:

    Just to give you a brief sample of the ZBrush insanity...

    In a 3D modelling application, what do you think a "tool" is?

    Something that performs a function on an object that you're modelling, right?

    Wrong. A tool is the object you're modelling in ZBrush.

    Incredible.

    I wonder what logic (or lack of same) that is behind that choice. Maybe they're just bad at english and haven't discovered the error yet...

     

    It's a tool because you can paint with the objects themselves. It is a little confusing when you start but makes sense.

  • RKane_1RKane_1 Posts: 3,037
    edited July 2017

    Is there a way to make ZBrush remember your settings? Like EVERY TIME I enter Zbrush to do a new morph I have start a new document (the starting one is always too small), dismiss the Light Box window, activate the Edit option, go to Transform >> Activate Symmetry, etc. ...Every Single Time. Is there a way to save it so that when ZBrush loads up it remembers your settings so I don't have to do all that every time ZBrush loads?

    Uncheck “Preferences->Lightbox->Open at Launch” to get rid of the pesky Lightbox:)

     

    If it comes back, do it again but also then go to Pref/Config, and hit the "Store Config" button...

    Post edited by RKane_1 on
  • erik_nlerik_nl Posts: 6
    edited July 2017

    Pixologic has a couple of new, non-default-included plugins for R8, and one of them is 'StartupMaster'.

    Here are some useful URL's (scroll way down on the page with the first one):

    https://pixologic.com/zbrush/downloadcenter/zplugins/

    http://pixologic01.com/zplugins/ZStartupMaster_v4.0_Install.zip

    and a Pixologic tutorial on how to use it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpJ4RoyEBQM

    I think it will be VERY welcome for most, if not all ZBrush users : )

    Post edited by erik_nl on
  • RKane_1RKane_1 Posts: 3,037
    erik_nl said:

    Pixologic has a couple of new, non-default-included plugins for R8, and one of them is 'StartupMaster'.

    Here are some useful URL's (scroll way down on the page with the first one):

    https://pixologic.com/zbrush/downloadcenter/zplugins/

    http://pixologic01.com/zplugins/ZStartupMaster_v4.0_Install.zip

    and a Pixologic tutorial on how to use it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpJ4RoyEBQM

    I think it will be VERY welcome for most, if not all ZBrush users : )

    COOL! Good to know! :)

  • RKane_1 said:
    erik_nl said:

    Pixologic has a couple of new, non-default-included plugins for R8, and one of them is 'StartupMaster'.

    Here are some useful URL's (scroll way down on the page with the first one):

    https://pixologic.com/zbrush/downloadcenter/zplugins/

    http://pixologic01.com/zplugins/ZStartupMaster_v4.0_Install.zip

    and a Pixologic tutorial on how to use it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpJ4RoyEBQM

    I think it will be VERY welcome for most, if not all ZBrush users : )

    COOL! Good to know! :)

    Better than good, as it even remembers the settings of the brush you were using, if you tell it to save the last used brush.

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,748
    RKane_1 said:

    Is there a way to make ZBrush remember your settings? Like EVERY TIME I enter Zbrush to do a new morph I have start a new document (the starting one is always too small), dismiss the Light Box window, activate the Edit option, go to Transform >> Activate Symmetry, etc. ...Every Single Time. Is there a way to save it so that when ZBrush loads up it remembers your settings so I don't have to do all that every time ZBrush loads?

    Uncheck “Preferences->Lightbox->Open at Launch” to get rid of the pesky Lightbox:)

     

    If it comes back, do it again but also then go to Pref/Config, and hit the "Store Config" button...

    That works! Thank you! The light box popping up every time was getting annoying considering how often I start ZBrush these days. Now it's gone! yay!

  • RKane_1 said:

    Is there a way to make ZBrush remember your settings? Like EVERY TIME I enter Zbrush to do a new morph I have start a new document (the starting one is always too small), dismiss the Light Box window, activate the Edit option, go to Transform >> Activate Symmetry, etc. ...Every Single Time. Is there a way to save it so that when ZBrush loads up it remembers your settings so I don't have to do all that every time ZBrush loads?

