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rendering cartoon mode

elidaman198elidaman198 Posts: 107
in Daz Studio Discussion

Tried rendering the attached video which took 10hrs its 2sec lol of cartoon mode in 3dlight render mode.

My friend said must be doing something wrong.... 

i have a beast pc 

AMD Ryzen 9 5900X 12-Core Processor               3.70 GHz

32g ram

rtx 3090 nvidia latest

ssd HD

Any wisdom or method to render cartoon mode and can iray do it.. or any other better method(s)

Thank you

 

somehow unable to attach a 1mb video :( so pllzzz check link https://we.tl/t-JOFpEQt2Zu

Comments

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 100,753

    How many frames is that? For 3delight the GPU is not used, but that CPU has plenty of corse to throw at 3Delight so it should be fairly speedy (for the image it is rendering).

  • juvesatrianijuvesatriani Posts: 556

    A richard said ,3Delight use CPU and your machine specs seem very capable to render your sample in lesser time than 10 hours . Unless you have so many transparency material against Lighting setup with raytrace shadow

    Would you share screenshot of lighting parameter and scene tab ? 

    Several method I`ve used to speed up 3Delight for Toon render are 

    1. Render Setting Tab > set MAX RAYTRACE DEPTH to 1
    2. Set Shading rate to 3 or 5
    3. If I must use shadow and there are lots material with opacity map/Transparency . I`ll use shadow map than Raytrace
    4. . Use AoA Light and utlizing Flag option to make lighting  ignore those material 

    optional : find in freebie forum my !JS Stylized thread if you have pwtoon 

  • elidaman198elidaman198 Posts: 107
    edited October 2021
    sorry as was a try didnt save original files... it was 60 frames used some spot lights and distant light i didnt tweak anything in render option other than choose 3dlight so did something wrong or... thanks for any wisdom also is there a way to ise gpu or cant in cartoon mode...
    Post edited by elidaman198 on
  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 100,753

    What materials/shader were you using on the surfaces?

  • elidaman198elidaman198 Posts: 107
    edited October 2021

    Richard Haseltine said:

    What materials/shader were you using on the surfaces?

    default...if that answers the questions didnt change anything except the setting to rend to cartoon and also in the prepective page to cartoon,,, then went to render 3dlight and pressed render...

    didnt play with any other dials.. its an animation of 60 frames with three lights added so can view it right...

    it just doesnt make sense took so long

     

    is there a tutorial on this somewhere or ....i am newb and slowly educating myself so hope patient with me lol

    Post edited by elidaman198 on
  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 100,753

    In that case what content was it - I wold imagine it used Iray materials.

  • elidaman198elidaman198 Posts: 107

    so here tried again and adding some images to show the steps i took.. hoping by the sequence i followed you will be able to help me plz on this. Thank you

     

    still seems like the rendering will go forever and some reason my cpu power aint used to its fullest potential...

    case1.png
    2555 x 1387 - 825K
    case2.png
    2553 x 1383 - 676K
    case3.png
    2555 x 1381 - 594K
    case4.png
    2553 x 1383 - 609K
  • elidaman198elidaman198 Posts: 107

    Richard Haseltine said:

    In that case what content was it - I wold imagine it used Iray materials.

    would it be a problem if it used iray mats....

  • 31415926543141592654 Posts: 975

    elidaman198 said:

    would it be a problem if it used iray mats....

    It certainly can ... in particular, modern iray hair (as well as skin) can take a VERY long time to render in 3delight ... as in, 99% of your image renders in 1 minute and the face and hair (just a small piece of the image) take another 15 minutes (well, that might be shorter with your machine having so many cores). It would be a good experiment to take that same simple test and make sure everything has a 3delight shader and see how long it takes.

  • elidaman198elidaman198 Posts: 107

    3141592654 said:

    elidaman198 said:

    would it be a problem if it used iray mats....

    It certainly can ... in particular, modern iray hair (as well as skin) can take a VERY long time to render in 3delight ... as in, 99% of your image renders in 1 minute and the face and hair (just a small piece of the image) take another 15 minutes (well, that might be shorter with your machine having so many cores). It would be a good experiment to take that same simple test and make sure everything has a 3delight shader and see how long it takes.

     

    well you were both right have to say as i tried my best to NOT add any iray matts and the same video (give or take small tweaks to animation) took 45sec

    so obviously if understood IRAY matts are special to relaistic rendering and make NO sense if trying to carttoon things..

    if understood right then let me know and aside of that can you pllllzzz recommend any good education video tutorials on cartoon rendering or anything of daz3d relevant.. thanks again for the help guys but made a big difffrom 10hrs LOL....

