Games can't use one 16k texture .You use eight 2k textures. ? Make DAZ Faster ?

RorrKonn

Games can't use one 16k texture .You use eight 2k textures.

Would breaking 16k teatures in to eight 2 k textures help in DAZ Studio ?

Thanks

kenshaw011267

You already can. It's called tiling.

PerttiA

If by 16k you mean a graphic file with 16384x16384 pixels and 24 bit color depth, which uncompressed comes to 792 MegaBytes in size... I'm not surpriced at all that games can't use it.

nicstt

Why do you want to use a 16k texture in Studio?

What will it give you that a 4k texture wont?

Where are you using it that you feel you need such a large size?

More info please - lots more info.

Richard Haseltine

There's already a thread on a similar topic https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/441647/multiple-or-single-uv-map

akmerlow

Yeah well videogames are realtime, so there are limitations obviously. While here you can load whatever and wait hours..)

WendyLuvsCatz

video games also use dds with mipmapping and levels of detail 

Faux2D

Imagine having to bake 16k textures...

WendyLuvsCatz

Faux2D said:

Imagine having to bake 16k textures...

lol inagoni baker in Carrara can, and it (Carrara) uses mipmapping too

irrelevent to this thread but just illustrating you need to do what is suitable for the software you are using

nonesuch00

Well I thought the GPU driver divides maps in a way that fits the bus size and RAM size best. Otherwise aren't we just guessing in doing it ourselves what the remote user will have for hardware? 

Faux2D

WendyLuvsCatz said:

Faux2D said:

Imagine having to bake 16k textures...

lol inagoni baker in Carrara can, and it (Carrara) uses mipmapping too

irrelevent to this thread but just illustrating you need to do what is suitable for the software you are using

This one time I accidentally chose 8k textures when baking in Knald. My computer started to sound like a jet engine, then one of the fans broke the sound barrier with a loud bang, then it bluescreened. Nothing broke fortunately. Still have no idea what caused the bang.

WendyLuvsCatz

Faux2D said:

WendyLuvsCatz said:

Faux2D said:

Imagine having to bake 16k textures...

lol inagoni baker in Carrara can, and it (Carrara) uses mipmapping too

irrelevent to this thread but just illustrating you need to do what is suitable for the software you are using

This one time I accidentally chose 8k textures when baking in Knald. My computer started to sound like a jet engine, then one of the fans broke the sound barrier with a loud bang, then it bluescreened. Nothing broke fortunately. Still have no idea what caused the bang.

we are getting off topic  but I regularly bake 10K textures from procedurals, at least for Octane in Carrara, it only handles up to 10K(Octane) but have gone way bigger, I think 25K is Carrara engine limit

PerttiA

nonesuch00 said:

Well I thought the GPU driver divides maps in a way that fits the bus size and RAM size best. Otherwise aren't we just guessing in doing it ourselves what the remote user will have for hardware? 

A 16k graphic file (just one file) in a "typical" (normal, non-techie user) system would be the equivalent of a water bed full of water being moved from one room to another.

RorrKonn

nicstt said:

Why do you want to use a 16k texture in Studio?

What will it give you that a 4k texture wont?

Where are you using it that you feel you need such a large size?

More info please - lots more info.

They talked about in this video  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmuHLe6MjEA&t=231s since DAZ Sells extent license was trying to get educated. 

nonesuch00

PerttiA said:

nonesuch00 said:

Well I thought the GPU driver divides maps in a way that fits the bus size and RAM size best. Otherwise aren't we just guessing in doing it ourselves what the remote user will have for hardware? 

A 16k graphic file (just one file) in a "typical" (normal, non-techie user) system would be the equivalent of a water bed full of water being moved from one room to another.

Yes, & that's why I said I thought the task was left to the GPU drive on the remote user's system. It's perfectly capable of looking of the bus and memory sizes and splitting 16K textures to best fit such a size before it reads the image from storage. Not everyone has the same HW for your optimal solution to actually be optimal.

FSMCDesigns

RorrKonn said:

nicstt said:

Why do you want to use a 16k texture in Studio?

What will it give you that a 4k texture wont?

Where are you using it that you feel you need such a large size?

More info please - lots more info.

They talked about in this video  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmuHLe6MjEA&t=231s since DAZ Sells extent license was trying to get educated. 

They sell a license to use Daz Studio assets in games, doesn't mean they are devveloping the content with games in mind, big difference. I tend to think the license is there to handle the legal rights and to make a return on investment when they are used in a game.

Ellessarr

to be fair why would someone want to make a 16K texture??????, 4k already a "lot realistic" and for what i get human sight is limited to 19200, resolution, then while 16k would still not "the max of human sight it could be already a lot of "killing" and ultra mega realistic, peoples with 4k and 8k in many cases already having dificults to distingue some "real images from "realistic 3d images another issue which the vr glasses made clear which ours eyes can't adapt too well for "high resolution images when throwed direct to our eyes, making in many cases vr be limited to at bes 2k, otherwise peoples start to having vision issues if they keep the vr googles for too long.

Seven193

Ellessarr said:

to be fair why would someone want to make a 16K texture??????

I don't think the 16k map is used only for resolution purposes, it's to pack smaller maps (head,torso,legs,arms) onto one larger map.  And there are some games out there that use something called megatextures, which are maps larger than 128k, which do the same thing.  But those are virtual textures, they don't live on the GPU, which would be impossible to do.

