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Faulty product: How long does it usually take until a ticket is answered?

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  • Serene NightSerene Night Posts: 17,673
    edited May 2021

    I think the store needs to be more forthright about not repairing or fixing products. I find it really hard to take that tickets that are sent to bug tracker are never worked on, although the bug is acknowledged, and those products continue to be sold in the store. 

    I agree, that sometimes things are not bugs, and false reports are problematic. But if it makes it to bug tracker, then it is determined to be a bug. That info should be available.

    Post edited by Serene Night on
  • cridgitcridgit Posts: 1,757
    edited May 2022

    Redacted

    Post edited by cridgit on
  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 102,718

    cridgit said:

    DAZ takes a broker fee for every sale; from those fees they pay for R&D, product support, running the store and probably some other stuff. They also did (do?) pay for QA from that fee but it appears more and more of the QA share has been directed elsewhere over the past 5+ years. I also regularly see a response like "oh that's something the PA needs to do" which doesn't encourage me that there is real ownership of content (or metadata) quality.

    It has, I think, always been the case that PAs are responsible for fixes - though Daz QA has often made very minor corrections in house rather than asking the PA to do it.

  • ColinFrenchColinFrench Posts: 648

    Daz_Jessica said:

    We've also added more members to our bug resolution team recently so that products are getting fixed faster. We're believing this will solve product issues faster, and for easier issues potentially the same day it's reported.

     

    That's great, but how about adding more members to the QA team to avoid the problems in the first place? That would solve the product issues even faster!

  • KrzysztofaKrzysztofa Posts: 226

    I'm still waiting for Rin to get the duplicate formula fixed. You'd think since Crocadile Liu is such a prolific PA here they'd be on top of it, and yet Rin has been broken for ages. For all I know the PA isn't even aware theres a problem.

    I saw a while ago on these forums that its better to just ask for a refund than to expect anything to get fixed, so I actually don't have many tickets open. I usually just return broken things immediately. This is one area where I like Renderosicty more than Daz, because there I can directly contact the PA with no middle-man (last time I opened a QA ticket instead of returning the product, it took 2 months to get a reply, and many more months later, the product is still broken). And if the PA refuses to resolve the problem, I can just leave a review describing the problem to warn others away from a defective product. I'd love if Daz would implement a review system too.

     

  • SevrinSevrin Posts: 6,310

    ColinFrench said:

    Daz_Jessica said:

    We've also added more members to our bug resolution team recently so that products are getting fixed faster. We're believing this will solve product issues faster, and for easier issues potentially the same day it's reported.

     

    That's great, but how about adding more members to the QA team to avoid the problems in the first place? That would solve the product issues even faster!

    This would be my preference, as well. 

  • FenixPhoenixFenixPhoenix Posts: 3,118
    I also know of at least one case where a PA product was broken and when a user said they had sent in a ticket a month or so ago, the PA mentioned he hadn't recieved any message from Daz regarding the issue. He ended up putting in a fix right after that. So it's not always that a PA doesn't want or can't fix the issue. But rather that there may be some room for improvement in the communication between the Daz staff in charge of tickets and the PAs. For that reason, when it comes to our product, I rather a customer reaches out directly to me. That said, I can put in a fix sometimes right away, but it still needs to get retested and repackaged by Daz QA (and unfortunately sometimes that can take between a week or a month before the fix is live on the store).
  • TriCounterTriCounter Posts: 559
    edited May 2021

    I have an open ticket created 4 months ago and updated 2 months ago.  Another open for a year and last updated 9 months ago.

    I also have a ticket opened 6 months ago about Interactive Licenses not showing correctly on Order Confirmation emails.  I know this was not working still on May 1st but was automatically closed 12 days ago with no update.   Guess I could test it out and re-open but I won't be bothering.

    Well look at that, interactive licenses now show correctly on my order history :)  Well done for fixing the problem after 6 months (applause)

    Post edited by TriCounter on
  • ps2000ps2000 Posts: 278
    edited May 2021

    If I have a problem with a product I firstly contact the PA over the forum messaging system (if he has a user-ID). 

    In the past I got help pretty fast this way (normally within 24 hours). I normally don't even do tickets. 

    But in this case the PA who made the texture pack told me that it was a product which was comissioned by DAZ and isn't owned by him anymore.

