Tracking Character with Camera
kwannie
Posts: 869
Is there any way to select a camera and then select point at a charcter ( any node...hip, chest,, head) and NOT have the camera take on the roll axis of the character. in other words just track character back and forth by turning on the camera's "Y" axis only? Is there also a way to have a camera parented to a character and just dolly along the side of the character, by moving only on the "X" axis again without taking on the on the rotations of the node parented to? Been wondering this for years. Thanks!
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for tracking.. camera - general - point at [select part]
Haven't tried anything close to a dolly yet...
You can create a point-at target with the camera.
Thanks for your reply! I was actully trying to get info about how to keep the camera from taking on the "X" and "Z" rotational properties of the node it is pointed at. I want to set up a camera that will follow a character but will only pivit right or left on the "Y" axis. I also was interested in setting up a dolly cam to follow a character from the side on a parallel path.
Yes, I was just coming back to edit my reply - what you want might be tricky, one option might be to use the Property Hierarchy to link the Y rotation of the actual camera (which is not set to point at the target) to the y-rotation of a second camera which is set to point at the target.
I know that I've seen cameras that load with scene sets have actual camera-style controls, but I'd have to go through my content library to find which ones.
edit: DM's Memorial is the one I was thinking of, and it looks like the controls may have just been relabeled, because the controls don't seem to control MUCH differently from regular camera controls, if at all.
Richard, I found the Link property under the Y Rotate propery but I don't see how to actually link it to something else. The only option available is the ERC freeze, is that what I use? If so, how do I go about it? Thanks
I dont know if this is what your looking for but I just put these together
https://youtu.be/y0k6y3HOleI
https://youtu.be/5woeSF59Bac
Y rotation pivot and Dolly effect: IF you are creating a NEW camera:
if you are creating a new camera, click show options, there is a checkbox at the bottom to create a persistent point at target check it, it will create a camera target. in the scene tab select the camera target then position the target so that it is inside your character then parent the target to the character, then in the camera tab under general set "point at" to the camera target and the camera will the track the character in the Y rotation only. for the dolly effect parent the camera to the character as well, then set your focal distance on the camera tab under camera then lock the setting, it's not as nice as the rotation but it might work for what you want
If you are not creating a new camera:
Under the create menu select NEW NULL it will create a null and null target, then just like the camera target parent all three to the character with the camera pointed at the null or the null target, then set your focal distance on the camera tab under camera then lock the setting. in my example I set my focal distance at 100 it will move but not by much if you watch in the video
MarjoebI don't know what I'm doing wrong but I did as you suggested and checked the box to create a camera target and no matter which pat of the character I parent the camera target to it stll takes on the roll in the Z and X axis of that node ( chest or hip for example. Even if I lock the Z and X axis of the target in the parameters tab it still takes on the Z a and X rotations so consequently the camera mimics the same rolls. What I am doing is setting up a camera to follow a charcter than is singing on a concert stage and she basically moves quickly back and forth all the way to the lleft then all the way to the right. I have the camera set up obviously in front of the stage in the middle and back a bit to get the whole character in the view. I just want the camera to remain stationary and turn left or right as it follows the character. Like I said though, even though I lock everything except the Y axis The camera and the target rotate in all three directions.
Another way to prevent the other motion with "camera point at" is to set limits. Whatever your X and Z rotate values are for the camera, enable limits and set min=max . e.g. if x rotate was 10, set min and max at 10
marjoe I did all of that. I set the target inside the character. I did notice something weird when enable the joint editor with the lower abdomen had its end off to the side of the charcter ( end = red gimbal at bottom of bone) I was using a customized character, so I switched to regular G3 and set up camera with target and watched the parameters and it did not do it as bad. I think what my issue is, is that first I have my camera set up to be kind of a close up and second the motion has the character kind of jerking her upper torso to and fro pretty quick to the beat, so I am getting a quick occilation of the Y rotations. If I limit the Y rotations though, it defeats the purpose of trieg to remain stationary and just follow the character as she moves along the X plane. But I have tried locking and limiting various parameters on both the camera and the target. I think what is nededed id to just have a verticle axis null the moves with the center mass of the character to point at I'm glad you found a reason experiment with it any way. I'll keep tinkering with it. Thanks again!!
Hey pdr0, always nice to get your take on things also. If you see my reply to marjoe above I was telling him that I did attempt to limit rotations I even set the camera's translation params to ensure it remained stationarl and just left rotations free. Like I mention I think I'm gettin a lot of Y axis occilations due to the motion. Would be so much easier to have a real camera man in this concert I am simulating who did not pick up every iteration of the motion and just smoothly glide back and forth generally following the character.
