Daz Pro 4.6 constantly crashes on render
martinkeitel_e65f08430a
Posts: 83
Hi.
I'm posting this as a new topic, was earlier in a different thread...
Ever since I moved from DS3 to DS4, I haven't been able to render much because usually the program crashes when trying to render. I had this problem on Windows XP and I was adviced to move to Windows 7. I did, but it didn't help at all. If anything, with Win7 and the latest update to DSPro 4.6.1.39 the crashes are even more frequent,
I want to thank the Daz theme for making a hell of a 3D software and it's quite stable to work with, excluding the rendering problem. But of course, you are supposed to make rendered images with a 3D soft so it would be nice if it worked.
The crashing doesn't seem to follow any logic. Even with very simple scenes, for example just Aiko3 with a simple set of clothing and hair. Either the program just closes, or gives the following error:
DAZStudio has encountered a fatal error, and must close.
DAZStudio.exe caused ACCESS_VIOLATION in module “C:\Program Files\DAZ 3D\DAZStudio4\dz3delight.dll” at 001B:653CBF24, Dz3DelightDll::DSlo_DetailtoStr()+1479684 byte(s)
or
DAZStudio.exe caused ACCESS_VIOLATION in module "C:\Program Files\DAZ 3D\DAZStudio4\dz3delight.dll" at 001B:5CAB0A38, Dz3DelightDll::DSlo_DetailtoStr()+1498904 byte(s)
In any case, it seems to be the 3Delight rendering engine that misbehaves here.
Crashes are more likely when using uber environment lighting and deep shadow maps, but recently I've had big problems rendering even with no uberlight and no shadows. Also it seems to be a bit more stable when rendering single images to a new window instead of rendering to a file.
My setup is:
Win7 Ultimate 6.1.76 SP1
Model P35C-DS3R, X86-based PC
Intel Core2 Quad CPU 2,40 GHz
Physical RAM 4,0 Gb
Virtual memory 7 Gb
If anyone has had this problem and found a fix to it, I would really appreciate advice since I'm working on a rather big project.
I would render on DS3, but most of my scenes are no built on 4.6 so I can't load them.
Thanks.
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Comments
You only have 4 GB of RAM available on your system, that is you main problem, you will have very little memory available to do a render with.
3Delight uses a program called tdlmake, which produces various sized texture images, and it can use quite a lot of memory as well, even before the render starts.
I am using Win 7, Home Premium, and my system uses about 3 GB when I have DS loaded with just one Genesis figure. I am using the 64 bit version, and I have 16 GB of RAM, and never have render crashes. I would advise you to upgrade your memory if possible, or you will only be able to build and render smaller scenes.
Is this the same computer that was running XP?
Yes, I am just about to get more RAM. I'm sure that will help. But since the crashes happen also with VERY small scenes, I doubt if it's just a matter of RAM.
On the other hand, it would be good to add a feature that allows you to scale down the textures and maybe get automatically rid of unused shape data as well. After all, it would be good if with 16 GB RAM you could render a crowd.
One way to deal with the texture problem would be to create a copy of the texture map folder and place scaled-down maps there (for example 25% width and height). Of course this can be done manually, but would be much less trouble if there was a way to do this from DS.
Yes, the same with no changes to hardware (but will get more RAM soon).
I doubt the problem is memory alone, I render scenes with complex backgrounds and staging (props) with as many as 6 Genesii on old Blinky, a slow laptop with only 4GBs of memory.
Actually...I'm more inclined to think it IS RAM...but nothing to do with the amount, but rather the actual functionality of the physical memory sticks, themselves.
I'd say, go here: http://www.memtest.org/ and download and run the test disk, if you weren't getting more memory, soon.
Access violations can be caused by driver problems, poor coding, software incompatibility and, often, version problems. But if they go across several versions of 1 program and operating system upgrades, on the same hardware, most likely it is a hardware problem...and the most likely hardware to do this...RAM sticks.
I could barely run DS 4.0 on 4gb of ram. 2 years ago, when I upgraded to Win 7, I put in 16 gb of ram and haven't had one single crash. In fact, I recently rendered a heavily laden garden scene with over 300 plant objects. My systems resources were really put to the test on that one but it rendered without a hitch!