    Furthermore the fault was caused by a change in the base product. Therefore he couldn't help me but assured me that he would contact DAZ.

    So I think in case of platinum club products the PAs aren't responsible for bugs in the product anymore and one has to go through DAZ to get help? 

    Considering my past experience I doubt that lazy/unwilling PAs are the reason that products don't get fixed.  

    Post edited by ps2000 on
  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 102,718

    ColinFrench said:

    Daz_Jessica said:

    We've also added more members to our bug resolution team recently so that products are getting fixed faster. We're believing this will solve product issues faster, and for easier issues potentially the same day it's reported.

     

    That's great, but how about adding more members to the QA team to avoid the problems in the first place? That would solve the product issues even faster!

    As I recall someone posted a link to a page in which daz was advertising openings, and one of the listed posts was in QA. do, however, bear in mnid that new QA people need training - and that is going to take one of the existing QA people away from actually QAing, at least in part.

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 102,718

    dortybassa said:

    I have an open ticket created 4 months ago and updated 2 months ago.  Another open for a year and last updated 9 months ago.

    I also have a ticket opened 6 months ago about Interactive Licenses not showing correctly on Order Confirmation emails.  I know this was not working still on May 1st but was automatically closed 12 days ago with no update.   Guess I could test it out and re-open but I won't be bothering.

    Well look at that, interactive licenses now show correctly on my order history :)  Well done for fixing the problem after 6 months (applause)

    There was a reall hold-up in ticket processing, at least for Technical Support tickets, after the store chnage over and with the end of year specials running - I beleive theya re now processing new tickets much more swiftly, but that still leaves some older tickets to clear out of the queue (I have a number from earlier in the year).

  • FenixPhoenixFenixPhoenix Posts: 3,118
    ps2000 said:

    If I have a problem with a product I firstly contact the PA over the forum messaging system (if he has a user-ID). 

    In the past I got help pretty fast this way (normally within 24 hours). I normally don't even do tickets. 

    But in this case the PA who made the texture pack told me that it was a product which was comissioned by DAZ and isn't owned by him anymore.

    Furthermore the fault was caused by a change in the base product. Therefore he couldn't help me but assured me that he would contact DAZ.

    So I think in case of platinum club products the PAs aren't responsible for bugs in the product anymore and one has to go through DAZ to get help? 

    Considering my past experience I doubt that lazy/unwilling PAs are the reason that products don't get fixed.  

    Can confirm that anything that has the daz original tag is owned by Daz (meaning they paid the PA a fee and the PA signed away the product to them). So getting issues fixed for those can only be done by Daz staff themselves.
  • ps2000ps2000 Posts: 278

    FenixPhoenix said:

    ps2000 said:

    If I have a problem with a product I firstly contact the PA over the forum messaging system (if he has a user-ID). 

    In the past I got help pretty fast this way (normally within 24 hours). I normally don't even do tickets. 

    But in this case the PA who made the texture pack told me that it was a product which was comissioned by DAZ and isn't owned by him anymore.

    Furthermore the fault was caused by a change in the base product. Therefore he couldn't help me but assured me that he would contact DAZ.

    So I think in case of platinum club products the PAs aren't responsible for bugs in the product anymore and one has to go through DAZ to get help? 

    Considering my past experience I doubt that lazy/unwilling PAs are the reason that products don't get fixed.  

    Can confirm that anything that has the daz original tag is owned by Daz (meaning they paid the PA a fee and the PA signed away the product to them). So getting issues fixed for those can only be done by Daz staff themselves. 

    And this is the crux of the problem in my opinion. Often DAZ themselves won't be able to fix the problem and will have to go back to the PA. And I can't imagine that he will do it for free if DAZ has taken delivery of the product this way several months ago. 

  • FenixPhoenixFenixPhoenix Posts: 3,118
    It would make no sense to expect the PA to fix or update a product that it's no longer theirs for free. In that case, Daz would need to make an offer for the fix and then see if the PA would be willing to work on the update for that amount of money. After all, upon delivery, Daz tests the product and makes sure it works properly. Updates to Daz studio can break products, but that's something Daz would need to deal with for their own products. The middle ground would be for Daz to add a note in the product description for products that won't work with newer versions of Daz and won't be updated, maybe.
  • Serene NightSerene Night Posts: 17,673

    DAZ can subcontract a PA. I'm sure there are some with the skills to fix faulty stuff like a borked JCM. I know users can do it, so there is no reason for a ticket to sit untouched for 2.5 years, like my Toon Generations Ticket is. 

