Buying prebuilt computers
kenshaw011267
Posts: 3,805
in The Commons
LinusTechTips is once again putting the major system integrators through their paces to see which ones are actually any good at it.
here's part one:
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Comments
LOL, that was highly entertaining. i usually purchase a pre built, but I NEVER do it over the phone like that or ask a salesperson what I should get. I do my research and know what I need before configuring a system.
Funny, I was at a BestBuy 3 years ago looking at something and there was a young couple next to me asking a sales person about buying a PC and the sales guys was so full of BS and incorrect info that I had to step in and help them out
I did the same once and got thrown out.
The funniest one we had was when my youngers son was working as a teccy and decided he wanted to upgrade to the newest PC from one of the companies his company were doing tech support for. We went to the nearest store that stocked the model (Mum of course was supplying the down payment so was sorting out the purchase). He had been talking to me about the PC when one of the sales guys came over and asked Neil if he wanted to know anything about the PC. My son laughed and explained that he did tech support for Siemans. Next thing I know I am waiting in line to buy one of these computers and my son is giving the stores sale staff a lesson in tech support for the model we were buying.
It's always funny when know-it-all salespeople try to explain you what you should buy and start sprouting a lot of bullshit when you know perfectly well they're wrong.
I once went to buy a new GPU for my parents' computer. I had done research beforehand and selected one which seemed to fit all criteria (including the very small PSU), then went to the store to buy one. Vendor started to tell me I didn't know anything (after all, I'm a girl, what do I know about computers right?) and tried to sell me another nore expensive GPU I knew perfectly well wouldn't work for what I wanted. I rolled eyes and gave him all the criteria, and guess what, in the end he had to agree that my choice was the best. His colleague nearby was silently laughing during the whole discussion.
I hate that. I try to always gop into Microcenter when my friend is working. If I don't the salesman always tries to upsell me no matter how specific I am in asking for a part. Which makes me crazy. This is an easy commission. I ask for part, go get part, put sticker on part, no added effort on your part but full commission made. Why spend time trying to make at best a few cents more?
Part 2
A theme emerges
Only Dell rep. knows how to deal with a clueless with thier warranty (extended), antivirus (really necessary) and most awsome is financing and needless to say it is free...
I usually just mind my own business, but I was at Fry's once and I just could not keep my mouth shut because I felt so bad for the person. I at least waited for the salesperson to leave :)
Another time I was there looking for a router, and I don't know what I was thinking when I asked the salesperson if there was a router that had more memory (my torrent client kept complaining about dropped connections). The salesperson looked directly at me and said that routers weren't really computers and didn't have memory. I bit my tongue.
They're a Linux shop, but System76 always provides first rate tech/sales support. They've always been knowledgable and straight talking. I'm considering buying my 3090 rig from them to avoid going through what I did with my first rig.
Auswide Computers around the corner from me has been good for me
I just never have the funds to get what I really want
Part 3
OMG Dell.
I actually enjoyed putting my new system together, though I did think about going pre-built (or one of those places that let's you select config and they build it). Apart from the soak testing they do which is not a bad thing, they're quite a bit more expensive than buying the components and doing it yourself. I would say though, most people can work out how to swap out a graphics card and maybe some memory, but a first-timer things like motherboard pins and cable management take a little experience to get right.
yeah Auswide actually builds it for me, they don't sell prebuilt towers AFAIK just laptops, everyone waits, you discuss your needs
I've gone with Digital Storm a few times now and could not recommend them higher. I know they fall on the more expensive side of things sometimes, but I've really had a great experience each time.
im surprised you folks trust in some of the prebuilt hardware. my experience is PSU and mainboard are junk. I prefer building my own system. but i suppose not everyone has patience and perhaps time. but I feel to a degree you become familiar with every individual component and can almost feel where each are at... I'm a prick and and stressing my current cpu.
I hope to relpace it soon and give my old one a rest, and a new home.
Part 4
Dell SCAMMED Me - $1500 PC Secret Shopper 2 Part 4 - YouTube
Dell done been bad.
Thanks, I've saw all the series in one round.
Why I buy components online whenever possible.
I bought a prebuilt once, it was a Dell and part of it broke within 2 years so I just bought a new case and used the parts of the Dell that still worked. It was a Dell Desktop minitower of some sort from Autumn 2006. Just as well buy some off brand computer for much less money from China really.
