Daz to Maya question

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  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    edited February 2018

    More thoughts about rigging a Daz figure:

    Why is there a need to use a rigging script like Advanced Skeleton?  The first step in rigging has already been done for you.   For instance, turn off the HIK on your figure in Maya and what do you have?  You have a beautifully weighted figure and an FK skeleton.  Isn't that a perfect start for a rig?  You can manipulate the skeleton by selecting the joints but the next step would be to start adding controls and features.  Maybe there is a script out there that can help us add controls to an already existing joint chain.

    Post edited by drzap on
  • You have a point though. Rigging an already perfect weighted figure is a nightmare . But this is just my personal observation, I love Advanced skeleton and all its features and I've gotten attached to it. HIK is way too generic and yeah I wish there's a script to add more controls to the existing joint chains and don't even get me started with the face setup.... So far, I can achieve the same Daz3D skin material in Maya using Arnold and the hair, I use a GMH to create guilds for Xgen. I have used Advance skeleton to rig couple of models. It took everything from me rigging them honestly but I'd say they seem pretty Okay, Not 100% as Daz but I'm proud with the results. If you ask me, I'll kill for an alternative to Daz3D to Maya, having more CONTROLS for the rig without all the hassle and sleepless nights. I think that is all we want...
  • gavincroutgavincrout Posts: 28
    edited February 2018

    Ok I learned quite a lot just from drzap's comments alone. I learned that it's possible to somewhat recreate Daz Studio's system using blendshapes. All I have to do is create custom rig's for each Genesis base character. Unfortunately, when I release the first Daz Custom Rig's out to the public, it can't be used for commercial use since I'm using the Maya Student Version. At the moment, I'm a broke ass college student lol but as soon as I'm 110% confident with the rigging process, I'll purchase the monthly subscription and make as many Daz rig's (Genesis 3 male and female are first priority) as possible before the deadline. 

    drzap said:
    drzap said:
    drzap said:
    I have 2 questions. Is there a way to keep the facial joints while unbinding the original Daz Joints? It's not mandatory since I'm mainly going to animate via facial blendshapes but as you know, it's always pleasant to have both the blendshapes and joints at your disposal. Last question is about the facial controls for the blendshapes; Say I finish making my facial morph controls for my Daz Rig, could I quickly duplicate the controls and transfer it to another Daz Rig with the same facial morphs? 

    I'm not understanding your first question.  The facial joints are part of the original Daz joints.  If you are talking about my facial rig for G3 characters, those joints are the Daz joints.  I just put controls on them.  So if you unbind the figure, those joints will also be unbound.  Your second question is a very good one.  I can't answer it right now because it is something I am also trying to do.  For now, I just use the same rig for all my characters.  For example, if I set up a facial rig for G3 MeiLin,  when I want to animate another G3F figure, I just apply a blendshape to MeiLin and she becomes the new character.  But I gave you that link to the BraveRabbit website.  They have a wonderful plugin for Maya called SHAPES.  It allows you to transfer blendshape nodes between characters easily.  It is free for non-commercial use, you should check it out.  There are some amazing tools there for blendshape work.  I'm not sure how compatible it is with Advanced Skeleton.  I also once tried to make a custom rig with Advanced Skeleton, but I found it was too rigid and wouldn't play with some other tools I needed to use so I abandoned that idea.  It's good to see someone else giving it a try.

    You're absolutely right about HIK being insufficient for keyframe animation work.  I recently bought this rig on Turbosquid so I can get some experience with a real rig.  I don't plan on doing a lot of keyframe, but I believe I should understand it and master it because even if I am doing a mocap film, I won't be able to get away from keyframing.  Every animator should know how.  Anyways, I can use this rig for all my characters, if I want, by using the method I described above:  retopologize the Daz character to the rig's mesh and apply it as a blendshape.  This is how the game studios do it.  All their characters have the same topology, so no need to bother with making a bunch of rigs and painting all those skinweights.  Just morph a new character directly on the rig. 

