DAZ Central installing DAZ Studio to C:/DAZ3D, ignoring Program Files folder
3dcheapskate
Posts: 2,719
I've just replaced the HDD on my system, which crashed, with an old HDD that I just reformatted and gave a clean install of Windows 10 Home 2004 64-bit using a bootable USB created from the Microsoft site download.
Rather than reinstalling an older version of DAZ Studio 4 from my backups I decided to grab the latest version.
I went to the DAZ homepage, and clicked the blue Get Started For Free button.
I had to login again on the Get Studio page, even though I was already logged in.
On the Download Studio page it automatically downloaded DAZ Central. I couldn't see any option to download the DAZ Studio installer directly, or even an option to download DAZ DIM. Too old-fashioned I guess.
The downloaded DAZ Central installer was the 64 bit one, version 1.5.0.11
Edit:
Things I've discovered while doing this thread.
I'll add links from each observation to the relevant post at some time.
There may be changes or additions to this list as time goes by.
(note: I use Windows. No idea whether any of this applies to Mac)
1) If you use DAZ Central to install Studio it installs everything, programs and content, to C:/DAZ 3D (i.e. a DAZ3D folder in the root of the C drive) without any option to change it.
2) If you want to install the software and/or content to specific locations you shouldn't use DAZ Central. You need to use DAZ DIM (Install Manager, which should be in your Product List), or the manual installers. on your computer.
3) If you install Studio via DAZ Central then no uninstaller for Studio is created on your computer, so you can't uninstall Studio from Windows > Apps (or whatever it's called in your version of Windows). Apparently you need to run DAZ Central, and you can uninstall Studio from there (I never tried this). I think it's the same with DAZ DIM.
4) If you install Studio using DAZ DIM from a non-admin local account you may find a spurious product called 'LOCAL USER' in you content directory pane. See the picture at the very bottom of this post (or go to the next post and scroll up a bit)
5) The DAZ Central UNinstaller hasn't been signed. See this post
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(I forgot to mention that I was doing all this from a Local user account. Not a Microsoft web/cloud account. Not an admin account. That may or may not be relevant)
I ran the DAZ Central installer, giving admin permission as required.
All seemed to go smoothly, and the DAZ Central window ended up showing me what I was actually after - the option to install DAZ Studio. Which I clicked.
The installation didn't ask (or tell me) where it was going to install, but I went ahead assuming that the monkeys who did the programming knew what they were doing.
All seemed to go smoothly. I think it then automatically started DAZ Studio. I entered my serial number and the main DAZ Studio UI opened up.
And then a little popup appeared saying something like "New content directory found at C:/DAZ3D/..." I thought "That's not right..."
So I had a look and sure enough, there's now a DAZ3D folder in the root of my C drive. That can't be right. I delved into it and DAZ Studio 4 is deep down under there.
DAZ Central is under C:/Program Files/DAZ3D, so I'd say that something in the DAZ Studio installer has screwed up
I also noticed that there's no desktop shortcut to DAZ Studio or DAZ Central. And neither of them appear appear in the Apps I see from the Windows Start button. That's when I thought about the user/admin rights. Sure enough, the shortcuts were created on the admin accounts desktop.
So has anybody else discovered that their copy of DAZ Studio 4 is somewhere under C:/DAZ3D instead of C:/Program Files/DAZ3D or am I the only one ?
Has anybody else tried installing DAZ Studio via DAZ Central from a Local user account ? Or does everybody else use cloud/web-enabled or admin accounts ?
Install Manager is still available, I grabbed a fresh copy yesterday having done a Windows reinstall. I searched the store for Install Manager but it's also linked from the release threads (currently https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/382131/daz-install-manager-dim-1-4-0-67-now-available-updated/p1#top ) and from most pages in the Product Library.
Daz Central is essentially a simplified UI for Install Manager, one of the simplifications being to have only a single folder as a base path within which applications, content, and the database are placed. If you want more control you should use Install Manager
Thanks Richard. I decided to uninstall DAZ Studio / DAZ Central and go via Install Manager.
Uninstalling Studio after installing it via DAZ Central, which put it in C:/DAZ3D/... which is NOT what I wanted...
(Note: I should probably have run DAZ Central and uninstalled Studio from there, if that's possible. And then uninstalled DAZ Central. But I didn't)
First problem - no uninstaller for DAZ Studio.
Neither in Windows Start > System > Apps, nor in C:/DAZ3D/.../DAZStudio4.
So I simply ran the DAZ Central uninstaller (via Windows Start > System > Apps, assuming that it would also automatically uninstall anything it had installed - i.e. DAZ Studio.*
Of course, it didn't. And it didn't warn me that I should do that.
DAZ Studio was still there in C:/DAZ3d/...