  • Silver DolphinSilver Dolphin Posts: 1,607

    If you are into animations I would suggest Blender with EVEE and the Daz to blender bridge. If you have deep pockets iclone 7 and the pipeline converter to bring daz characters into Iclone7. Iclone uses Derectx to do animations. I would only use Daz Studio for stills. You can animate in Daz Studio but I would not reccomend. You do not need more computer you have a really good system, I just don't reccomend doing animations in Daz Studio in Iray or 3Delight, maybe Filament or Opengl. Good luck

  • elidaman198elidaman198 Posts: 107

    Silver Dolphin said:

    If you are into animations I would suggest Blender with EVEE and the Daz to blender bridge. If you have deep pockets iclone 7 and the pipeline converter to bring daz characters into Iclone7. Iclone uses Derectx to do animations. I would only use Daz Studio for stills. You can animate in Daz Studio but I would not reccomend. You do not need more computer you have a really good system, I just don't reccomend doing animations in Daz Studio in Iray or 3Delight, maybe Filament or Opengl. Good luck

    probably need to read up on it but sounds like you or maybe the community can help me answer these pivotal questions before vesting into iclone...

     

    can you import all created characters you own into iclone?

    can you import their clothes/matts as shown in daz?

    can you port created animations too?

    can you also export scenes?

    Thank you for prompt responses :)

  • juvesatrianijuvesatriani Posts: 556
    edited October 2021

    Let we start in small steps right ?

    For Non Photo Realistic outcome ( cel shading - western cartoon-anime style not pixar/dreamworks styles) 3delight maybe the best choice if you opt to work exclusively in DAZ Studio , especially if you`ve already have all motion block/animation pose presets you needed . To make it work flawlesly you need to use shaders/materials - light set which dedicated or optimized  for 3Delight render engine . Yeah in some case it doesnt matter but in most cases it wil give you troubles than worth . So use dedicated 3delight shader if possible .  Thats also means you need to learn how to use those tools first .

    You can visit this thread  if you wanna to explore about Non Photo Realistic style using DAZ assets . Although most of discusiion about still image , but it will you give the insight how to get NPR styles in general and how they use another software to expanding what DAZ Studio already  offer . 

    From your specs you should have no problem rendering using CPU or GPU . But if you wanna  utlizing your MIGHTY GPU and getting same cel shading or toon style - going into another app like BLENDER or UNITY will be wise choise . You just need to find / use perfect tool to TRANSFER your DAZ contents into those apps . And yes the tool can also use to transfer DAZ animation 

    Here one of awesome tools if you need going into Blender . And visit the official site to learn about how to use it for maximal outcome . Meanwhile also check  and get this Blender Toon Shader if you into Blender 

    For UNITY , there is thread in here for start . 

     

    Post edited by juvesatriani on
  • elidaman198elidaman198 Posts: 107
    First thank you juvesatriani... call me stubborn and wish to push Daz Studios limits and daying that plan to do it all within it... so 2 things i grasp from what yoi saying, ~ be careful of the matts i use to render with 3dlight ~ use specially made matts for 3dlight Aside from that i should be fine within Daz. So i have 2 questions; 1. obviously cant choose iray matts as made for photo realistic rend on 3dlight, so have to choose the other matts... I always choose the other matts in hope they aint iray as not obvious sometimes.. 2. would buying cartoon shaders on market place aid in this issue as they aint made for iray Aside from that I plan to buy environments which i will need special matts as otherwise scenes will become too combersome to render. Never thought of porting to other platforms so will try to push Daz within reason. Hope make sense and if see anything i should correct let me know and also any tutorials to aid me in bettering to understand how to make/change shaders etc or working with 3dlight.... thank you again guys
  • juvesatrianijuvesatriani Posts: 556
    edited October 2021

    Thats cool if you wanna work only in DAZ Studio . The best tool is the one that you feel most comfortable with .

    In Daz Studio or other 3d software, as long as an object has a texture (not procedural), it is possible to convert them to be used in special shaders such as Toon Shaders or other rendering engines .So in theory, most objects which including texture maps in store should be Ok to use for Toon Render . Some toon styles even doesnt need to use Texture at all  . 

    It's just that sometimes we have to do the conversion manually or with the help of several tools that can do it automatically or in batches , Check this freebie  to make  auto conversion from IRAY materials into  3Delight . Please be aware that that tools only working great if your IRAY Materials using IRAY UBER SHADER  , Not custom ones like OOT HAIR SHADERS - 4 LAYER IRAY etc . IF your object use other than IRAY UBER SHADER your option will be doing conversion by hand or use another obejcts .  Visit link above for further informations .  You need to understand doing in 3delight means you can only use CPU for rendering .