    I will be following your Youtube channel and waiting to see what you do.  We can learn from each other.  I have a Deviant Art page that I just use for my own personal notes.  Right now, I just post character renders and dossiers, but you can check in to see how I am progressing.  Soon, I will be rendering my first animation.  I am officially an animatorcool.   Keep us posted and good luck.

    Haha, my apologies if my questions don't make sense. I'm new to Animation and I haven't gotten a chance to study the rigging and modeling process. I started studying 3D art after I graduated High School in 2017 and attended "CG Spectrum". I only have Animation Mentors but I'll soon demand a rigging/scripting mentor so I can attempt to create a DazToMaya Plugin for the community. AND WOW!!! I never thought about utilizing blendshapes like that, your honestly changing the way I approach my goals dude surprise So basically, all I have to do is make ONE custom Daz Rig and I can apply a blendshape and/or blendshape nodes using "SHAPES"? That's IMPECCABLE! Now that I think about it, there's really no need to make a script, I'll just make a custom rig (using the original Genesis 3 base model) and share it with the Daz3D Community. Only downside is that everyone needs to pay for the "SHAPES" plugin but it's definitely worth the cost. 

    Thanks man, you're really inspiring! I'll definitely follow your Deviant Art page. It's really cool to see someone with a similar goal as mine, I plan on making short films using the Daz Models as well. I also attended UNLV for Film so I can learn every aspect like Directing, Lighting, Compositing, Storyboarding etc. As far as rendering goes, I plan on using UE4. You might be thinking "Unreal Engine is only made for games", which is true, but after beta testing this new plugin called "DataSmith" (which converts a Vray Scene and Materials to Unreal Engine's materials system), I'm convinced that UE4 will eventually be a Gold Mine for people making short films. 

    Also, are you using XGen to create your hair? Since I already purchased a lot of Daz's hair products, I tried to figure out the best way to convert the Daz Hair to guides and came across this video https://vimeo.com/162001880   Using Ornatrix, you can make/use mesh strips and convert them into Ornatrix hair, which can also be converted into guides. I love Ornatrix because it's artist-friendly. What I usually do is either align mesh strips to my DazHair, or align curves to my DazHair and convert them into guides.

    Thanks again man, very glad I stumbled upon this thread.

     

    You can try this: http://thundercloud-studio.com/product/gmh2

    Damn, yea that plugin seems better than Ornatrix (regarding Daz Hair). Thanks

    Post edited by gavincrout on
  • drzap said:

    More thoughts about rigging a Daz figure:

    Why is there a need to use a rigging script like Advanced Skeleton?  The first step in rigging has already been done for you.   For instance, turn off the HIK on your figure in Maya and what do you have?  You have a beautifully weighted figure and an FK skeleton.  Isn't that a perfect start for a rig?  You can manipulate the skeleton by selecting the joints but the next step would be to start adding controls and features.  Maybe there is a script out there that can help us add controls to an already existing joint chain.

    I tried looking for an answer, the closest I've ran into was "The Rigging ToolBox", since the plugin was capable of adding controls to an existing weighted figure with an FK skeleton https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5zSZ1JDhV8  I bought the plugin but I still couldn't prevail, but that was 4months ago when I barely knew how to navigate a 3D software. I'll try attempting again

  • drzap said:

    More thoughts about rigging a Daz figure:

    Why is there a need to use a rigging script like Advanced Skeleton?  The first step in rigging has already been done for you.   For instance, turn off the HIK on your figure in Maya and what do you have?  You have a beautifully weighted figure and an FK skeleton.  Isn't that a perfect start for a rig?  You can manipulate the skeleton by selecting the joints but the next step would be to start adding controls and features.  Maybe there is a script out there that can help us add controls to an already existing joint chain.

    Hmmm, this might be great news. "The Rigging ToolBox" might be the answer. I think the main reason why I struggled was because I was using "The Rigging Toolbox 2" instead of the original "The Rigging Toolbox", and the first one seems to be the answer. Man, imagine if this plugin works, we'll quickly get a custom rig while maintaining the facial rig and it's weights! I'll test it out today and keep you guys updated.

  • Unfortunately, when I release the first Daz Custom Rig's out to the public, it can't be used commercially since I'm using the Maya Student Version.

