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IRAY V 3 DELIGHT Which is better?

sliders49sliders49 Posts: 87
in Daz Studio Discussion

Heck, the answer is easy. IRAY However there are exceptions to the rule. Look at these two renders of the characte KIM SEOHYUN for Gen 8. The figure on the left is in IRay and the one on the right i 3 Delight.  Look at her face. The 3 Delight seems to capture a crispness that we see in IRay renders but for some reason it does not apply to this model. Her face looks bland and something missing.  

Any thoughts or comments? 

ABC karen ofc 2.png
935 x 822 - 1M
exercise beach 3.jpeg
923 x 816 - 101K

Comments

  • margravemargrave Posts: 1,822

    Change Iray's pixel filter to "Box" with a value of 0.5 or lower. Then we'll see which one is crispier.

  • sliders49sliders49 Posts: 87

    "Change Iray's pixel filter to "Box" with a value of 0.5 or lower. Then we'll see which one is crispier."    Margrave

     

    At the risk of getting flamed, where do I find the iRay pixel filter ? 

  • Paper TigerPaper Tiger Posts: 108

    sliders49 said:

    "Change Iray's pixel filter to "Box" with a value of 0.5 or lower. Then we'll see which one is crispier."    Margrave

     

    At the risk of getting flamed, where do I find the iRay pixel filter ? 

    In the Render settings tab, under Filtering. Default is 1.50 I believe.

  • margravemargrave Posts: 1,822

    ronstringfellow said:

    sliders49 said:

    "Change Iray's pixel filter to "Box" with a value of 0.5 or lower. Then we'll see which one is crispier."    Margrave

     

    At the risk of getting flamed, where do I find the iRay pixel filter ? 

    In the Render settings tab, under Filtering. Default is 1.50 I believe.

    1.5 is the default, yes, however the actual Iray documentation recommends a default of 0.5. I think that's often too sharp though, so I generally set it to 1.0.

  • Paper TigerPaper Tiger Posts: 108

    Hmm ... now i kinda wanna do a comparison render, with the three settings ... 1.5, 1.0, and 0.5 ... just to see..

  • prixatprixat Posts: 1,588

    It looks more like the fuzziness caused by noise, more samples and more time is always the goto answer in Iray! yes

  • sliders49sliders49 Posts: 87

    Want to thank you guys for your feedback. 

    Here is the figure using setting of 1.0. I assume that the setting will not affect my other figures except make them sharper too. 

    Anyway, thanks again. 

    ABC test.png
    935 x 822 - 1M
  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,044
    edited September 2021

    ...basically it depnds on what effect you are after. Ifi t's photoreal, yes, Iray has the advantage (though with Wowie's AweShder in 3DL comes  very close).  For more stylised images, 3DL is better as it allows more variance, particualry with effects content in render. 

    Examples (all 3DL most without any postwrok save for using a filter or to add a signature).

     

    dogfightin' dolls cover 2.jpg
    820 x 1264 - 967K
    leela child of war toon.jpg
    1600 x 1200 - 970K
    Night Angel.jpg
    1200 x 1200 - 819K
    George lassos the moon old film.jpg
    1024 x 768 - 250K
    Leela Swimsuit Final.jpg
    1250 x 1400 - 1M
    out of the shadows fog final sig.jpg
    1064 x 1400 - 628K
    RRRR final.png
    1200 x 1200 - 2M
    uuhh mr. soldier...final.png
    1400 x 1050 - 2M
    -bus stop 1960s photo.jpg
    1500 x 1125 - 2M
    Post edited by kyoto kid on
  • 3WC3WC Posts: 1,107

    Which is better, vanilla or chocolate?

    All a matter of taste.

    And with rendering, intention, skill, and hardware. :)

  • takezo_3001takezo_3001 Posts: 1,974

    3WC said:

    Which is better, vanilla or chocolate?

    All a matter of taste.

    And with rendering, intention, skill, and hardware. :)

    Chocolate, I prefer chocolate, and iray!

    But, 3Dlite is custom made for stylistic renders and is excellent for sculpted lighting and toons... so yeah, I like both chocolate and vanilla!

