Can someone explain the whole clones/templates game?
mavante
Posts: 734
There is a veritable army of "clones" and humanoid "templates" marching around the Daz store, like Night of the Living Dead come to life. (No, wait ...) It is making my head spin. There are all of these clone cloners (many of which say they include templates) and template tempters, e.g.:
SY Genesis 8 Clones for Genesis 3
SY Victoria 4 and Michael 4 Clones for Genesis 8
Michael 4 for Genesis 2 Male
Wear Them All - Autofitting Clones and Clothing Smoothers for Genesis 3 Male(s)
Wear Them All - Autofitting Clones and Clothing Smoothers for Genesis 3 Female(s)
Wear Them All - Autofit Clones Expansion for Genesis 3 Male(s) and Genesis 3 Female(s)
Genesis 3 Male for Genesis 2 Male(s)
Genesis 3 Female for Genesis 2 Female(s)
Genesis 3 Female Clone for Genesis
Genesis 2 Female Clone for Genesis
Genesis 2 Male Clone for Genesis (which for some weird reason shows a female)
Genesis 3 Male Clone for Genesis
Clone for V4
Victoria 4 for Genesis 2 Female
Clone for V3 Active Wear Basics
SY Ultra Templates Genesis 8 Female(s)
SY Ultra Templates Genesis 8 Male(s)
Aiiiiiiiiiiiiiiieeeeeeee-e-e-e-e-e-e! I surrender!
I read that Autofit is supposed to work between generations, but then somewhere else I get heavily given the impression that it doesn't really work all that well unless you roll in the army of clones and/or templates, like an invasion of Twilight Zone seamstress mannequins. But if you go add up the cost of all those packages, you might could feed a family with as many members as all those clones for a week or two.
Can somebody puh-lease tell me what this whole clone/template thing is about, and why I need them? Tell it to me like I'm a 5-year-old.
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Comments
A clone is the mesh of a figure shaped like a different figure, which is needed for autofit. The Genesis figures come with some clones, usually for the previous generation. For example, Genesis 1 came with clones for V4 and M4, Genesis 2 came with clones for Genesis 1. Several PA's have produced additional clones, allowing you to autofit clothing from additional figures.
Templates help in fitting specific types of clothing (or hair). You often don't need them -- a lot of times just selecting the figure the item was made for (the clone) will work fine without specifying a template. Certain types of clothing need extra help -- dresses/skirts, footwear -- and the additional templates help with those. For example, boots are a problem area, so Sickleyield has produced templates that make those autofit better.
Clones allow a figure from one generation to wear clothing designed for a different generation figure. The current generation (Genesis 8) has a lot of great stuff but people also like to use content from other generations, so the clones allow for that.
Autofit is like "build in clones", but they're only basic. They don't do so well with some things like coats, capes, dresses, and the like. That's where additional templates come in - they can help fit non-skin tight clothing better. For Genesis 8, autofit does work pretty well on it's own. It's the first generation figure (that I know of) that automatically comes with clones for all previous Genesis generations (Genesis, Genesis 2 Female, Genesis 2 Male, Genesis 3 Female, and Genesis 3 Male). People still like using content that was made for older figures, so clones for additional figures that aren't in the Genesis line (like Michael 4 and Victoria 4) can allow Genesis 8 figures to wear clothing meant for M4 and V4.
Clones are pretty helpful, especially for older Genesis figures that don't have very many autofit clones that come with them automatically. They all (to my knowledge) come with a clone for the previous generation one step behind them, but anything older than that and you'll need additional clone purchase. And templates are just really helpful, imo. Autofit does struggle a lot with certain types of clothing, so the templates can be a big help.
Catherine has some free ones too
if fitting close fitting clothing basic autofit is fine
wih coats and dresses the shirt template is fine if using dforce on the bottom half, sometimes the long hair one even suffices as long as the garment is welded and you can create a dynamic surface with the geometry editor dialing down simulation on the other surfaces if it is all one surface.
I have far more success with dforce on such stuff than new bespoke dforce garments!
I think it shows a female because Genesis (the first Genesis - Genesis 1, if you will) is a unisex figure. Genesis didn't come with a separate male and female base. It could be morphed to be either male or female (or intersex too, I guess). So that "Genesis 2 Male Clone for Genesis" allows Genesis 1 to use clothing designed for Genesis 2 Male.
Autofit works in two steps:
Step 1 is where clones are needed. A clone is a special type of morph for the target figure which is used to compute how the mesh should be modified: basically autofit considers that the original mesh was made to fit the target figure with the clone morph applied, so it "reverses" the clone morph to get a version which would fit the default target figure.
Step 2 is where templates are needed. They're sample rigs for different types of items, which are used as a base to rig the modified mesh. Templates can also be used by the transfer utility when you rig your own clothes.
As mentioned by other posters, each figure comes with a few clones and templates built-in, and you can expand the list of supported source figures or sample rigs with the clones and templates available in the store or as freebies.
So how do these clones work in comparison to other products that are clothing converters? For example, if you have the V4 clone for Genesis 8 Female do you still need the V4 to G8F clothing converter? Does having the clone make the clothing converter work better?
Some times the converters are better, some times the clones and autofit are better. It depend on clothes
However, the big pro with SY converters is that these are batch converters. In the case of autofit, if you don't want to repeat the process of autofited the same cloth each time that you use it, you need save the cloth. It is a cloth, but if you want now save 1000 clothes this is an eternal task, but with a batch process you only need wait that daz studio and the SY script to do the majority of the work.
Footwear needs extra work even, but by clones heels get an awful result where SY converter wins.
Why there are clones and Batch converters in the store if Batch is better? Because the SY scripts are the last product and previously the only option was the clones. The SY scripts are intended to improve the conversion process.
As far as I know, V4 clone for G8F is not mandatory for V4 to G8F clothing converter.
Thanks for the explanation GiGi_7.
I have all clones which are available at Daz Store including free clones. These are always useful for me to utilize entire clothing library.
Thanks very much to everyone who pitched in with patient explanations. After reading them all, the conclusion I've come to is that the single most important consideration in tailoring for the various generations is: "How deep are your pockets?"
I take it that is referring to the RSSY clothing converters? Still a significant investment, but I guess I'll go with those on a need-that-now basis, and summon any "clone" products only if and as I need them. Thanks again to all for this info. It certainly helps to sort the mess out.
If free or almost free is important in the equation, clones are better and footwear can be converted by hand, but patience and time are needed. Genesis 8 have free clones to get old clothes from Genesis, Genesis 2 and Genesis 3, all of these are installed with Genesis 8 figures. Genesis have free clones to get old clothes from V4 and M4 (I don't remember if K4 is included).
In other hand, there are tutorials to create clones, templates and convert to dforce clothes from old generation.