    Uncheck “Preferences->Lightbox->Open at Launch” to get rid of the pesky Lightbox:)

     

    If it comes back, do it again but also then go to Pref/Config, and hit the "Store Config" button...

    That works! Thank you! The light box popping up every time was getting annoying considering how often I start ZBrush these days. Now it's gone! yay!

    ZStartupMaster seems to repress the Lightbox as well.

  • RKane_1RKane_1 Posts: 3,037
    RKane_1 said:

    Is there a way to make ZBrush remember your settings? Like EVERY TIME I enter Zbrush to do a new morph I have start a new document (the starting one is always too small), dismiss the Light Box window, activate the Edit option, go to Transform >> Activate Symmetry, etc. ...Every Single Time. Is there a way to save it so that when ZBrush loads up it remembers your settings so I don't have to do all that every time ZBrush loads?

    Uncheck “Preferences->Lightbox->Open at Launch” to get rid of the pesky Lightbox:)

     

    If it comes back, do it again but also then go to Pref/Config, and hit the "Store Config" button...

    That works! Thank you! The light box popping up every time was getting annoying considering how often I start ZBrush these days. Now it's gone! yay!

    No worries! :) Glad I could help. That ZStartupMaster plug in tho. WOW! SUPERAWESOME! Love it. Thanks to erik_nl for pointing it out! I also found a slew of free utilities to go with it! Between the free plugins, free upgrades, incredible community and SLEW of great tutorials out there for ZBrush, it is truly worth every penny, at least for me. :)

  • HorusRaHorusRa Posts: 1,664
    edited August 2017

    -

     

    Post edited by HorusRa on
  • billipock7483billipock7483 Posts: 0
    edited January 2018

    Blender is the spawn of nightmares. But I've found ZbrushCore really friendly. Yeah, they call models tools, but whatever. I'm hoping I use it enough that I can justify an upgrade to straight-up Zbrush and get all that retoplogical/UVunwrapping goodness.

    (And meanwhile, I can import models into ZbrushCore, adjust them/create morphs and export them back into Daz again and it's much much much more straightforward than Blender or even Hexagon. Just really intuitive and straightforward.

     

    Do you know of a tutorial that will show me how to import to zbrushcore then back to daz?

    Post edited by Chohole on
  • PadonePadone Posts: 3,804
    edited January 2018

    Blender is free and has sculpting tools. How about a Go B plugin for when you're cheesy and you know it?

    It seems to me there's to be done a distinction here between morphing and sculping. They're two very different things and serve different purposes.

    Morphing is for the overall character volume and appearence. Technically it moves vertices on the mesh to achieve a different shape. For this you don't need sculpting tools such as Zbrush but just any modeler that can move vertices with a falloff. For example Hexagon can do it fine.

    Sculpting is for adding details to the mesh itself. Such as folds and wrinkles or thin textures that would be unpractical to do with real geometry. You paint over the mesh and you don't add new geometry. That's done with Zbrush and the alikes. Technically the sculpting session is converted to a displacement map that's applied to the geometry. DAZ Studio uses proprietary HD morphs that's the same as displacement maps. Then, since Iray doesn't feature micro-displacement you have to crank-up subdivision to give the model enough geometry to apply the HD morphs to.

    That said, Blender can be used both for morphing and sculpting. In my opinion Blender is only weak in retopology. That's where Zbrush is much better. But retopology is not needed for DAZ characters since you have to use the character base mesh itself and you can't change it.

    Post edited by Padone on
  • polmearpolmear Posts: 33
     

    Funny I have had Blender installed on my PC for the last few years, current versions. And every few months I get reminded about how much it can do so i fire it up and see if I can figure it out finally. Several hours later I am off to another app as fast as possible before I lose my sanity, LOL. I keep thinking one day it will click, like it did with Maya, which took me about 6 months to finally get it. 3DSMax came very easy since I used it's little brother Gmax for years before and the UI is almost the same.

    I bought the Blender Foundations book for version 2.something which goes through the whole program, more or less. That was how I got to grips with Blender. Sometimes it's best to have a manual to hand.

Sign In or Register to comment.