     

  • SevrinSevrin Posts: 6,310

    If Daz had a policy of suspending sales of items they acknowledge are defective, that might help expedite fixes.

  • Rymit DaZ3DRymit DaZ3D Posts: 7

    ps2000 said:

    FenixPhoenix said:

    ps2000 said:

    If I have a problem with a product I firstly contact the PA over the forum messaging system (if he has a user-ID). 

    In the past I got help pretty fast this way (normally within 24 hours). I normally don't even do tickets. 

    But in this case the PA who made the texture pack told me that it was a product which was comissioned by DAZ and isn't owned by him anymore.

    Furthermore the fault was caused by a change in the base product. Therefore he couldn't help me but assured me that he would contact DAZ.

    So I think in case of platinum club products the PAs aren't responsible for bugs in the product anymore and one has to go through DAZ to get help? 

    Considering my past experience I doubt that lazy/unwilling PAs are the reason that products don't get fixed.  

    Can confirm that anything that has the daz original tag is owned by Daz (meaning they paid the PA a fee and the PA signed away the product to them). So getting issues fixed for those can only be done by Daz staff themselves. 

    And this is the crux of the problem in my opinion. Often DAZ themselves won't be able to fix the problem and will have to go back to the PA. And I can't imagine that he will do it for free if DAZ has taken delivery of the product this way several months ago. 

    Please be sure to contact Customer Support for assistance. A ticket will help us track the issue and work with our QA Department to resolve any product issues.

  • ps2000ps2000 Posts: 278

    Sevrin said:

    If Daz had a policy of suspending sales of items they acknowledge are defective, that might help expedite fixes.

    But they would lose money, at least in the short run.

    I was pretty surprised that they actually sell a product despite knowing that it's completely unuseable. 

    If only a small part of the whole product was affected I  could kind of understand it. 

  • Rymit DaZ3DRymit DaZ3D Posts: 7

    Richard Haseltine said:

    dortybassa said:

    I have an open ticket created 4 months ago and updated 2 months ago.  Another open for a year and last updated 9 months ago.

    I also have a ticket opened 6 months ago about Interactive Licenses not showing correctly on Order Confirmation emails.  I know this was not working still on May 1st but was automatically closed 12 days ago with no update.   Guess I could test it out and re-open but I won't be bothering.

    Well look at that, interactive licenses now show correctly on my order history :)  Well done for fixing the problem after 6 months (applause)

    There was a reall hold-up in ticket processing, at least for Technical Support tickets, after the store chnage over and with the end of year specials running - I beleive theya re now processing new tickets much more swiftly, but that still leaves some older tickets to clear out of the queue (I have a number from earlier in the year).

    Ticket responses are moving much more swiftly since we have added more people to the resolution team. However, if you will please post your ticket numbers, we can look into the older tickets you submitted.

  • ps2000ps2000 Posts: 278

    Rymit DaZ3D said:

    ps2000 said:

    FenixPhoenix said:

    ps2000 said:

    If I have a problem with a product I firstly contact the PA over the forum messaging system (if he has a user-ID). 

    In the past I got help pretty fast this way (normally within 24 hours). I normally don't even do tickets. 

    But in this case the PA who made the texture pack told me that it was a product which was comissioned by DAZ and isn't owned by him anymore.

    Furthermore the fault was caused by a change in the base product. Therefore he couldn't help me but assured me that he would contact DAZ.

    So I think in case of platinum club products the PAs aren't responsible for bugs in the product anymore and one has to go through DAZ to get help? 

    Considering my past experience I doubt that lazy/unwilling PAs are the reason that products don't get fixed.  

    Can confirm that anything that has the daz original tag is owned by Daz (meaning they paid the PA a fee and the PA signed away the product to them). So getting issues fixed for those can only be done by Daz staff themselves. 

