What's going to happen with A3 and H3?
cecilia.robinson
Posts: 2,208
As we get new Gen2F and Gen2M figures released nearly every one or two months, I'm a bit worried about the previous generations. I mean, V4 is supported - many character packs for females have Gen2F and V4 versions. M4 isn't so lucky, but he's male, so in a twisted, but natural way, on a worse position than the opposite sex (3D is a world with its own discriminations). Sometimes, Genesis also gets its five minutes - usually as a part of Generation 6 or Generation 4 character package.
What I'm worrying about is Generation 3, which produced those lovely Aiko and Hiro figures. So far, only GenX(2) was able to reproduce the unique features of theirs. They are perfect faes or children. If you're not very familiar with them, take a look at some of the most popular ones (according to my pickings from the runtime only):
http://www.daz3d.com/liam-for-h3
http://www.daz3d.com/sylfie
http://www.daz3d.com/sarina
http://www.daz3d.com/lost-realms
http://www.daz3d.com/pazu-for-aiko-3
http://www.daz3d.com/mila-for-aiko-3
http://www.daz3d.com/stratus-mccleod-for-hiro
http://www.daz3d.com/aiko-3-0-base
http://www.daz3d.com/aiko-3-0-morphs-and-maps
http://www.daz3d.com/hiro-3-0
http://www.daz3d.com/christian-for-d3-h3-m3-the-freak
http://www.daz3d.com/keiko-the-little-mermaid
I know they're old. But they're unique, still, they don't show up on sales. There are no contests that DAZ promotes concerning them (unlike Generation 4-6, well, mainly 6). The promos on the front page are Generation 4-6 only.
In a thread concerning Fast Grab, there was an exchange of the following:
robkelk said:Cypherfox said:Greetings,
Actually, I have a bad feeling about this.ssgbryan said:And I never want to hear from DAZ again about "we need to raise our prices". These kind of sales condition the users not to buy unless it is 70% off.-- Morgan
You're thinking they might be getting ready to open the Vault door, to put some products in?Considering how many people (who don't use Daz Studio) still use the Generation 4 figures, I think you might be worrying over nothing. Okay, I hope you might be worrying over nothing.
Anyway, I'm taking the opportunity to get the Kids 4 Pro Bundle (which wasn't one of the ones in the giveaway last year).
I mentioned that I wonder why there were M5 and V5 basically given away a few days ago while Generation 4 figures are vaulted (I'd expect older figures to be given away before the newer ones as a rule of thumb) - vaulted by the meaning Genesis get higher discounts than Generation 4 characters, while you'd expect than newer stuff has to cost more. Perhaps DAZ wants to earn income from Poser users, thinking DAZ Studio users are likely to stick to Gen2F and Gen2M instead of good old Genesis. But it is insane. And Generation 3 figures are full-price no matter the sales :(. Are there any products showing up that are exclusively tailored for A3 and H3? Those are delightful figures for faes and children. If DAZ stops supporting them, why wouldn't they and their morphs (Morphs & Maps) become free? V3 and M3 aren't so good-looking for today's standards, but A3 and H3 certainly are. Why don't they do something about them? Do you think A3 and H3 will return in their glory to DAZ? Or, if they won't promote new products for them, will they become free? Especially since there are Genesis and Gen2F/Gen2M conversions in the works, which kind of justifies freeing A3 and H3 - not the characters and their stuff, just the figures and the morph packages.
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Comments
I have been an avid Aiko3 user from the beginning. I have enjoyed using that figure and think it was a worth while investment. But as the years went on and new technology arose, the older technology in the Gen3 line really showed and I found myself wanting better looking figures. Gen4 was not a worthy upgrade in my eyes and though I have used them they are not really any better then Gen3 to me. Genesis tech is very good but the original Genesis figure having both male and female morphs becomes over loaded and a mess to sort through as you add more shapes and morphs in. Genesis 2 Female is to me the figure worthy of taking the place of Aiko3 as my go to figure. As much as I loved using Sylfie and the other Thorne and Sarsa girls all these years I honestly dont miss them at all. You can mix character shapes very well with Genesis 2. So that means if you own a toon figure for G2F you can mix that with non toon shapes. Plus you can mix all your G2F characters as you see fit. The more you have, the bigger the resource pool you have for characters for your scene. On top of that you can use Zev’s morph packs, Thorne’s resource kits & Cake One’s Smile delight & Fang morphs. And lets not forget the HD morphs for the different G2F girls too. From where I sit, I see a very strong character base to build on and use.
So in short, I see not reason to support older generations. Does that mean they are usless, no! I know full well how much A3 has served as my primary figure for all this time but everything has its season and for me Aiko3's season has ended. If we hold on to the past figures and technology we will never move forward to bigger and better things. And lets face it, this is a business. You cannot expect to keep selling content for the same figure 10 years after it was released and make a decent living.