    More to the point, unless these were created from scratch and included no mesh, you would be preveneted from releasing them at all by the Daz EULA.

  • gavincroutgavincrout Posts: 28
    edited February 2018

    Unfortunately, when I release the first Daz Custom Rig's out to the public, it can't be used commercially since I'm using the Maya Student Version.

    More to the point, unless these were created from scratch and included no mesh, you would be preveneted from releasing them at all by the Daz EULA.

    Thanks for forewarning me, I figured it would be allowed since the base Genesis mesh are free. I also meant to say "Commercial Use" not commercially. I made it seem like I wanted profit haha. I'll edit the comment

    Post edited by gavincrout on
  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    edited February 2018
    drzap said:

     

    http://www.scottenglert.com/seuvblendshape/  This is another remarkable blendshape system developed by Scott Englert.  As my skills develop, I want to implement it into my workflow.  My goal is to cross the uncanny valley and this system is designed just for that purpose.  The best thing is that it is free.  <EDIT... I just checked, it's now priced at $20>  You may not be ready for such a sophisticated system yet (I'm not) but you should keep it on your radar if you plan to animate in Maya.  

     

    I made an error in a previous post.  I was raving about a blendshape system by Scott Englert.  I made a mistake.  This is the wrong product.   While seuvblendhape is a good way of making blendshapes from targets with different topologies, it is not the blendshape system I wanted to highlight.

    http://www.stargrav.com/bcs.php  This is the system.  Like I said, it is a little involved and takes getting used to, but I see potential for remarkable results.  Will make you want to forget all about bone rigs altogether.  And it is free.   Just wanted to correct my post.

    Post edited by drzap on
  • Unfortunately, when I release the first Daz Custom Rig's out to the public, it can't be used commercially since I'm using the Maya Student Version.

    More to the point, unless these were created from scratch and included no mesh, you would be preveneted from releasing them at all by the Daz EULA.

    Thanks for forewarning me, I figured it would be allowed since the base Genesis mesh are free. I also meant to say "Commercial Use" not commercially. I made it seem like I wanted profit haha. I'll edit the comment

    They are free to use, but not free to re-distribute. Free beer, but not free speech to invert the Open Source movement motto.

  • Unfortunately, when I release the first Daz Custom Rig's out to the public, it can't be used commercially since I'm using the Maya Student Version.

    More to the point, unless these were created from scratch and included no mesh, you would be preveneted from releasing them at all by the Daz EULA.

    Thanks for forewarning me, I figured it would be allowed since the base Genesis mesh are free. I also meant to say "Commercial Use" not commercially. I made it seem like I wanted profit haha. I'll edit the comment

    They are free to use, but not free to re-distribute. Free beer, but not free speech to invert the Open Source movement motto.

    Okay I definitely understand. Thanks again for letting me know 

  • For the people who were looking to create a custom rig with a Daz Character's, I have great news and bad news (fixable solution though). "The Rigging Toolbox 1" basically adds IK controls to your already weighted Daz Character. I almost have a fully function rig but I'm running into one little problem with the leg's Pole Vectors. If anyone with rigging experience can solve this simple problem, this plugin will be the gateway for animator's who desperately want to animate Daz Character's without using an HIK rig. Also, since it retains the original FK Daz joints, you can still use the HumanIK Rig on the Custom character. As soon as I resolve this Pole Vector problem, I'll make a tutorial from start to finish on how to make a custom rig. The process can be as simple as setting up an Hik rig 

  • Okay I figured everthing out. I'll make an easy tutorial for this asap, but you are required to purchase "The Rigging Toolbox". Here's a snippet of the foot attributes. This custom rig obviously won't be as fancy as a Long Winter Studios rig but it'll get the job done for sure  https://drive.google.com/open?id=1jpkf2-fG0hhUEZSdl77dxVt-oovU9qpO