    And this is the crux of the problem in my opinion. Often DAZ themselves won't be able to fix the problem and will have to go back to the PA. And I can't imagine that he will do it for free if DAZ has taken delivery of the product this way several months ago. 

    Please be sure to contact Customer Support for assistance. A ticket will help us track the issue and work with our QA Department to resolve any product issues.

    I already filed a ticket over a weak ago like I wrote in my first post in this thread. The whole reason for this thread was initially to get information about how long it takes until a ticket is answered.  

  • ps2000ps2000 Posts: 278

    Quick update.

    The ticket was answered six day ago. The error was acknowledged ans added to the bug tracker.

    Let's see how long it will take them to fix the error.

    I will definitely keep hanging on. 

     

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  • BlueFingersBlueFingers Posts: 904
    edited June 2021

    ps2000 said:

    Richard Haseltine said:

    ps2000 said:

    OK. 

    The thing is if I buy a defective product which doesn't work I asssume that the mistake is on my side at first.

    So I deinstall, reinstall, try several other things etc. 

    Then I have to file a ticket, answer some more or less ingenious questions and wait 2-3 days before  getting my money back. 

    That all takes a lot of time and time is money. 

    Furthermore I often don't test my bought products immediately or when I do not extensively (sometimes I buy a lot).

    So the time for a refund may be very well expired at the time I discover the defect.

    I am pretty sure that I have some more or less faulty products in my extensive library which I don't know of (for example parker road).

    So DAZ or the PA won't even get the message. 

     

    And it could all be avoided if we have a thread where one could look up the currently defective products.

    Being open about these product issues would be definitely more customer friendly.

    I mean everybody makes mistakes, but it's importmant how we deal with them.  

    The proiblem with a thread, as with the open bug tracker, is that it would be swamped with things that were not in fact bugs - feature requests, misunderstandings of what the product actually claimed to do, installation issues, lots of duplicate reportsd, and even user errors. If people want to try we won't stop them but I'm pretty sure it will run into the sand pretty quickly.

    Ok, that's understandable.

    But why does DAZ not release a list of know product issues themselves (maybe in the form of a stickied thread). I mean you must have such a list. 

    It would prevent some users from filing duplicate tickets (reducing your workload).

    It would also save your customers a lot of time.

    And I as a customer could decide if I still want to buy the defective product (for example if only a minor part of the product is defective). The result would be fewer tickets and increased customer satisfaction.

     

    I agree, it is also the decent thing to do rather then selling a defective product. Perhaps making it a part of your SLA with PA's to fix product within a certain period would help aswell.

    Post edited by BlueFingers on
  • vwranglervwrangler Posts: 4,901
    edited June 2021

    Rymit DaZ3D said:

    Ticket responses are moving much more swiftly since we have added more people to the resolution team. However, if you will please post your ticket numbers, we can look into the older tickets you submitted.

    Assuming this offer is open generally and not just to that one person:

    - Request #318906: Yvanovich Bun hair is unusably broken; has been acknowledged in bug tracker; ticket was opened 9 January 2020 (18 months ago)

    - Request #361250: dForce Elven Archer calls extra copy of G8F into scene; see also https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/462621/dforce-elven-archer-outfit-for-genesis-8-females-error for other issues from other users; has been sent to bug tracker; ticket was opened 22 December 2020 (6 months ago)

    One thing I do not understand: when a bug is confirmed in bug tracker and the product is as badly broken as Yvanovich bun hair is, why isn't there a standing policy that it's withdrawn from the store until/unless the PA provides a fix? After all, leaving it available just means that technical support/refund request tickets on the item keep appearing. That seems like an easily addressed issue.

    Post edited by vwrangler on
  • SeraSera Posts: 1,675

    @vwrangler sent you a private message.

  • SeraSera Posts: 1,675
    Rymit DaZ3D said:

    Richard Haseltine said:

    dortybassa said:

    I have an open ticket created 4 months ago and updated 2 months ago.  Another open for a year and last updated 9 months ago.

    I also have a ticket opened 6 months ago about Interactive Licenses not showing correctly on Order Confirmation emails.  I know this was not working still on May 1st but was automatically closed 12 days ago with no update.   Guess I could test it out and re-open but I won't be bothering.

