(WIP) Displacing Terrain Shaders with Weather (ON HOLD FOR NOW)

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  • So I am assuming that there's been relatively good success with the food shaders? You doing more shaders tells me you did well. I really hope that you'll continue to do well with all of your products.

  • ThyranqThyranq Posts: 584
    edited December 2020

    I really hope they did well, too. I can 100% say that from the products of yours that I own (which is most of them), I know that anything you make is of the HIGHEST quality. Your pose packs are divine, intricate, detailed, and realistic in every way. They're some of the most quality poses that I own (which is a LOT of poses, so they really stand out). Then I saw the food shaders, and again, some of the most high quality, realistic looking shaders I've seen for DAZ. You really put a lot into your products, and the quality really shows that, so when I see your name attached to something I know it's going to be darn good! So if it's something that I have even the most remote use for, I'll be picking it up, because I know it's going to be worth the money in it's care, refinement, polish, craft, and achievement of the highest standards.

    Seems like as good as time as any to say, once again, THANK YOU for all the hard work and meticulousness that you put into everything that you do. It reallly shows, and that is why pretty much anything you release, for me at least, will be an insta-buy! My hat goes off to you

    Post edited by Thyranq on
  • V3DigitimesV3Digitimes Posts: 3,150

    Substance designer and alchemist are really cool but sadly the EULA is a pain since the substances must be absolutely created from scratch to have the right to sell them (except when projected on a non squared base UV).... So a lot of time is wasted recreating what's already existing....

  • jardinejardine Posts: 1,202

    wow!

    j

  • V3Digitimes said:

    Substance designer and alchemist are really cool but sadly the EULA is a pain since the substances must be absolutely created from scratch to have the right to sell them (except when projected on a non squared base UV).... So a lot of time is wasted recreating what's already existing....

    Good to know! Fortunately, I'm starting from my own photos for most of these, so EULA shouldn't be too much of a problem. We'll see how it goes... 

  • Of course, that could put a dent in my snow and rain plans...sad

  • Thyranq said:

    I really hope they did well, too. I can 100% say that from the products of yours that I own (which is most of them), I know that anything you make is of the HIGHEST quality. Your pose packs are divine, intricate, detailed, and realistic in every way. They're some of the most quality poses that I own (which is a LOT of poses, so they really stand out). Then I saw the food shaders, and again, some of the most high quality, realistic looking shaders I've seen for DAZ. You really put a lot into your products, and the quality really shows that, so when I see your name attached to something I know it's going to be darn good! So if it's something that I have even the most remote use for, I'll be picking it up, because I know it's going to be worth the money in it's care, refinement, polish, craft, and achievement of the highest standards.

    Seems like as good as time as any to say, once again, THANK YOU for all the hard work and meticulousness that you put into everything that you do. It reallly shows, and that is why pretty much anything you release, for me at least, will be an insta-buy! My hat goes off to you

    Thank you so much! I appreciate that more than you will ever know, especially these days. And can I just say, having honest feedback from end-user artists like yourself makes it all possible, so thank you also for everything you do. 

  • V3DigitimesV3Digitimes Posts: 3,150
    edited December 2020

    I don't know, you should ask directly to allegorithmic if you have the right to make sets of shaders with their rain and snow stuff (and if yes what are their limitations on their side). The EULA is complicated to understand, I got the info by forums and mail, but your case is a bit more specific.

    edit: there would be zero issue if you sold content for video games where the textures maps are embedded in the game and cannot be extracted from it, but they refuse the idea that the sets they provide can be sold as images, unless baked on a "non square UV" asset.

    edit: and let me know what they answered, here or via MP...

    Post edited by V3Digitimes on
  • Alright, until these questions are answered satisfactorily, this project is on hold. 

  • Those ThingsThose Things Posts: 1,132
    edited December 2020

    AnEye4Art said:

    So I am assuming that there's been relatively good success with the food shaders? You doing more shaders tells me you did well. I really hope that you'll continue to do well with all of your products.

    I just really like shaders! smiley In fact, I'm working on this velllus hair shader project right now, in addition to the ground project (which is now on hold, so I guess I can charge ahead with the vellus hair project!) and I'll be showing it off soon.

