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Thanks, Outrider42 for the added information. I had purchased Headshop 9.2 about a year ago, never could get it to work properly with Daz. I gave up on the efforts and was considering potentially purchasing Headshop 11, but did not want to go down that road once more. I purchased FaceGen Pro, and it does work. I was hoping for something that would not require my using a PC to integrate into Daz, especially after gifting my laptop to someone in need. Ideally, I would like something works seamlessly on a Mac. It looks like I need to stick with FaceGen and try running it on my Mac under a bootstrap type mode to get the results I want with new character creation.
I have to seriously scale back on the funds spent on Daz products to basically act as a "tester" in my mind to confirm whether things work for my needs. (As a side note, I even purchased FaceTransfer with the intention of testing it out as well on a PC.)
Thanks again for the details and feedback from everyone. I think Daz truly needs a rating scale, along with comments, to better assist not only purchasers but the resource developers as well. I appreciate the work that goes into developing things, and feedback is the best avenue for reaching a higher level of quality while fixing some problems that may not be known earlier on.
Does anyone have a fix for the skin difference in color of the FT. There is a distinct color diff in the face skin and the body skin.
Would there be a way to adjust the blending map in FaceGen? I'm curious as to why it cuts off too close to the end of the eyebrows. It would be nice if it extended a bit beyond the outer ends of the eyebrows and not smudge them.
I use Face Transfer plus the FTS add-on and think that combination does a fantastic job. Can't comment on the other two with relation to Daz, but I used to use Face Gen about 15 years ago in game development.
I haven't tried Face Gen with Daz because it doesn't appear to have had any fundamental updates since I last used it and it was already pretty limited back then. The Daz plug-in version must've been updated to target Genesis meshes, but the core of the product looks unchanged and I don't remember it being that great.
I've stayed away from Head Shop because none of the promo pics resemble the reference pics.
I don't use the textures that come out of Face Transfer. I think they're terrible. It's the FT plus FTS addon combo I like for giving me a base shape. It's surprisingly accurate and often only needs a few tweaks to get superb heads, and I've a workflow setup to transfer the heads to G9, at which point I make any tweaks before slapping on a G9 texture.
I'm a FaceGen, FaceXfer kinda guy, but I'm about to purchase HS Pro. I favor FG, but I get several images and create two or three versions of a model, then apply at reduced percentages to achieve a decent result. I have HS 13 but found it to be very user unfriendly and a bit of a pain to get good results. Still, I'm game to try again after reading other comments here. Just would have been nice to get a better discount for being a prior purchaser (HS13 is not my first try at it).
UPDATE: so I followed the instalation instructions and keep getting this error: no .jason config files found!
Why is this program so hard to install all the time?
Any ideas what to do here? I sent an email to support at Abalon
Facegen Artist is the version of FG that works with Genesis. It has been updated recently as well. This is noteworthy because Daz Face Transfer has NEVER been updated in its entire existence. So while FG is very old, it is indeed still getting support all these years later. You cannot say the same about Face Transfer. As for Head Shop, it always has promise but I have been let down too many times by it. To its credit, HeadShop 2023 is the only one that supports Genesis 9. At some point Facegen probably will. Considering that Face Transfer has never been updated at all, I am very doubtful that it will ever support Genesis 9. However, just looking at the tutorial for HS2023, it looks like the app struggles to create proper morphs for the G9 eyes and teeth. I have a feeling that any face generator will have a big problem with G9.
The new FG has automatic dot placement like the others do, so now FG is more user friendly. You can still manually place dots if you wish, too, so it still has that freedom. Another thing I noticed is that the newest FG appears to do a better job blending the face into the texture than it did before. So if you have not updated Facegen in a while, you should do so. The latest update just dropped days ago.
Somebody asked about the cut off point of the photo blend. This is where using a side profile photo helps.
They all still have their issues. The head shapes can be really comical looking. If you are looking for a bunch of random background characters, I would use Face Randomizer and combine it with textures from Facegen. At a distance, FG characters can look pretty convincing. You can create unlimited randomized faces from an AI Art Generator to use in Facegen. You can easily adjust the attributes so the AI faces are bald and not smiling, which removes the biggest issues these apps have.
Do you mean the version 3.12 of https://www.daz3d.com/facegen-artist-pro
has this automatic dot placement?