    Something you need also keep in mind , after conversion you still need to use proper or right shader if you wanna get Toon Render .  You can try default Toon Shader which included in DAZ Studio instalation or  Visual  Style Shaders  and  Manga Shaders 

    Actually My go to toon shader for 3delight is pwToon , I have several freebie presets which came with tutorial how to use it . But it seem DAZ not sell it anymore , But you can ask DAZ support if possible for you to get copy of it .  

    Check this Youtube Video for step by step about Visual Styles Shader 

    ask to @vrba79 in this thread ,because he have experiences with DAZ Default Toon Shader

     

     

    Post edited by juvesatriani on
  • elidaman198elidaman198 Posts: 107
    edited October 2021

    juvesatriani said:

    Thats cool if you wanna work only in DAZ Studio . The best tool is the one that you feel most comfortable with .

    In Daz Studio or other 3d software, as long as an object has a texture (not procedural), it is possible to convert them to be used in special shaders such as Toon Shaders or other rendering engines .So in theory, most objects which including texture maps in store should be Ok to use for Toon Render . Some toon styles even doesnt need to use Texture at all  . 

    It's just that sometimes we have to do the conversion manually or with the help of several tools that can do it automatically or in batches , Check this freebie  to make  auto conversion from IRAY materials into  3Delight . Please be aware that that tools only working great if your IRAY Materials using IRAY UBER SHADER  , Not custom ones like OOT HAIR SHADERS - 4 LAYER IRAY etc . IF your object use other than IRAY UBER SHADER your option will be doing conversion by hand or use another obejcts .  Visit link above for further informations .  You need to understand doing in 3delight means you can only use CPU for rendering .

    Something you need also keep in mind , after conversion you still need to use proper or right shader if you wanna get Toon Render .  You can try default Toon Shader which included in DAZ Studio instalation or  Visual  Style Shaders  and  Manga Shaders 

    Actually My go to toon shader for 3delight is pwToon , I have several freebie presets which came with tutorial how to use it . But it seem DAZ not sell it anymore , But you can ask DAZ support if possible for you to get copy of it .  

    Check this Youtube Video for step by step about Visual Styles Shader 

    ask to @vrba79 in this thread ,because he have experiences with DAZ Default Toon Shader

    Thank you again and will read + research as i bought all sorts of shaders and iray shaders cartoon shaders etc on daz store... now time to learn practice and see how it all works :)

    Post edited by Richard Haseltine on
  • 31415926543141592654 Posts: 975

    So far I have chosen to do all my animation within Daz Studio.  I recognize it is not the easiest program for that purpose, but I do not want to spend the money and a great amount of time learning other systems.  That said ... once you learn the nuances of Daz Studio it can do a lot. Hopefully, you can enjoy it.

  • elidaman198elidaman198 Posts: 107

    3141592654 said:

    So far I have chosen to do all my animation within Daz Studio.  I recognize it is not the easiest program for that purpose, but I do not want to spend the money and a great amount of time learning other systems.  That said ... once you learn the nuances of Daz Studio it can do a lot. Hopefully, you can enjoy it.

    i agree with you... though for me i see that there is more upside then downside. I have much to learn but excited for what the potential is when learned right i hope.. they (daz) give love to the animation program in their platform within the future builds of daz studio...

  • juvesatrianijuvesatriani Posts: 556

    @elidaman198 I found old documentation about DAZ Default toon shader . You can check in here

  • elidaman198elidaman198 Posts: 107

    juvesatriani said:

    @elidaman198 I found old documentation about DAZ Default toon shader . You can check in here

    thank you as also reading up on shaders a lot.. and watching tutorials.. have much to learn at my age but give me a few months of playing around with it :)

     

    Thanks again and anything with toon shaders or cartoon tutorials you see send my way :)

  • elidaman198elidaman198 Posts: 107
    edited October 2021

    So a first attempt at it... two things.. i think reason its too white i didnt pout a background so its transparent and also the clouds i used dont appear too well...if look at the pic with a black background it would appear beter...

    overall any wisdom on the first try? also how can i obtain an outline to the characters to be more cartoony or this is well enough?

    Thanks :)

    trying1.png
    1280 x 720 - 921K
    Post edited by elidaman198 on
  • estheresther Posts: 624

    You can get internal lines nicely with this software - Linerender 9000

    The lines part of it even work in iray.

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