    I'm also a modeller, and I have a whole bunch of things I'm working on, but I run out of hours in the day. 

    Post edited by Those Things on
  • memcneil70memcneil70 Posts: 4,125

    Simply, Those Things is on my list of immediate purchase PAs.

    As I walked my American Eskimo today I noticed all the footprints left in yesterday's snow and frozen into place. But Bugsy did his best to make new ones. But that brings me to suggestions, various sizes of footprints (human and animal), dirty snow, frozen/iced run-off for sidewalks, and dirty slush frozen from the road clearance crews, dumped on said sidewalks after you just cleaned them. (Bugsy spun out three times last night on hidden ice.) 

    Water/mud melt on floors later would be nice. (No mud room here.)

    I have noticed that during heavy rain, that pant legs get soaked upwards from the foot towards the calf. Is there a way to create a shader to do that?

    Mary

  • ArtAngelArtAngel Posts: 1,696

    Those Things said:

    Hello, beautiful people! Just wanted to show you what I'm working on right now, in case you're interested. I'm about half done building a large collection of 4k (2k also) shaders, that depict highly realistic ground and terrain. They're so detailed, you'll be able to park your camera down near the ground, and shoot at a low angle without worrying about low resolution blurring and aritfacting ruining your shot. You'll get a bunch of different types of terrain, from ashphalt to dirt, to cobblestones to rocky, and each with a variety of weather conditions ranging from dry and dusty, to rain soaked and wet, to snowy and frozen. Use them to replace existing ground materials in your environments, or just slap down a plane primitive and make your own terrain. I guess you could also apply these to people and creatures, if you want to create weird, rocky, dirty people and creatures. I don't know, that's between you and your fevered imaginations...

    Anyway, enough of my rambling nonsense, here's some example pictures to show you how it looks. These are just one shader applied to a plane primitive with one hundred divisions, tiled 3 x 3, and lit with an HDRI. Rendered nice and fast. No postwork at all. 

    Low angle shots are no problem with these shaders, all the detail is preserved.

    High angle detail shot, dry and dusty conditions.

    The exact same terrain, after a good, long, rain.

    The same terrain again, this time covered in snow.

    I  WOULD BUY THIS IN A HEARTBEAT. How did other artists with similar products release theirs? These will be in my cart the moment they arrive in the store. Despite owning a ton of similar products, from rain to snow etc by multiple artists and as well as most of flipmodes products these will be a must have especially if identations for footstes/tracks are included. 

  • ArtAngelArtAngel Posts: 1,696

    Those Things said:

    Alright, until these questions are answered satisfactorily, this project is on hold. 

    @Those Things Does this help?

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  • V3DigitimesV3Digitimes Posts: 3,150

    I agree it is ok if baked on a UV set, but what they don't say here but elsewhere in the forum is that it is only as long as this is not a squared/rectangle UV set (so that their initial image maps cannot be extracted from the texture map). It was on their forum too. But in this case if the snow and rain is also made with your own photos then it come back to ok. The only question for which the answer must be no is to know wether someone can extract one of their "maps" from your product.

  • ArtAngelArtAngel Posts: 1,696
    edited December 2020

    V3Digitimes said:

    I agree it is ok if baked on a UV set, but what they don't say here but elsewhere in the forum is that it is only as long as this is not a squared/rectangle UV set (so that their initial image maps cannot be extracted from the texture map). It was on their forum too. But in this case if the snow and rain is also made with your own photos then it come back to ok. The only question for which the answer must be no is to know wether someone can extract one of their "maps" from your product.

    I still cannot find what you are referring to in the EULA. Here is the link and another screenshot. Could you look at the EULA and be more specific as to where it says this? Thanks.

     

    Edit: They will drop you like a hotcake if you sign up under the wrong category. The EULA is based on the user sign up (usage) agreement. Meaning a large corporation and individual usage terms differ in usage of PC's etc but Adobe has that usage micro-managed. The limit for individual is 2 PC's. Adobe took over Allegorithmic January 23 2019. Their licences are pretty liberal. Been using Adobe products since 1995. Have master suites up to cs6  and currently a subscriber. Still have original boxes of 3.0 on my shelf LOL.