Have you done any more experimenting with MMD conversion? I'm surprised that there are still so few people interested in such a vast library of motions. Did you have time to look into the pose estimation at all? I may just open a discussion on it to see if I get any hits. I'm dying to see if it will work!
.A real camera is usually operated by a real person. So animate it
If you bake to keyframes, you can smooth out the oscillations and animation curve with graphmate . Or there might be a script somewhere from mcasual, not sure
I've done a lot of experimenting in the past with the VMD motions - that's how I know about the typical little problems you get .
Pose estimation I got working for OpenMMD, but results are jittery and not as good as the other Japanese demo as . Many of the backend tools are the same, but I'm not too keen on allowing docker to permission to share computer filesystem ; I have to look into how secure the method is. I'll make a more detailed post/review in your other thread once I play with the tools more
https://github.com/peterljq/OpenMMD
Yesss!! That is always my concern also pdr0 I am always paranoid about the back door crap that goes on with giving permissions. I always wonder "who" is collecting "what", so that is primarily why I keep DAZ on a stand alone system (thinking that they secretly capturing samples of my renders..........lol) and transfer files via thumbdrive wherever possible, I do not trust Windows 10 one iota, and intentionally broke windows update so it cannot do it's automatic updates.
Yes you are right, I guess I don't need to be so lazy with cameras and actually do some animating. DS 12 has improved many things but the inability to delete key frames thus far is a huge hinderence to animating. The new motion I was playing with is the Sweet Devil Live Concert version where the character prances back and forth quite a bit. Its odd though this motion does not have any issues with the arms at all and yet it was package with its' own model.
So you think setting up the Pose Estimation on a virtual machine would quell the the invaisive possibilities and I wonder if a program live Ikinema WebAnimate could fix the jitters enough in the output file. I also have Iclone 7 with the editor that can clean motion nicely, I hear.
I definitely want to hear more about getting Pose estimation working, even if the motion is crappy its a start. Thanks!!!
I did this in the past by enabeling limits and setting min&max both to 0 on the cameras Z axis had solved those issues of the camera rolling for me, the only way I found to restrict the movement and have the tracking camera horizontal all time. The method of using a null object and parent it to whatever the camera should track is another good idea. This way you can adjust the position or re-parent the target null anytime to switch focus. (turn off Parent Items in Place in the Scene pane option menu for using "snapping into position" while reparenting by drag&drop in the scene pane).
What do you mean by inability to delete key frames?
Richaed in my timeline on DS 12 the minus keyframe icon is greyed out and I do not see the minus icon anywhere else on the timeline to delete keyframes. The little triangles show up in the timeline where the keys are supposed to be when I select the item (character) on the left side, but I can't find where to delete keyframes.
I am still am curious about linking properties like you mentioned above. I found the Link property under the Y Rotate propery but I don't see how to actually link it to something else. The only option available is the ERC freeze, is that what I use? If so, how do I go about it?
Have you actually selected a key when the - is greyed out?
I select the node on the from the list on the left side of the time line and click the + or - key frame advance icon to get to the key frame I want to delete, but delete option is available.
You have to select the actual key first
I'm not up to date about the new Daz Studio 4.12 is it now possible to do permanent ERC-Links between properties of different scene objects/figures/props?
I remember I tried this 2015 with DS 4.7 or 8 and I saw it working until I closed Daz Studio. Those ERC links didn't get saved in the scene file and where only held in memory.
In Daz Studio we have the ERC Freeze dialog to establish ERC-Links but even this dialog let you create ERC-Links between properties of different scene items those ERC-links don't get saved in the scene file becasue there is no support for that.
Instead I think there is a workaround by using those scripts called Post-Load Data Items those scripts gets callled after the content had been loaded into the scene. As far as I understand in the Post-Load Data example scripts the script will get executed after the content was been loaded into the scene and then the script will re-establish any ERC-Links between properties of different scene items.
http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dazstudio/4/referenceguide/scripting/api_reference/samples/elements/start
Another example ERC-Freeze by script - notice the highlighted (or multible nodes).
http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dazstudio/4/referenceguide/scripting/api_reference/samples/properties/erc_freeze/start
I have found "look at" to be something of a disaster in most scenarios where you think it might be useful. No doubt it's mathematically correct (orthornomal basis of look at, inverse transform of the thing you're looking at, etc.) but it's not aesthetically or practically correct. What you want really is a script that'll rotate the camera on Y and X (tilt up/down) to look at a point along the timeline, without any of these ERC, locking, etc. shenanigans.
My experience of bugzilla at work is that if it was added as an enhancement request it would probably languish there for ten years, and no doubt you'd want it to be part of a more general revamp of the whole concept of a constraint in Daz, rather than a hack, so it's a lot of work. I'm wondering if anyone has or could possibly generate a script to do it.