    Well look at that, interactive licenses now show correctly on my order history :)  Well done for fixing the problem after 6 months (applause)

    There was a reall hold-up in ticket processing, at least for Technical Support tickets, after the store chnage over and with the end of year specials running - I beleive theya re now processing new tickets much more swiftly, but that still leaves some older tickets to clear out of the queue (I have a number from earlier in the year).

    Ticket responses are moving much more swiftly since we have added more people to the resolution team. However, if you will please post your ticket numbers, we can look into the older tickets you submitted.

    Graphic art cameras do not work with current versions of Daz and have not worked for several years. Why is this product still in the store? https://www.daz3d.com/graphic-art-cameras
  • NorthOf45NorthOf45 Posts: 5,551

    certaintree38 said:

    Rymit DaZ3D said:

    Richard Haseltine said:

    dortybassa said:

    I have an open ticket created 4 months ago and updated 2 months ago.  Another open for a year and last updated 9 months ago.

    I also have a ticket opened 6 months ago about Interactive Licenses not showing correctly on Order Confirmation emails.  I know this was not working still on May 1st but was automatically closed 12 days ago with no update.   Guess I could test it out and re-open but I won't be bothering.

    Well look at that, interactive licenses now show correctly on my order history :)  Well done for fixing the problem after 6 months (applause)

    There was a reall hold-up in ticket processing, at least for Technical Support tickets, after the store chnage over and with the end of year specials running - I beleive theya re now processing new tickets much more swiftly, but that still leaves some older tickets to clear out of the queue (I have a number from earlier in the year).

    Ticket responses are moving much more swiftly since we have added more people to the resolution team. However, if you will please post your ticket numbers, we can look into the older tickets you submitted.

    Graphic art cameras do not work with current versions of Daz and have not worked for several years. Why is this product still in the store? https://www.daz3d.com/graphic-art-cameras

    A better question would be why hasn't it been corrected when a solution was presented years ago? Is the PA unable or unwilling to make the correction? Can DAZ not get permission to implement the solution (which is still viable as of Studio 4.12)? I have seen this happen too many times for it to be a coincidence. No expectation of sales -> no chance of support -> product disappears.

  • Rymit DaZ3DRymit DaZ3D Posts: 7

    We are always striving to improve our processes and better-coordinate with QA for product resolutions. Please post your ticket numbers in this thread so our Customer Support Team can look into these further and push for an expedited resolution. Thank you.

  • Rymit DaZ3DRymit DaZ3D Posts: 7

    vwrangler said:

    Rymit DaZ3D said:

    Ticket responses are moving much more swiftly since we have added more people to the resolution team. However, if you will please post your ticket numbers, we can look into the older tickets you submitted.

    Assuming this offer is open generally and not just to that one person:

    - Request #318906: Yvanovich Bun hair is unusably broken; has been acknowledged in bug tracker; ticket was opened 9 January 2020 (18 months ago)

    - Request #361250: dForce Elven Archer calls extra copy of G8F into scene; see also https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/462621/dforce-elven-archer-outfit-for-genesis-8-females-error for other issues from other users; has been sent to bug tracker; ticket was opened 22 December 2020 (6 months ago)

    One thing I do not understand: when a bug is confirmed in bug tracker and the product is as badly broken as Yvanovich bun hair is, why isn't there a standing policy that it's withdrawn from the store until/unless the PA provides a fix? After all, leaving it available just means that technical support/refund request tickets on the item keep appearing. That seems like an easily addressed issue.

    Thank you for posting these two ticket numbers. I'm partnering with the Customer Support and QA Teams for updates.

  • barbultbarbult Posts: 24,839
    • Request #371873 was submitted on March 26, 2021 and marked as solved 6 days ago. I never even got any human response to that help request and certainly no notice that it was marked solved. 
    • Two months ago, Request #363709 was marked solved by “Marketing Team Daz” (aka Jessica). My response that the problems were NOT resolved was completely ignored and the request was closed for comments.

    This kind of "customer service" makes me just as mad as tickets that go the the bug tracker black hole never to be seen again.

  • StarrynightStarrynight Posts: 37

    Rymit DaZ3D Here is a request ticket # for Daz to stop selling Graphic Art Cameras: 378818

    It's fine if you fix it instead, but continuing to sell it after it's been broken for over 6 years is ridiculous. 

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