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  • V3DigitimesV3Digitimes Posts: 3,150
    edited December 2020

    Yeah I agree, it's really confusing. Initially I also thought I would be free to do what I wanted. Here is what I found on the forum. People ask this because the Eula is IMHO super not clear. There was something about not baking over squared maps in the forum (which is logical), I had it bookmarked (http://legacy-support.allegorithmic.com/node/713 ), I think it is this bookmark, but the link is today unavailable.

    Now if thanks to Adobe we are now free to use their core substances for shader sets or squared UVs, it would be a great info and I'll be super happy to use commercially all the substances I bought (on that time there was no "source"), instead of being forced to recreate them from scratch. It would be the best news of 2021!

    Edit: the "Capture 3" and "Capture 4" are maybe the most interesting captures. It makes more clear what they don't want.

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    Post edited by V3Digitimes on
  • ArtAngelArtAngel Posts: 1,696
    edited December 2020

    V3Digitimes said:

    Yeah I agree, it's really confusing. Initially I also thought I would be free to do what I wanted. Here is what I found on the forum. People ask this because the Eula is IMHO super not clear. There was something about not baking over squared maps in the forum (which is logical), I had it bookmarked (http://legacy-support.allegorithmic.com/node/713 ), I think it is this bookmark, but the link is today unavailable.

    Now if thanks to Adobe we are now free to use their core substances for shader sets or squared UVs, it would be a great info and I'll be super happy to use commercially all the substances I bought (on that time there was no "source"), instead of being forced to recreate them from scratch. It would be the best news of 2021!

    Edit: the "Capture 3" is maybe the most interesting capture. It makes more clear what they don't want.

    The rules were different back in 2017 prior to Adobes aquisiton in 2019. Adobe is saying you cannot take their products as is and rell  sell them. Their tools are their tools and exporting their default tools from the packaged software and importing them to your app or sell as stand alones is considered pirating. Else all is good. But one MUST use their own images for textures or create them from the program.

    Post edited by ArtAngel on
  • V3DigitimesV3Digitimes Posts: 3,150
    edited December 2020

    Yeah but if you have a look at capture 4, it is dated september 2020. So I still don't know what to think. And Capture 2 is from end 2019.

    Post edited by V3Digitimes on
  • ArtAngel said:

    Those Things said:

    Alright, until these questions are answered satisfactorily, this project is on hold. 

    @Those Things Does this help?

    I'm beginning to think that the way to release these is to release them as models, rather than shaders. Just a big piece of ground that can be loaded into any scene... 

  • V3DigitimesV3Digitimes Posts: 3,150

    So I guess you did not manage to get clear answers from Substance? PM me if you want I have interesting pieces of EULA about licensee and copyrighted content. If your english is better than mine, maybe it will help you.

  • all say you cannot sell the source textures which is understandable.

    You can however adjust the graphs to create your own unique versions, I don't have Substance but if it's like Quixel Mixer that is not difficult to jumble up a bit, toss in a few masks you painted yourself before baking the textures and you should be good to go.

  • V3Digitimes said:

    So I guess you did not manage to get clear answers from Substance? PM me if you want I have interesting pieces of EULA about licensee and copyrighted content. If your english is better than mine, maybe it will help you 

    Thank you, I'll do that! 

  • Leonides02Leonides02 Posts: 1,379

    I'll be very disappointed if this doesn't come to fruition. sad

  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,015

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    all say you cannot sell the source textures which is understandable.

    You can however adjust the graphs to create your own unique versions, I don't have Substance but if it's like Quixel Mixer that is not difficult to jumble up a bit, toss in a few masks you painted yourself before baking the textures and you should be good to go.

    This is a big maybe, maybe not.

    I would not rely on this without asking a provider; if something isn't permitted to distribute, changing it a bit and then distributing it is usually also not permitted.

     

  • Sometimes it helps to get in contact with the owner of the software, explaining what you want to do and how the EULA is limiting you. And if there is a way to bridge that gap. Sometimes, the software owner is be willing to help... In the end, it does not help to spread Substance Painter if word of mouth suggests it is of limited use.

  • SevrinSevrin Posts: 6,308

    Hope you can work something out.  This has all the makings of another superior product.

  • xyer0xyer0 Posts: 5,947

    Sevrin said:

    Hope you can work something out.  This has all the makings of another superior product.

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