We answered your support email and also ready to have a skype call/screen share which works best. The reason why HeadShop installation are different hinges with the fact that HeadShop is a DAZ Studio plugin and it needs to be installed similar/same place as the to other DAZ plugins. Since FaceGen is not a plugin and does not work inside DAZ Studio, it can be installed any which way.
We provided tons of info on how to install HeadShop which has its own installer. There's a README step-by-step in the installer, there's an install video https://youtu.be/QACNeyStmT0 and there are detail instructions in the 80-page manual: https://printahead.net/wp-content/uploads/HeadShopPRO-2023.pdf.
While 99% of our users follow these guides, there some that do not take time to read instructions.
So no reason to be insulting about reading the instructions there, chap. I did exstensive reading and installing of this program, yet again am having issue with it and G8/G8.1. Have not tried G9 but G3 does work fine.
With that said, and the uncalled for insult about following instructions, the program appears to have been installed correctly. I have check my emails daily without any response, so let's try sending another email so maybe I can solve the G8 issues and feel my money was well spent here, shall we?
Lets no chap each other, please. My answers are respectful and my asking to read instructions is not an insult. Abalone tech support is abalonellc@yahoo.com. I have helped many users with tech issues, hope to the same with you.
Laslo
Yes, that is correct. Plus as I said, you can also manually move the dots, too.
For those considering trying out HeadShop any number, it is expected that the installation of Daz Studio will be at some default location - not a user defined location. HeadShop2023 does not work on W11Pro with my D/S being at a user defined location.
Catherine, as long as you know where your DAZ Studio is located (hint; anywhere, but inside a folder that also contains "DAZStudio4" folder, which contains Studio and plugins), you can install HeadShopPRO 2023 to that folder. Unlike you, some users really don't know where they installed their working DAZ Studio or have multiple copies of DAZ Studio installed at various locations. In my experience 99.9% of the install issues are caused by this. Thanks for clarifying this.
Laslo
Ok, thanks for the info. Need have to try it for myself.
Sadly no Laslo, we've been through all this. It does not work over here. As best I can determine, something is either hardwired in HS "or" in W11Pro which prevents HS from functioning.
Just a thought, could be a request, for to make HS into a separate program like FaceGen is; so then it would not matter where one installed it either. FaceGen makes and saves the morphs, we then open D/S, load the figure and dial in the morphs. FaceGen does have to be told where the content folder is of course, and that is done by the user - it doesn't presume it is located at some mysterious location.
Catherine, I know for a fact that you're mistaken. As you recall, I wanted to show you this, but unfortunately you declined tech support, whether by skype or telephone.
I tried everything you had suggested {plus several additional tricks I know of} EXCEPT to reinstall D/S to default locations. It doesn't work, it can't find itself. And it doesn't matter where I put it {even if I put it 'everywhere'}. Let it rest.
How did you find out about the recent update? I check out FaceGen's website on occasion and never see any announcements there.
Quite sometime ago now I purchased FaceGen from their website. They send out update emails. AFAIK it's not yet available for G9 but they are working on that last I heard.
That's probably why I never received the update e-mail from their site. I purchased FaceGen directly from the DAZ store. Thanks, though.
I don't know for sure, but maybe if you download the 'free trial' for the same Artist edition, the key in your account might still work? If not, stay with the edition in your account.
Facegen recently released an update for the prior version if you bought from them directly they sent you a download link via email. If from DAZ you should get notice from DAZ. In the email they sent my they stated they they are working on a Facegen Artist Pro for G9 update but it is not ready yet. It will be distributed the same way.
Have tested recently Face Transfer, but could not get some good results,
so have come back to Avatar Maker in Unity, which I think Face Transfer is based on.
It is a pity, that Avatar Maker produce only the heads...
Artini, what trouble are you running into with Face Transfer? I happen to be most at home with FT, though of late, I've been testing/retesting various products and processes, including all of these in this thread. It's kind of a transitional time for my character creation as I've been doing a lot of experimenting while I decide whether to stay with G8/8.1 or go to G9, or to move to PBR from Iray Uber. (And yes, you can get FT shapes and mats usefully into G9.)
Whichever product someone prefers, I like to encourage and support the character-creating community, since there's some subjects and issues that only apply to us.
This guy is typical of my existing Face Transfer G8/8.1 - Iray Uber process; he took about 5 minutes to create just now from an undoctored Artbreeder source image and while he's not good enough to be a real character, I think he's sufficiently decent for product testing - which is mostly what I'm doing right now until I have a final path forward with my real characters.