  • KennethCKennethC Posts: 24
    edited March 2018
    Hey Gavin, where did you find the rigging toolbox 1? I will buy it in s heartbeat. Ive been looking for ways to use Daz figures in maya with better rigging system than HIK for months and had almost given up. But I did find a couple of workarounds that improves HIK to make it more usable. By using auxilar pivots on foot I can do heel roll, ball roll, toeroll , banks..also by using floor contact "on" and turnig IK on for toe, you can make automatic ballroll when foot touches the floor. Using hik also makes it easy to use mocap data ( I use ipisoft for home motion capturing using 6 ps3 cams and 3 move controllers). If you get the animschool picker (free), You can make finger selector to select each joints and also select groups of fingers for easy posing. Using Studio library (also free) you can save finger poses and use them when animating. I also found a way to make a decent facial rig using daz facial blendshspes along with setdriven keys in maya. If you use rig referencing you can make your master facialrig and use different custom rigs again and again with your one master facial rig. What I am trying to do now is to study Rapid Rig Modular and its functionality so that I can create my own DAZ to super rigging system maya script. Script will have facial rig automated as well. I was also looking into making one master rig and using blendshape to deform to different characters since they all have same topology and vertex order, but that wont allow me to freely customize the whole proportion of the characters and dress them up with hair/beard as easy as in daz. I also made a script in maya that converts daz skin textures to ready to render redshift shader in one click. In the end I want to make short films in maya using daz custom characters. Hik (modified for natural toe bend and automatic floor contact)(also forearm twist added to make hand twist distortion free) for extra or background characters and mocap animated characters, and high quality rigged characters for main actors and close up characters with facial rigging. Gavin, since we are both trying to have a better aninating rig for daz imported models in maya, lets keep in touch and help each other out. If we can open the doors for maya aninators to have access to daz's incredible asset library, it would be awesome.
    Post edited by KennethC on
  • Hope somebody can help me with this:

    I have the plugin installed and can export a character from daz with DazToMaya and import it in Maya2018. However I got two problems:

    - When I open HumanIK no character is defined

    - I read through this thread and want to export the JCMs. So I added pJCM export to my Morph Export rules and activated "Maya Helper Scripts". So when I do a normal export from DAZ and import it in Maya I get all the JCMs and with the mel script I can import the constraints/relationships. If I use DAZ to Maya, it doesn't respect the export options I set in the previous manual export. It only exports the gead morphs and that's it. There also no JCM relationsships described in the mel file in DazToMayas temp directory.

    Am I missing a step here?

  • Hi, guys! I have just one problem. My model is too big in Maya after import. Is it possible to change this?

  • musashi13musashi13 Posts: 44

    Hi, just trying the plugin but... is it possible to export things like hairs, gens, clothing and keep pose controls in Maya?

  • ParadigmParadigm Posts: 421
    edited April 2018

    Hi all,

    I purchased this plugin today and will give it a couple days but probably plan to refund it because:

    1. There is exactly 0 documentation outside of that single image showing how to click the two buttons.

    2. The promos and the videos suggest you import it then it's ready to animate with a rig. I'm sitting here trying to add a skeleton to the character. Let alone a rig. Unless I've missed something, that is straight up false advertising.

    3. I simply cannot save the scene in the default mb format. I save it, it's listed as several hundred MB and when I open it is entirely blank. Saving as a .ma file does work.

     

    If anyone has had any of these problems and resolved them please let me know. I'm a few pages into this 11 page thread, but replies would be appreciated as well.

    Post edited by Paradigm on
  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    edited April 2018
    Paradigm said:

    Hi all,

    I purchased this plugin today and will give it a couple days but probably plan to refund it because:

    1. There is exactly 0 documentation outside of that single image showing how to click the two buttons.

    2. The promos and the videos suggest you import it then it's ready to animate with a rig. I'm sitting here trying to add a skeleton to the character. Let alone a rig. Unless I've missed something, that is straight up false advertising.

    3. I simply cannot save the scene in the default mb format. I save it, it's listed as several hundred MB and when I open it is entirely blank. Saving as a .ma file does work.

     

    If anyone has had any of these problems and resolved them please let me know. I'm a few pages into this 11 page thread, but replies would be appreciated as well.