So I ran DAZ Studio and used Revo Uninstaller Free in hunter mode (which confirmed that there was no uninstaller for DAZ Studio). I used the moderate scan mode and blatted** all the registry entries and files it found. Also needed to reboot.
Hmmm... C:/DAZ3D/... is still there, containing the PostGreSQL stuff and default content. I don't think that the PostGreSQL has any UI that I can use RevoInstaller in hunter mode to uninstall, and the default content definitely doesn't. So at this point I decided*** just to delete the complete C:/DAZ3d/ folder, reckoning that when I reinstall DAZ Studio via DIM all (well, most... or at least some) of the leftover registry entries will be overwritten with correct ones. See, still an optimist at heart. (Or looking at it another way, isn't there a saying that a fool never learns from his mistakes?)
Next step, have my morning coffee before installing DIM...
I really do have to remember not to do anything like this before I've woken up, or while I'm falling asleep...
*In hindsight I should probably have tried running DAZ Central to see if there was an uninstall option for DAZ Studio, since DAZ Studio was installed from within DAZ Central.
But I didn't. And the DAZ Central uninstaller didn't warn me that I should do that first. Darn software monkeys!)
**technical term
***In hindsight Revo Uninstaller's hunter mode probably has a way to uninstall things which don't have UIs, but I didn't feel like investigating that - I've only used Revo Uninstaller a few times, and only quite recently.
Shouldn't that single base path be C:/Program Files/DAZ3D ?
Not C:/DAZ3D
I wonder whether that was a deliberate decision or an oversight ?
Reinstalling Studio via DIM after uninstalling DAZ Central, Studio (via Revo), and deleting C:/DAZ3D
Okay, had a couple of coffees, downloaded and installed DIM (Install Manager) 1.4.0.67 64-bit, and then ran DIM.
It asks me to login to my account, and the username and password are already filled in.
Obviously a registry leftover from when I installed Studio via DAZ Central an hour or so ago.
It then gave me a popup with a preselected list of required (and optional) files for an install of Studio, as below:
Luckily the coffee kicked in before I could click 'Start Queue'...
Where is it going to install to ?
To check the I cancelled the start queue popup, went to settings (the little cog top right), and selected the Basic view:
So it's obviously picked the C:/DAZ3D/.. path up from a leftover registry entry too.
Not a problem, as I can change all the default installation paths with the Settings > Advanced view.
But I think another bucket of coffee is in order to make sure my brain is alert...
Since installation/uninstallation is handled by DIM/Daz Central (if you use those rather than stand-alone versions) the applications and content are not added to the system uninstall list - that would be redundant at best, and would have the potential to cause conflicts. Uninstalling the isntaller won't remove user-generated/system updated data - otherwise they'd be lost on updates. As long as the data itself is not removed reisntalling the installer will allow uninstalling the rpevious installs. I suspect, however, that Revo Uninstaller may have stripped out some of that data leaving you with a partially there/partially gone situation.
No, the base path should not be in the Program Files folder as that is protected by the OS, so things that require modifying files (e.g. the CreateExPFiles tool for ExP figures or the database itself) would fail.
You can disable the Install Sets dialogue by unchecking Show Automatically at bottom-left.
I didn't think of that.
So uninstalling Studio from DAZ Central before uninstalling DAZ Central would probably have been the best choice, option one
Reinstalling DAZ Central, using it to uninstall Studio, and then uninstalling it again should have been option two.
I opted for option three, or lower.
I'm fairly sure that Studio was never installed to C:/DAZ 3D before, and that it's always been C:/Program Files/DAZ 3D. At least up until DS 4.10 which is the most recent one I had before my HDD crash.
Not sure about the content database - I vaguely recall that also being under C:/Program Files/DAZ 3D.
(Up until maybe a year ago, I think I had Studio installed on a separate disk partition, outside the OS protection. However, my memory tells me that the default program location in the old Studio installers was always in C:/Program Files/DAZ 3D and not C:/DAZ 3D. Of course, my memory may be playing up.)
Regarding CreateExpFiles, etc - the files they modify are in the content, not the program itself. So that's not a problem, at least not for me, since my default content location is on a different drive.
And doesn't anything running from within the program itself have the same rights as the program ? So Studio has the rights to modify things under its own installation path ? I remember discussing this over on the Renderosity PoserPython forums with regard to whether PoserPython scripts could change things in the Poser program's installation path.
Ah yes. It's even on my screenshots
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Regardless of all that: Before I saw Richard's post I'd already had my bucket of coffee and reinstalled Studio to where I wanted it using DIM. Here's what I did:
Setting the paths in DIM
I want DAZ Studio installed where it's always been installed, under C:/Program Files/DAZ 3D (Note: I read Richard's comment in the previous post after my reinstallation of Studio via DIM as described in this post).
