Poser conversions - can glitched ERC chains be fixed? [Yes they can]

SpottedKitty

Further adventures in converting old Poser goodies into full D|S format...

My latest project is Porsimo's old freebie M150 Assault Rifle with a huge collection of accessories and props. Almost everything worked; the new Iray materials look good, and I even managed to convert the two sighting scope props into fully rigged figures with turnable knobs.

Just two hiccups after converting Poser figures to weightmapping:-

• In the base gun figure, the bolt action movement doesn't work, although the bolt node bounding box does move.
• In the bipod figure, both extending legs don't move, as above the bounding boxes do move. (Edit: in opposite directions.)
• All other parameter dials and linked ERC dials work properly.

Anyone know what might have gone wrong? Can this be fixed in the new .duf figures, or are there changes I can make to the Poser .cr2 files to allow a fresh conversion to work? Come to think of it, is this even an ERC hiccup, or something else?

(I just checked, and the M150 is still in Renderosity's freestuff archive under Porsimo's name, if anyone wants to have a poke at it themselves.)

NorthOf45

TriAx or General? Remember the buttons on the laser stun gun?

SpottedKitty

I tried a straight conversion using General weightmapping, but all the parts fell to bits, so both of them are Tri-ax.

The stun gun was different, since that was a prop I converted to a figure. This is a case of Poser figures with ERC, which I wanted to preserve if possible.

NorthOf45

So, on the parts that you want to move linearly, you have a weight map (assuming 100% coverage). Select the geometry on those parts, and switch to the weight map tool. Select the parent bone and remove the weight-mapping (x, y, z rotations) from the selected geometry (fill 0.0 %). I think what happens is that the parent node weight mapping is locking the child node in place. I tried the same thing on that Modern Living Attic Bedroom drawer that wouldn't move with TriAx mode and found that the parent node mapping included the drawer geometry. Removing the weight from the drawer geometry with the parent bone selected allowed the drawer to slide in and out.

NorthOf45

Oh, and make sure "Show Children Weights" is unchecked, or you won't be able to tell what's what.

SpottedKitty

NorthOf45 said:

Select the geometry on those parts, and switch to the weight map tool.

Do you mean select with the Geometry Editor, or just select the bone in the Scene tab?

NorthOf45 said:

Select the parent bone and remove the weight-mapping (x, y, z rotations) from the selected geometry (fill 0.0 %).

I'm not quite following this. E.g. the bipod model has two left and two right leg sections; the top one for each side rotates down and out under ERC control, the bottom one telescopes in and out (except it doesn't). So, I select the lower leg geometry (orange dots) then select the upper leg (red fill) and remove the weights from it, is that right? When I try that, the lower leg shoots off to waytheheckoutthar the moment I click the "fill" button. I've also tried the "clear weightmapping" command, but that removes everything from the whole mesh, and nothing moves even if I re-add weightmapping.

I'm sorry, but you'll have to break the steps down a bit more; just like with the stun gun, there's something I'm missing and don't know I'm missing. Should there be a "change to General weightmapping" step in there somewhere, since you mentioned the possible issue with TriAx?

Hold on...

SUCCESS!!! All I needed to do was use the "Convert TriAx Weight to General Weight" command, and everything Just Worked™ — even the ERC links started working.

Doesn't work on the gun base, though, the bolt is still welded firmly in place.

NorthOf45

SpottedKitty said:

NorthOf45 said:

Select the geometry on those parts, and switch to the weight map tool.

Do you mean select with the Geometry Editor, or just select the bone in the Scene tab?

Yes, select the parts of the mesh with the Geometry Editor. Selections made with the Geometry Editor persist when going to the Weight Mapping tool. It's just easier to select entire face groups with the Geometry editor than to try to select the polygons with the Weight Mapping tool in geometry selection mode. In this case, select a lower leg face group.

SpottedKitty said:

NorthOf45 said:

Select the parent bone and remove the weight-mapping (x, y, z rotations) from the selected geometry (fill 0.0 %).

I'm not quite following this. E.g. the bipod model has two left and two right leg sections; the top one for each side rotates down and out under ERC control, the bottom one telescopes in and out (except it doesn't). So, I select the lower leg geometry (orange dots) then select the upper leg (red fill) and remove the weights from it, is that right? When I try that, the lower leg shoots off to waytheheckoutthar the moment I click the "fill" button. I've also tried the "clear weightmapping" command, but that removes everything from the whole mesh, and nothing moves even if I re-add weightmapping.

Remove the weight-mapping by using the "Fill Selected" with 0.0%. That will clear the weight-map from the geometry of the child bone's face group (lower leg), but leave the current bone's weight intact (upper leg). Next, select the child bone (lower leg, don't change the geometry selection), and see if it has any weight (red fill). If not, fill it with 100%. Now when you select the different bones, the weight map (red fill) should only be on the selected bone. (Show Children's Weight off).

Yeah, Clear Weightmapping removes all of it without warning.

SpottedKitty said:

I'm sorry, but you'll have to break the steps down a bit more; just like with the stun gun, there's something I'm missing and don't know I'm missing. Should there be a "change to General weightmapping" step in there somewhere, since you mentioned the possible issue with TriAx?

Hold on...

SUCCESS!!! All I needed to do was use the "Convert TriAx Weight to General Weight" command, and everything Just Worked™ — even the ERC links started working.

Doesn't work on the gun base, though, the bolt is still welded firmly in place.

Sounds like the bolt is still held back by the parent's weight map. Try that procedure on the bolt. Select the bolt geometry (face group), then select the parent bone, Weight Mapping tool, clear selected, select child bone (bolt), fill weight 100%. (I didn't mention that for TriAx you have to do it for all three rotations, but seeing as it's all 0 or100%, you can copy from one to the other).

Not sure why converting to General Weight would make a difference if maps are there for TriAx, but then, there are a lot of things about the weight mapping and normalizing and how it's distributed that I don't really understand. Simple cases seem straightforward, but they always seem to throw something unexpected in the way. Haven't done it often enough to figure it out.

SpottedKitty

NorthOf45 said:

Sounds like the bolt is still held back by the parent's weight map. Try that procedure on the bolt. Select the bolt geometry (face group), then select the parent bone, Weight Mapping tool, clear selected, select child bone (bolt), fill weight 100%. (I didn't mention that for TriAx you have to do it for all three rotations, but seeing as it's all 0 or100%, you can copy from one to the other).

 It worked! I even did the "convert TriAx to General" thing, and everything still worked! Now all I have to do is rebuild the six scene subsets I made up for the different gun variations in the original Poser installation; for standard infantry, special forces, grenades, sniper, etc.

NorthOf45 said:

Not sure why converting to General Weight would make a difference if maps are there for TriAx, but then, there are a lot of things about the weight mapping and normalizing and how it's distributed that I don't really understand. Simple cases seem straightforward, but they always seem to throw something unexpected in the way. Haven't done it often enough to figure it out.

I'm very happy that it worked as well — I just wish I knew how, and why.

I am getting better at this, though; earlier I managed to fix Papus3d's Poser model of the old pre-WW2 S.18/100 antitank rifle that always loads into D|S as an unworkable mess. It wasn't as bad as I thought, although the hand wagon was a total loss and had to be re-rigged from reimporting the .obj mesh.

Thanks again for the help. I'll get my brain wrapped around this rigging thing yet...

NorthOf45

You and me both