I used to buy Dells, I found them reliable, their tech support was excellent, and their prices were not rock-bottom but reasonable. Around 2014 they went to pot -- everything I've bought from them and every interaction with support since then has been abysmal (actually, there was one tech support event that was excellent, but when I had the same problem a year later it mysteriously was considered a user-replaceable part even though no untrained user should be disassembling a laptop).
If one can't build it on their own, I would always recommend a "build house" where you can use a custom configurator to build it out online...and then the finished setup is shipped to you. I've had multiple systems, desktop and laptop, done by CyberPowerPC and haven't had any issues. And the price is generally as good as you could do buying everything and assembling yourself anyways. The only drawback is that you lose the ultimate control you'd otherwise have if you were to do it on your own, and sometimes, as with EVGA GPU's, you wind up with an "OEM" warranty instead of their standard 5-year (I only noticed the difference when I went to register the card on EVGA's website...that it specified "OEM" on the warranty). But out of several builds, I still haven't had a problem with anything.
i bought a CyberPower PC a year ago. Their tech support was terrible. no help. Their solution was , "send it in". My dime ..i tried to upgrade memory form 16gig to 32. they do not sell aftermarker memory. The GEIL stuff in there I could not find anywhere, and then found out special for them. I eneded up buying the full 32gig and the 16 sitting here not used. There were a couple of other problems as well.
I used to build my own, and then went stock for awhile. Its not the easiest trying to figure out compatibiliy issues in the current game as there are so many ways to go. BUT, my next one I will build myseld.
They do sell name-brand memory...the last system I had built from them has Corsair Vengeance sticks. You just have to make sure you configure each and every part in the build yourself rather than letting the default selections stay. I've only had to call their tech support once and it was with the last system I got (my husband's mini-tower...and we won't get into how much I *hate* mini-towers which is completely beside the point, lol). It wasn't finding the OS and turns out the M.2 drive had come unseated just a smidge in shipping and thankfully while on the phone that idea popped into my head and I suggested it to the guy. Otherwise I would have had to ship it back. The CPU cooler (air cooler) fan also wasn't spinning and lo and behold, they hadn't plugged that into the mobo. So yeah, it's definitely helpful to have a bit of a grasp on stuff. I don't know how I'd feel about everything if I'd gone into it completely blind.
My current personal system was a manual build where I purchased everything, had it shipped, and then I went to a local guy to put it together. He was offering a deal where for an extra hundred bucks, he would let me build it with him so I could learn. It (no lie) took 1.5 days, so about 12hrs, to put together with a professional. He had issues with pretty much everything. The new RYZEN chipset had just come out and the cooler I'd purchased (NZXT Kraken X62), even though it was compatible and did have all the necessary components, was a hassle because the directions hadn't been updated for the AM4 socket. Then he had issues seating the radiator for the AIO...normally it's installed at the top of the case, but with the case I had purchased, again listed as compatible (Corsair Crystal 570X), it had to be mounted to the front. Then because that case came with Corsair SD fans, and I wanted everything swapped out for HD fans, he had issues getting the Commander Pro fan controller (the case actually comes with a different and more cheesy fan controller so that was another customization) to play nicely with everything (because we had also swapped out the NZXT radiator fans for Corsair HD's). And then the cable management. HOLY CRAP the cable management. The 2nd day was 100% cable management. All in all...I do think I could do most of the stuff on my own...but holy crap...he charged me only $300 to build everything out and I would do it again in a heartbeat to avoid that nightmare. (Though I did go back to them to do another build and they conveniently negletced to call me back...I'm thinking they didn't want my business even though that time around I had no intention on being there to bother them...I was going to let them just do everything from parts to final product...I honestly think I must have annoyed them the first time around even though they seemed to enjoy having a girl who knew nerd stuff to talk to for a couple days.)
Back in the 1990's I went to a shop with my dad who wanted what he called a "last computer" - one that would never need to be upgraded. The shop in question was one I went to to get parts to build mine, so I knew the salespeople well. Anyway, I recommended a 486 with 16 MB of RAM - which cost $760 back in the day. The salesperson looked at me and went "You just never want to have to by more RAM" to which I replied. "You know better than that".
Anyway, it was a great computer. He didn't replace it with his first mac for another 7 years or so. His final computer was his third mac. It had a bit more than 16 mb of RAM....
Myself at this point I usually buy used Workstations and add to them. I find that works pretty well. I find it's way to costly to buy new, two to three year old stuff that was well built to start with is a much better bargain.