Everyone is Sort of right. It is NOT Ram alone. It really depends on 3 things, of which RAM is only one. First of Course you have Ram, the next part is the OS (bit depth matters here) and the version of that OS. But what many forget is the Motherboard, and just how it is configured to SEE the RAM. A wide Bus motherboard will out perform another PC with the Same OS and RAM just because it can handle the data transfers better.
EDIT: I have often considered that it can be a PC configuration issue when a PC sounds like it should run DAZ Studio but has problems.
I didn't run the memorytest yet. BUt I would be surprised if there's actually something physically wrong with my RAM sticks. I would expect to have problems also elsewhere, for example when working on large images on Photoshop. It never crashes or has any other problems. have no problems with other software, but of course no other soft requires so much RAM.
Now I have managed to render pretty well when I stick with single images and render them on a new window, then save. Also sticking with raytraced shadows instead of shadow maps. How can the "save to file" crashes be related to RAM?
If the operation of RAM is so hardware centered with Daz, I don't think it's sensible to require users to buy a new computer just to use Daz studio, when all other software works on the old one.. rarther check that it also works on computers that are say 3 years old... or at least put the needed specifications clearly visible on the Daz web site, since this it requires more capacity than any other software - including other 3D software.
Let's see if I get it working after I get the extra RAM.
I was doing some succesful renders with Aiko3 and couple of different clothings.
I now changed to morphing fantasy dress, which is just one piece of clothing. And the render works maybe one time out of ten - except when removing diffuse maps from the dress (leaving it white). Now how is that one piece of clothing with ONE diffuse map takes more RAM than several pieces of clothing with several maps?
And is the RAM really used by DS? When I start it, there's 1,8 Gb RAM available (log file). When I've loaded the scene, there's still only 44% of RAM in use (according to advanced system care that monitors the use of RAM). When rendering starts, the used RAM increases to 47%. That means at least 1,5 Gb is till unused.
Now if DS4.6 needs, as people seem to be saying, 16 Gb of RAM and 64 bit OS to render Aiko3 with simple clothing, no backdrops - how was it that DS3 rendered Vic4 + Michael4, with many clothes, with higher resolution texture maps, with backgrounds - on the same computer?
Well, now for some strange reason this A3+MFD scene renders without crashing although I made no changes.. Perhaps there's something fishy about my hardware. Strange thow that it doesn't affect any other software.
can i suggest?
check path of the render (F2)
after crash manualy delete temp render files
use another place than system hard disk
e.g.
> d:daz_render_temp
on some render scenes, even small the temp can use more than 1 or 2 GB!
depend of textures.
note:
normaly after exit Daz the temp is supposed to be clear, this is not the case if you crash!
note2:
do the same for DSON Temp folder, use another place than system
Hey thanks!
Finally some actual advice other than buying a new computer :)
I did what you suggested and also realized it's a good idea after a crash to start and close the program instead of trying to render right after a crash.
It's been pretty steady now. Still crashes every now and then but with the starting+closing procedure seems to work pretty well.
I hope with the extra RAM the rest of the crashes are history!
But stil with the above mentioned procedures again after making many succesful renders the same situation reoccurs. No matter what I do, I can't get a single render of Aiko with morphing fantasy dress, although I've already rendered the same scene many times before - with different poses. And always this same message:
DAZStudio.exe caused ACCESS_VIOLATION in module "C:\Program Files\DAZ 3D\DAZStudio4\dz3delight.dll" at 001B:5EB50A21, Dz3DelightDll::DSlo_DetailtoStr()+1498881 byte(s)
Can anyone see any meaning in those numbers? It's always the 3delight.dll
It' not connected to the lack of RAM. This time it happened after I'd just started windows and clened up the temp files.
Isn't there a possiblity that the 3delight.dll is corrupt? Can I download it somewhere without having to reinstall the entire software?
No..if it was corrupt, then you wouldn't be able to render at all. And since it is a special build, that comes with Studio, the only way to get it IS to reinstall...
But, like I said before...bad RAM and lack of RAM are not the same thing.