    I think you missed something.   Do you have a DaztoMaya box with three buttons in Maya?  When you click the import button, do you get a Daz figure in your viewport?  If so, you are ready to animate, as the product states.  Your Daz figure will be rigged to an HIK skeleton which you can manipulate using the HIK menu.

    Post edited by drzap on
  • Kevin SandersonKevin Sanderson Posts: 1,643
    edited April 2018
    Post edited by Kevin Sanderson on
  • ParadigmParadigm Posts: 421

    It doesn't need much... When it works. I guess it's a "sucks to be you" product if you get errors

    Through trial and error I was finally able to save the scene, but it needs to be in .ma, not .mb.

    Nothing mentioning that.

    And the file is 10 GB. I was also able to get the skeleton

    I was also able to finally access the skeleton, but only after saving and loading the figure. Again, not mentioned anywhere.

     

  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    Paradigm said:

    It doesn't need much... When it works. I guess it's a "sucks to be you" product if you get errors

    Through trial and error I was finally able to save the scene, but it needs to be in .ma, not .mb.

    Nothing mentioning that.

    And the file is 10 GB. I was also able to get the skeleton

    I was also able to finally access the skeleton, but only after saving and loading the figure. Again, not mentioned anywhere.

     

    This product has a few limitations, but accessing the skeleton (do you mean the Daz joints?) or saving in the .mb format is not one of them.  To test this out, I just imported a figure and saved in .mb format without any problem at all.   Your large file size is due to your fbx export settings.  Apparently, you are exporting morphs with your figure and you have a lot of morphs.  Morphs take up storage space.  To change your morph settings, go to Daz Studio and export a figure (any figure).  You will get an fbx export dialogue box.  Uncheck morphs (bottom left column).  Now only the figure will export.  If you want to retain some morphs as blend shapes in Maya, you need to make some morph rules so your file size won't be so large.

    I don't know what you mean by "accessing the skeleton".  The Daz skeleton (joints) is always available in your Outliner.

  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    edited April 2018

    Hi, guys! I have just one problem. My model is too big in Maya after import. Is it possible to change this?

     

    You are exporting too many morphs with your figure.  You need to edit your morph rules in the fbx export dialogue box.  Do this outside of the DaztoMaya script.

    Post edited by drzap on
  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    edited April 2018
    musashi13 said:

    Hi, just trying the plugin but... is it possible to export things like hairs, gens, clothing and keep pose controls in Maya?

    You can't do that with the DaztoMaya plugin.  FBX export from Daz doesn't allow for saving the pose positions along with the rigging.   But it can be done another way.  Here is an excellent tutorial on how to do this, written by one of my colleagues.   This will solve your problem.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwMaAjhz-K8

    Post edited by drzap on
  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    edited April 2018

    Hope somebody can help me with this:

    I have the plugin installed and can export a character from daz with DazToMaya and import it in Maya2018. However I got two problems:

    - When I open HumanIK no character is defined

    - I read through this thread and want to export the JCMs. So I added pJCM export to my Morph Export rules and activated "Maya Helper Scripts". So when I do a normal export from DAZ and import it in Maya I get all the JCMs and with the mel script I can import the constraints/relationships. If I use DAZ to Maya, it doesn't respect the export options I set in the previous manual export. It only exports the gead morphs and that's it. There also no JCM relationsships described in the mel file in DazToMayas temp directory.

    Am I missing a step here?

    This is a limitation of the DaztoMaya script.   If you are experienced in Maya, you will find the script has little value.  There is a group of artists who are solving the problems related to using Daz figures in Maya.  You are welcome to join our Skype group (check my signature).  

    Post edited by drzap on
  • ParadigmParadigm Posts: 421
    edited April 2018

    I'll give that a shot, thanks.

     

    Just to knowledge check:

    Export a figure and disable morphs. Then use the daz to maya script, which will use the previous export options?


    Edit:

    That did not work, the .mb is still the exact same size. 4.9GB. .ma is still ~10GB.