  • RonH1932RonH1932 Posts: 9

    I am a rank beginner as regards Daz Studio, so maybe this is a stupid question. I've noticed that an huge number of Iray renders tend to have an distinct cool cast. In many photorealistic renders the skin--while quite beautifully rendered!--is almost blue. This applies mostly to light skin tones though it also affects dark skins, which tend toward purple. When I look around me most skin tones lean toward the warm side...tending toward orange on "white" skin and brown on "black" skin. My question is: is this an artistic choice? A characteristic of the rendering engine? The sign of a bad monitor?

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,044
    edited September 2021

    ...I have a fairly new display which is properly calibrated and see a similar situation with what is considered "neutral" lighting in Iray (6500K temperature).  This particularly happens with iinterior scenes so to compensate, I often reduce the light temperature to around 4,800K - 5,000K for a more accurate appearance. For outdoor scenes I have to mess a bit with the overall tone mapping either in the render settings by adjusting the White Point slider (which doesn't need much) or in a 2D programme to get a more natural looking sunlight colour.

    Post edited by kyoto kid on
  • PadonePadone Posts: 3,688

    @RonH1932 As KK says, tone mapping is your friend here. Both the human eyes and a real camera get ways to adapt to the overall mid tone and white balance. So what you see or perceive to see is not necessarily what a bad tone mapped rendering looks like.

  • areg5areg5 Posts: 617

    RonH1932 said:

    I am a rank beginner as regards Daz Studio, so maybe this is a stupid question. I've noticed that an huge number of Iray renders tend to have an distinct cool cast. In many photorealistic renders the skin--while quite beautifully rendered!--is almost blue. This applies mostly to light skin tones though it also affects dark skins, which tend toward purple. When I look around me most skin tones lean toward the warm side...tending toward orange on "white" skin and brown on "black" skin. My question is: is this an artistic choice? A characteristic of the rendering engine? The sign of a bad monitor?

    Iray is extremely lighting dependent. The better you get at setting up the lighting, the better and more realistic the image is. I've been using ghost lights, and I also mount two spots on the camera.  Usually I set the lighting temp to 4000 for indoor stuff.  Sure, you can get really, really good results with 3Delight.  But when you get better at Iray, those images will look better than the best 3Delight ones, IMO.

     

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,044

    ...the last attachment in the post of mine above was rendered using Parris' IBL Master and AoA Advanced Distant Lights in 3DL

    I did use a filter I created in Exposure X3 to give it a 1960s magazine photo look.

    With the AweShader system, I've seen 3DL works produced that come very close to Iray.

     

  • areg5areg5 Posts: 617

    kyoto kid said:

    ...the last attachment in the post of mine above was rendered using Parris' IBL Master and AoA Advanced Distant Lights in 3DL

    I did use a filter I created in Exposure X3 to give it a 1960s magazine photo look.

    With the AweShader system, I've seen 3DL works produced that come very close to Iray.

     

    I guess it's a matter of opinion.  I attached an Iray image that I would be hard pressed to duplicate in 3DL, which I must have used for 3 or 4 years before I switched to Iray.  Admittedly, I am not familiar with the Aweshader syster.

    w1631_spotcam_nvidia.png
    2560 x 1440 - 4M
  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,044

    ....with the AweShader it comes pretty darn close 

    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/7010516/#Comment_7010516

     

  • PerttiAPerttiA Posts: 10,024

    RonH1932 said:

    I am a rank beginner as regards Daz Studio, so maybe this is a stupid question. I've noticed that an huge number of Iray renders tend to have an distinct cool cast. In many photorealistic renders the skin--while quite beautifully rendered!--is almost blue. This applies mostly to light skin tones though it also affects dark skins, which tend toward purple. When I look around me most skin tones lean toward the warm side...tending toward orange on "white" skin and brown on "black" skin. My question is: is this an artistic choice? A characteristic of the rendering engine? The sign of a bad monitor?

    There was a change in Iray between DS versions 4.8 and 4.9 (Genesis 3 era), and the older version tends to look bluish/grayish on the newer versions.

    I can see some creators having just adjusted the rendering settings to correct it, therefore others still seeing the bluish/grayish tone.

    Doesn't matter that much when there's just one figure in the scene, but when you have more, it is sometimes a pain to get the skin tones match the same universe.

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,044

    ..that's when using a filter in post works better. 

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