Thanks for the comment, @paulawp, and great tip about Artbreeder.
I have many images from it, but has forgotten about them.
The test I have made with FT, does not give me any significant changes to the character
and the material created from the image was not so good.
I have applied different materials from the other Genesis 8 characters I have,
but have not tried so much.
Your characters looks very good.
I must say many details of the face (in particular eyes!) generated from FT is ONLY captured by the texture it generated. If you look a bit closer you will realize that FT does a very poor job in morphing the eyes... I have tried photos with different shapes of eyes and feel like it is the texture, rather than the morph that really determines what the figure looks like
...BTW, It took me forever to realize by FTS add-on you probably meant Face Transfer Shapes for Genesis 8 | Daz 3D
Agree with this!
It happens that I'd spent all day today working on a Face Transfer test case for a different thread and subject when I noticed that this thread had new activity. Enough has changed about my characters that I figured it was worth sharing my experience since my last post here in late May.
Since then, I have invested a lot of time and effort into G9. I have upgraded to the new FaceGen that does G9; as I expected, it still creates the shapes that I prefer less than the other products. However, while I'm not a fan of FG shapes, FG does have several valuable points worth mentioning:
1) Subjectively, it seems to be less sensitive to the shadows and highlights seen in pretty much all photos/photorealistic images that notoriously cause bad FT textures: notably, washed-out faces and stains on the side of faces. (FT can do a good texture, but the source image has to be absolutely perfect ... for FT. I've spent a lot of hours over the last year and a half honing my Photoshop skills trying to touch up source images to get better FT textures.)
As noted by outrider42:
2) FaceGen will let you choose alternate texture files as a base.
Several weeks ago, I had started experimenting with FG textures on FT shapes and converting both shape and texture to G9. Now, though:
3) FaceGen has been updated so that it creates G9 textures natively.
So all of that leads to my latest experiments, like this one. This is a FT shape --> G8.1M, converted to G9 via the recently released ManFriday utility. The texture is from FG onto a non-stock base - here, I was experimenting with Skinvent, which I'd recently picked up, but I've also tried using a skin for a commercial G9 character, with reasonable success. This is a PBR skin, which I have all of a few weeks of experience tinkering with; others would do it more justice.
There are problems here that are not the fault of either FT or FG. For example, ManFriday's converter does a good job with G8/G8.1, but there's still a bit of an eye issue. Also - eyebrows. There's not an eyebrow eraser yet for G9, so if I create a G9 FG texture set from a source image with eyebrows (Artbreeder source image included) either I have to clean it up manually in Photoshop or cover it up with that furry caterpillar of a G9 eyebrow. (And it's worth mentioning that since this image was about creating a scruffy hair style on this rough character, the hair is - scruffy - and the skin has a dirt geoshell on it.)
Another thing the new Facegen does is create a SSS texture for G9. Sadly it only does this for G9. You have to check the box that creates Iray textures to do this. If you see the pattern you can replicate this on G8 textures by tinting the them a certain way (sort of a yellow). How well these "Iray" textures work on G9 depends on the material settings you use. You need a pinkish SSS color, which many character presets use, including the G9 bases.
It is fun to mess with the different G9 base textures available to see how they look.
The new Facegen doesn't offer anything at all for previous Genesis models, like 8 or 8.1. I believe I said that before, but it is worth repeating in case somebody misses it. If you have one of the last versions of Facegen 3, you don't really need to upgrade if you are sticking to 8 or 8.1. The new Facegen 4 is really just for Genesis 9.
The models it creates, at least in my testing, are pretty much identical between 8 and 9. So that is another thing to remember. If you turn the Iray texture off in Facegen, the textures will have the exact same color and tone between 8 and 9 if you use the same texture as the source. The Iray texture setting is cool, but you can basically replicate it if you want to. Of course if you don't have Facegen 4, then I guess it is hard to understand how the SSS texture is being produced without being able to see it yourself.
The details in the face are always going to be painted on the texture, not the mesh. But this is still a handy thing to have. You can go into your morph collection and look for morphs that fine tune the detail you want, or you may be able to go into a modeler and sculpt it in yourself with the face texture as a guide. Having the texture right on the face would be like tracing. If the detail is too fine for a base mesh, you can make a normal or displacement map to do it.
I have tried FG's new SSS files but for me, I am getting better results for now with manually creating translucency versions from the original files. I'm learning my way around twiddling PBR settings at the same time as the rest of this project.