I had my coffee and was raring to go. Time to run DIM to install Studio.
However, there's no shortcut to Install Manager on my desktop, and it doesn't appear under Windows Start > All Apps.
Logging in on my computer as admin I can see the desktop shortcut, so I guess the DAZ DIM installer only puts a desktop shortcut on the admin account's desktop, not all users' desktop's. Most programs create the desktop shortcut for all users. Microsoft Edge, Bitdefender, Malwarebytes, Poser 11, and Revo Uninstaller definitely did - I see their shortcuts on my non-admin local user desktop and they appear under Windows Start > All Apps, but if I try to delete those shortcuts I need to enter an admin password. I just tested that.
Anyway, that's not a real problem as I can just create a desktop shortcut manually.
Okay, here we go. Run DAZ Dim and set up the paths as I want (DAZ DIM settings cog top right, Advanced):
Installing Studio and default content from DIM
Accept those changes, and then go back to the Default Install Sets (DAZ DIM settings cog top right again). Tick all optional components in that list (the Genesis 3 male/female starter essentials were both unticked by default) and click the green Start Queue. Everything downloads as it should (from what I recall of previous use). I can't recall whether I had to enter an admin password at any time during this process - I probably did:
Quick test of newly installed Studio
After that finished I ran Studio - I can't recall whether it automatically ran after installing, but once again there's no desktop shortcut, and it doesn't appear under Windows Start > All Apps on my non-admin local user account. So I create one manually.
It runs and finds the content on my removable HDD:
I have a quick play with Studio and it all seems okay. I shut it down and remove the external HDD with my content (I have to restart my computer since it tells me that somethings still using the HDD and it can't remove it)
Try running Studio without any external HDD - works fine. No content of course, but the program's up and running.
Shut down Studio, reconnect HDD, start Studio and carry on playing.
Errr...what on earth is this ?
Wait a moment... what on earth is 'LOCAL USER' doing under Products !
That can't be right can it ?
(I've moved my response to Richard's answer , which was originally here, to the start of my previous post)
DAZ Central UNinstaller not correctly signed ?
One other thing I forgot to mention regarding uninstalling DAZ Central. Windows popped up the standard-type warning asking "Do you want to run this program from an unknown publisher". So it appears that the DAZ Central UNinstaller wasn't correctly signed, or whatever you call it.
(I think the DAZ Central installer was fine)
The common root folder is new to Daz Central, previous methods still spread the files to locations in the more standard master folders (Program Files for the executables, AppData for settings and the database itself, and documents for the content).
Local User is a catch all for content that isn't part of an explicitly decalred product, and for locally created files.
Not sure what is happening with the uninstaller.
Thanks Richard. I love it when people provide short, precise answers to my rambling questions. It makes me feel profusely and extravagantly verbose, which is actually quite a nice feeling.
The issue with the uninstaller is that it is generated locally, by the installer, so can't be signed.
So, this thread has been very eye opening. Thanks all for the info. When I set up my DAZ last year on my new computer I used Daz Central also and it put everything on the C:\ drive. No problem initially, but my C:\ drive only has 1 TB of space, whereas my D:\ drive has 5 TB of space. I've used up a lot of the C:\ drive downloading content for V7, M7, V8 and M8, and can foresee running out of space. Especially when i move to V9 and M9.
From these comments it seems I could use DIM to add another install space for DAZ and my content, essentially having DAZ and the content installed both on my C:\ drive and on my D:\ drive. The D:\ drive would hold all the content I have downloaded now, plus the content I've bought over the years for prior Victoria and Michael versions. Then I could uninstall DAZ and the content from my C:\ drive.
I'd want to do that because I don't want downtime from being able to use Daz. I have whole sets of pictures I want to make and I have 10 years of purchased content to download so it takes awhile to get it all.
Can I do that then? Use DIM to install DAZ on my D:\ drive while it's also installed on my C:\ drive? Or will that cause issues?
Daz officially only supports having one version of DS installed (well, one general release and one beta). So if you try to reinstall the program on D it will most likely ask you to uninstall current version, unless the version you install on D is a beta.
Anyway DS itself doesn't take much space, so you could simply leave it on C drive.
Regarding content, you can multiple content libraries on multiple drives. So I would first leave your current content on C, install your new content on D, and add both the C and D install folders as content directories in DS preferences so it sees content from both places.
Then you can move your content from C to D in a second time.
@Leana - Thanks for the reply and the clarifications. I'll update my Content Directory Manager preferences in DAZ so that I have a D:/ space for content. It seems I can specify the Daz Connect Data destination. That should help, as I really do like Daz Connect. I just want it to download to the D drive instead of the C drive.