But it wouldn't be very smart to load a 16k map on the GPU anyway, as some older cards have a maximum texture size limit, which may be less than 16k.  Not everyone have GTX 1080s.

 

Frinkky

RorrKonn said:

Games can't use one 16k texture .You use eight 2k textures.

Would breaking 16k teatures in to eight 2 k textures help in DAZ Studio ?

Thanks

16,384^2 = 268,435,456

(2048^2)*8 = 33,554,432

For the same uncompressed size you could use 64 2k maps, not 8.

Pendantry aside, loading several smaller maps concurrently takes less time than loading one huge map. Also, I expect trying to create a 16k map, either in PS or SP, with multiple layers (each has to be loaded in to vram) would be taxing on any GPU. Of course, you could tile separate maps into one file instead...

But, mipmaps exist for a reason!

Stonemason

I think SP's limit for texture export is 8k? and even then that option comes with the caveat it's 'experimental'

I've had to work with 16k maps in PS and it's a pain in the arse, I don't know if there's any RAM benefit from using smaller maps over one big one, but from a content creation point of view you'd be doing your self no favours working that large.

which isn't to say that 16k maps aren't ever used,I've seen a lot of film assets that have maps that size,usualy textured using Mari which sold itself as being able to comfortably work at 16k...I just think it's overkill for the type of content you see in the DAZ3D store

 

PerttiA

Dave230 said:

Ellessarr said:

to be fair why would someone want to make a 16K texture??????

I don't think the 16k map is used only for resolution purposes, it's to pack smaller maps (head,torso,legs,arms) onto one larger map.  And there are some games out there that use something called megatextures, which are maps larger than 128k, which do the same thing.  But those are virtual textures, they don't live on the GPU, which would be impossible to do.

But it wouldn't be very smart to load a 16k map on the GPU anyway, as some older cards have a maximum texture size limit, which may be less than 16k.  Not everyone have GTX 1080s.
 

There is a place and a reason for the MegaTextures, for example if you want an accurate map of the whole surface of the north America but even then the tools and programs that are used, has to have support for that technique.

RorrKonn

I remember back in the LightWave 7 days .In LightWave 7 the father a way from the camera a object was the smaller the file size. The textures and poly count got smaller.

something a bit like mini mapping but it was automatic we didn't make smaller textures or lower poly count meshes.

Does DAZ or Blender have what  Lightwave 7 had and if they do what is it called ?

Thanks

lilweep

Stonemason said:

I think SP's limit for texture export is 8k? and even then that option comes with the caveat it's 'experimental'

I've had to work with 16k maps in PS and it's a pain in the arse, I don't know if there's any RAM benefit from using smaller maps over one big one, but from a content creation point of view you'd be doing your self no favours working that large.

which isn't to say that 16k maps aren't ever used,I've seen a lot of film assets that have maps that size,usualy textured using Mari which sold itself as being able to comfortably work at 16k...I just think it's overkill for the type of content you see in the DAZ3D store

 

youre amazing

RorrKonn

...

RorrKonn

RorrKonn said:

I remember back in the LightWave 7 days .In LightWave 7 the father a way from the camera a object was the smaller the file size. The textures and poly count got smaller.

something a bit like mini mapping but it was automatic we didn't make smaller textures or lower poly count meshes.

Does DAZ or Blender have what  Lightwave 7 had and if they do what is it called ?

Thanks

So is that a yes or no or a maybe ?

Stonemason

RorrKonn said:

I remember back in the LightWave 7 days .In LightWave 7 the father a way from the camera a object was the smaller the file size. The textures and poly count got smaller.

something a bit like mini mapping but it was automatic we didn't make smaller textures or lower poly count meshes.

Does DAZ or Blender have what  Lightwave 7 had and if they do what is it called ?

Thanks

 

DazStudio can do that but you have to create the lower poly versions yourself http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/artzone/pub/software/lod/start

and when using 3Delight DazStudio does it's own MipMapping with no setup required, so your textures get automatically downsized, though I'm not sure if that's based on distance to camera or image render size

Stonemason

lilweep said:

Stonemason said:

I think SP's limit for texture export is 8k? and even then that option comes with the caveat it's 'experimental'

I've had to work with 16k maps in PS and it's a pain in the arse, I don't know if there's any RAM benefit from using smaller maps over one big one, but from a content creation point of view you'd be doing your self no favours working that large.

which isn't to say that 16k maps aren't ever used,I've seen a lot of film assets that have maps that size,usualy textured using Mari which sold itself as being able to comfortably work at 16k...I just think it's overkill for the type of content you see in the DAZ3D store

 

youre amazing

Thanks..not sure what that's for but I'll take it :-)

j cade

Stonemason said:

lilweep said:

Stonemason said:

I think SP's limit for texture export is 8k? and even then that option comes with the caveat it's 'experimental'

I've had to work with 16k maps in PS and it's a pain in the arse, I don't know if there's any RAM benefit from using smaller maps over one big one, but from a content creation point of view you'd be doing your self no favours working that large.

which isn't to say that 16k maps aren't ever used,I've seen a lot of film assets that have maps that size,usualy textured using Mari which sold itself as being able to comfortably work at 16k...I just think it's overkill for the type of content you see in the DAZ3D store

 

youre amazing

Thanks..not sure what that's for but I'll take it :-)

Well since it's sort of related to the topic of this thread I will say I am continuously in awe of how optimized and resource friendly all your sets are.