    Steps I followed:
     

    1. Loaded up my intended character. 
    2. Exported it as an fbx with morphs turned OFF
    3. In the same Daz session I run the DazToMaya Script (also tried a new session when this didn't change my results)
    4. Open a new Maya scene
    5. Import from Daz
    6. Auto-Import, scale .1(small)
    7. Save with textures as .mb
    8. Identical result. Looks like either exporting an FBX with mophs disabled does not work or it's not a morph issue.
    Post edited by Paradigm on
  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    edited April 2018
    Paradigm said:

    I'll give that a shot, thanks.

     

    Just to knowledge check:

    Export a figure and disable morphs. Then use the daz to maya script, which will use the previous export options?


    Edit:

    That did not work, the .mb is still the exact same size. 4.9GB. .ma is still ~10GB.

    Steps I followed:
     

    1. Loaded up my intended character. 
    2. Exported it as an fbx with morphs turned OFF
    3. In the same Daz session I run the DazToMaya Script (also tried a new session when this didn't change my results)
    4. Open a new Maya scene
    5. Import from Daz
    6. Auto-Import, scale .1(small)
    7. Save with textures as .mb
    8. Identical result. Looks like either exporting an FBX with mophs disabled does not work or it's not a morph issue.

    You seem to have followed the correct procedure.  I don't know why your file is so large.  When you are importing and exporting, you can see in the status line below what is happening.  If morphs are being transferred, it says so.  It also takes a long time if you have a lot of morphs. If it's not a morph issue, I don't have a clue.  You can try importing manually without the script and see if you get the same result.  

    Post edited by drzap on
  • drzap said:
    Paradigm said:

    I'll give that a shot, thanks.

     

    Just to knowledge check:

    Export a figure and disable morphs. Then use the daz to maya script, which will use the previous export options?


    Edit:

    That did not work, the .mb is still the exact same size. 4.9GB. .ma is still ~10GB.

    Steps I followed:
     

    1. Loaded up my intended character. 
    2. Exported it as an fbx with morphs turned OFF
    3. In the same Daz session I run the DazToMaya Script (also tried a new session when this didn't change my results)
    4. Open a new Maya scene
    5. Import from Daz
    6. Auto-Import, scale .1(small)
    7. Save with textures as .mb
    8. Identical result. Looks like either exporting an FBX with mophs disabled does not work or it's not a morph issue.

    You seem to have followed the correct procedure.  I don't know why your file is so large.  When you are importing and exporting, you can see in the status line below what is happening.  If morphs are being transferred, it says so.  It also takes a long time if you have a lot of morphs. If it's not a morph issue, I don't have a clue.  You can try importing manually without the script and see if you get the same result.  

    @ drzap

    Are you the maya support guy for DAZ or just someone helping out ?

    Thanks

  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    edited April 2018
    drzap said:
    Paradigm said:

    I'll give that a shot, thanks.

     

    Just to knowledge check:

    Export a figure and disable morphs. Then use the daz to maya script, which will use the previous export options?


    Edit:

    That did not work, the .mb is still the exact same size. 4.9GB. .ma is still ~10GB.

    Steps I followed:
     

    1. Loaded up my intended character. 
    2. Exported it as an fbx with morphs turned OFF
    3. In the same Daz session I run the DazToMaya Script (also tried a new session when this didn't change my results)
    4. Open a new Maya scene
    5. Import from Daz
    6. Auto-Import, scale .1(small)
    7. Save with textures as .mb
    8. Identical result. Looks like either exporting an FBX with mophs disabled does not work or it's not a morph issue.

    You seem to have followed the correct procedure.  I don't know why your file is so large.  When you are importing and exporting, you can see in the status line below what is happening.  If morphs are being transferred, it says so.  It also takes a long time if you have a lot of morphs. If it's not a morph issue, I don't have a clue.  You can try importing manually without the script and see if you get the same result.  

    @ drzap

    Are you the maya support guy for DAZ or just someone helping out ?

    Thanks

    I only have a little experience in Maya.  I'm just helping out.  There aren't many, if any, active Maya users on this board.

    Post edited by drzap on
  • Well you're doing a great job Thanks !

  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795

    Well you're doing a great job Thanks !

    NP, glad it helped someone.

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