As has been mentioned elsewhere, Zigraphix is working on a new set of morph and texture set conversions for A3 which will allow all existing A3 products to be used seamlessly on Genesis and G2F. Thread link to Zigraphix A3 product here: http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/44065/
Beyond that, I doubt that A3's going away anytime soon, as she still has a sizable base of fans, especially in Japan where they continue to create new product for her. As far as DAZ goes, they've done far less culling of the A3/H3 product than any of the other Gen3 figures, and they still offer the Pro bundles for those figures so it's clear that they know there's still a market, especially since people using Genesis and the G2s can use the A3/H3 clothing with the use of the iconic shapes. With Zigraphix's new product Genesis/G2 users will also be able to use of A3 (and other gen 3) textures without having to use a texture converter, so at that point all of those products will also gain a new lease on life.
Actually, there is some big news on the A3/H3 front: their morphs and maps are being updated for Genesis and Genesis 2.
(Cecilia, I think you know it already, but I thought it would be a good idea to add the link here for others reading this thread)
Edit: Oops, Cybersox13 beat me to it!
Yes, I do, that's why I made this thread - because if the package shows up, there is even less chances for people buying A3 and H3 per se. I added the link, thanks.
While I enjoy those figures, I deem Genesis and Gen2F/Gen2M better in terms of use, better bending and such. It is the face and the body shape that appeals to me in A3 and H3 (the realistic versions, mind you).
So I have a feeling DAZ could score a jackpot if, when the product for Genesis and Gen2F/Gen2M hits the store, they would release A3, H3 and their morphs and maps - since they are DAZ Originals - as freebies for the wide public. It would be a smart marketing move and I doubt they'd lose any money, as A3 and H3 don't seem to sell so well now (I may be wrong, there are no charts to measure that).
I think the Earth shifted 5 degrees on its axis the day Mattymanx shifted away from Aiko3. :lol: Who else could do classics like Darth Fluffybunny and Darth Cuddlebuns?
Cecilia, you forgot one of the cutest of all, Mulberry. The Gen 3 models did have severe limitations. Mostly, if you bent any body part more than about 10 degrees, the mesh crumpled in really ugly ways. If you're postwork-challenged like me, that's a problem. The teeth are also a joke. I still use them sometimes. Nobody does small but dangerous like Aiko3. :-)
Hope they stay, I use them more than anything else. And other sites, like Renderosity, RuntimeDNA, and DeviantArt has tons of stuff got !3 and H3 still. Just because something's old, does not mean it should be thrown away.
Now oil and coal is a totally different thing....
Anyhow, I will continue to use A3 and H3, and if no one likes it, they can park park their wide behinds on this mid digit ~holds up said finger~ and swivel on it until they squeal like pigs on a honeymoon. :P
I still use A3/H3 mainly because I still use AikoToon/HiroToon. And I have plenty of resources to pull from because I also have XD licenses for them as well.
Long Live Gen3!!!!!
-MJ
I agree, MattyManx and Zilgraphix have used A3 in ways I STILL havent seen matched by the "newer and better" figures. In addition to them being older and use less system resources, A3/H3 are permanent fixtures in my runtime for the foreseeable future.
-MJ
my aiko3 is still going strong. i've been, on and off, rendering a chapbook 'Aiko's spanking parlor'. :)
one of my favorites is Nym over at rmp.
*gasp* she's in clearance
Where's the clearance, Misty?
Can one read or see this parlor thing? o.o
Can one read or see this parlor thing? o.o
looks like a couple of thorne's characters for Aiko3 is in clearance status at rmp. once things become clearance it disappears from the rmp store.
:) i post renders at da gallery. realmgal
i give up hope daz gallery will ever bring back flags
I have to admit I haven't been using A3 and H3 all that much lately, but I sure like having them around; besides, I'm not completely done with Aiko2 and Maiko/Hiro2 yet (I even rendered this one tonight).
Way, way back in the dawn of 3D time I was using a number of Zygote models with various 3D packages, but it was the first Aiko model that hooked me on DAZ and got me addicted to the Platinum Club.
You never forget your first. ;-)
-- Walt Sterdan
I oddly have found the generation 3 figures load better in iClone after 3dx5 conversion too for multifigure scenes inspite of being highpoly simply because of the way textures are handled.
Yes can fix this with later figures using texture atlas but handy to know.
They use less maps because they have less overlapping UV islands, handy for 3D painting them too and you can make eyes different etc.
No one has to stop using them and I for one would not promote that. I hope no one thought I was suggesting such. After all, I would not have used them for so long were they not useful.
Have you tried either of these morphs?
http://www.sharecg.com/v/13020/browse/11/Poser/Pengy-Teeth
http://renderosity.com/mod/freestuff/?item_id=58642
Just wondering if you have any fresh links from japan?
..heh, A3 still has the cutest, sexiest robot in the universe.
Unbelievable, how could I miss this?! Great news indeed.
Gonna still keep using A3/H3.