Adding RAM is a tricky proposition.
You can add RAM with the same rated speed, same primary timings (which is all that most manufacturers list usually) from the same manufacturer and still see performance decline. The RAM could have secondary and tertiary timings that are different or the CPU could just perform worse with more sticks installed, most do.
So if you care about wringing every last bit of performance out of your system the best option is two buy a brand new matched kit and then sell the old one on eBay or criagslist. But most people don't even know that to get more than the default RAM speed you have to set the XMP profile in the BIOS so dropping in almost any additional RAM will be fine.
I have never had a build, without custom watercooling, take 12 hours even when I had a mother with 2 preschoolers coralling her kids while trying to watch me. I think the guy maybe didn't know his stuff or there were some serious compatibility issues. I never do builds like that unless I get to at least look over the parts list to make sure the thing will actually work. From unboxing to installing Windows is usually less than 3 hours unless its a custom waterloop.
the system i bought was pre-built with no customization. It came with 16gig DDR4 3200 ram, they would not tell me name through sales. It had 2T HD, an AMD Ryzen 7 3800X CPU, an MSI GeFroce RTX 2070 Super GPU, and pricing at the time was real good. I figured I would just upgrade ram later. Everything else met my needs and beyond. I thought it strange they could not tell me ram mfg, or the GPU as far as that goes. I took the gamble. It paid off other than the ram.... and when it wouldn;t boot after a week, the tech support was no help I eneded up fixing that myself with a bit of research, but it was something any decent tech support person could have suggested pretty fast.
yes... i couldn;t match what was in there so bought matching 16gig modules ... it detected 2133mhz and the ram was 3200. I contaqcted CybePower PC on that and they would not help o"overclocking", even though they advertize all these overclocked systems. I then contact GEIL, and they walked my through the process of getting 3200. Right now I'm running 2133 again as we had a power outage and it messed my system up. Would not boot and I eneded up pulling the CMOS battery ...thus clearing out everrything to factory default. I have it all going again other than the ram.
Next time you boot, press the delete key when the computer starts showing anything on the monitor. This should get you into the BIOS settings. Depending on the precise motherboard maker you're looking for a tab called performance or overclocking. Find the RAM settings and it should say 2133 but there should be an option to select the XMP profile which is 3200. save and exit. It should power cycle, maybe a couple of times and then you should be back to normal.
For more detailed infor look up teh motherboard makers manual.
Ah yes, I forgot CyberPowerPC also sells stuff off the shelf. I was recommending their custom configurator, which requires you to go through and build out your system from their lists of parts and it checks for compatibility and whatnot for you.
There weren't any compatibility issues, but as I said...I was using all brand new stuff in terms of first generation of said stuff. So in the case of the AIO cooler, it had everything it needed for the AM4 socket, but the instructions hadn't been updated for it (they were for the previous gen AMD chipset)...so the guy had to wing it. The Kraken X62 cooler has a ginormous radiator, and technically it is compatible with the Corsair Crystal 570X case...however, it was the first generation of that case and at the time, Corsair's site did not specify that it's only compatible when mounted to front. It now does have that specification. We also had to gut the case because it came with sub-par fans and a sub-par fan controller (why would Corsair put their lower-end stuff in their top tier case...that makes no sense). So we had to manually replace all the fans for their higher-tier fans and controller. The cable management was also a nightmare...again at the time the case was brand new and there weren't any reviews regarding how awful cable management is...there now are tons of horrid reviews about it. I picked out the parts myself with the help of a custom-builder friend (who lives too far away for him to have built it for me)...so I went into it knowing everything was compatible. All the local guy had to do was assemble it for me (and yes, he did have the parts list ahead of time...we talked about it when I made the appointment for the build...he was slightly disappointed that I chose to order everything myself because I'm assuming he might have made some more money that way...next time I would let him handle that). You are probably right in that 99.9% of his business is fixing broken tablet screens and frozen laptops, not $4,000 custom builds...so I'm sure he must have felt pressure there. I'm not exactly in a geographical demographic where superman rigs are popular. I'm also confident it would have taken him way less time if I wasn't so particular about everything and making him literally gut and customize the case. I think the case was the biggest hurdle. It is a damn beautiful case...but the sheer practicality of it in its execution is non-existent.
I don't want to jinx myself, but the system has been up and running since August of 2017.