Think about RAM like a bunch of slots, like post office boxes. If you are putting something it and there's a water leak, dripping into just one box, then what's in there will be ruined. Now, if what's in there is your electric bill...that's something 'big' and somewhat of a problem. But if all it is is an ad for something you'll never buy, it's no big loss.
Now, RAM can be mostly good, until you stick a piece of a program there. It wouldn't matter if part of a picture gets stuck in that 'wonky' spot...if the data gets corrupted, then you'll end up with a 'hot pixel' or a 'dead pixel' or something. But if it is program code, then oops...'we're sorry, we can't do that right now...BAM!'
And yes, memory use by programs does tend to put the same stuff in the same spots on the same RAM sticks, if possible.
Run memtest and eliminate THAT as a possibility...
What occurred to me was to copy the dz3delight.dll from my XP Daz folder to Win7 Daz folder. A change happened. The render crashes at the end of render, as it used to happen when I was using DS4.5 on XP. With DS4.6. the crash almost always happens at the very beginning of the render.
To me this points to something wrong (or incompatible with my computer) with the dll. Obviously something has changed with the new version of the render module since the crash happens in a different way.
I still haven't got the extra RAM but since obviously there's nothing physically wrong with my RAM and the problem is NOT the amount of RAM. why would the extra RAM help?
Well, at least as the crash happens just before the render hits the bottom of the image, I can put something useless in the bottom of the view and take a screenhot when the render bucket gets to that area, then quickly cancel the render. If it still crashes, at least I have the rendered image (although will need to restart the program). Naturally this only works when the render size is screen size or less.
Your Render is Crashing when you Reach the bottom of Render to WINDOW? At about the same place every time? And you can not RENDER to FILE? Or can you render to File? This error is bugging me. Really want to hunt this down and fix it.
The crashes seem to come in waves.. I can render many times ok, then one render crashes and after that it's difficult to get anything rendered. After trying this and that, with no obvious reason, it renders again and after that it works a while. This refers that some stuff accumulates somewhere... and then for some reason it's cleared.
If I use the dz3delight.dll that came with 4.6 the render crashes the moment when the render bucket reaches something to render (it renders the blank backgroun until that). With the 4.5. dll it's the other way round. It renders as long as there's something to render, when it reaches the blank area at the bottom of the render window - crash!
If I render to a window, this can be observed. But it happens, even more likely, when rendering to file (4.6 crashes very quickly after I hit render, 4.5 crashes at the end of render).
Hmmm... now that is weird for sure. I can understand that maybe the STACK is not clearing properly all the time, that can happen from just a OS hic up at boot to the Prg itself. When If I get a Slow down in DS I just close and reopen, I save very often, and that helps most times. Others a full reboot is needed. And as noted it can be a OS issue as much as a prg one. Even the best PC will fail to fully load the OS on boot sometimes. But this is the first time I've heard of the 3Delight engine failing on Load or Exit load as you describe. I'll ask a few UBER Geeks I know about this one. Not sure anything can be done about it but I just need to know now.
Thanks for your effort. Any assistance is welcome.
If it's an OS issue, then it's funny I have it both on XP and Win7.
I'd really be curious to see a screenshot of your advanced rendering settings, mkeitel. What you're describing seems to be a problem when the ray that is traced from the camera goes off into infinity.
To test that theory, try a render with a sphere in front of a single plane (rotated up vertically) lit by a distant light where the plane completely fills the camera view. Render. Then delete the plane and try to render again.
THAT'S one of the indicators of a HARDWARE problem...when the same error happens on multiple operating systems, it is not likely to be an OS or software problem!
Jonnyray, the problem with that explanation is that the crash should happen each time with the same scene. But it doesn't. I haven't really changed the advanced render settings, just the bucket size.
Dont know how old this is but check the sub D on the item, the newest version of daz will crash in 3delight with sub D set to bilinear.
Does it help to restart the computer ? any chance it's heat related ? if you have a bad fan and the renderer is running the CPU at 100% for a longer period of time it will generate lots of heat, and with a bad fan you could be out of luck after a while, long shot but you never know.
Any problems with other software or you only use it for DS ?
Enough free diskspace available ? do you put the render statistics window in front so you see if there is anything popping up there just before it crash ?