Non-photorealistic Renders (NPR)

Sammagi

A fan art 

tkdrobert

mmitchell_houston said:

I don't want to go into detail on any particular image, but I've got to admit that Topaz Clean is delivering some good results. But -- and this could just be my aesthetic and I'm now referring to the images themselves instead of Topaz Clean -- although a lof of the images look nicer, many of them still look like CGI that's been cleaned up. A lot of it has to do with the number of reflections and the lack of consistent, strong outlines. Now, I realize that not all outlines need to be strong and emulate the classic comic book style, but many of the images I'm seeing do seem to be striving for outlines, but they're not consistent. Sometimes they track along nicely when separating different material groups, but then they breakdown where you have two identical material groups. Again, this is probably my personal aesthetic speaking. There's a lot of good work going on here, but it's just that some of it might need a little more hand editing to take it to the next level of NPR.

 

I really like Photoshop to do postwork.  I pay the lowest monthy sub possible which is just below $10.  You've seen what I've done with it and with the Nix Collections plug-in.   I just wish I could afford an iPad 9 Pro or the Microsoft Surface, so I can draw changes and additions.  That would take me to the next level.  I do ok with the mouse and I have a drawing pad, but it's not the same as being able to draw like I would on a sketch pad.  Maybe someday.  My artistic journey is a little complicated.  Somethings I can draw well, just not people.  The full story is on my devaintart page.

tkdrobert

Sammy_jr_mart said:

A fan art 

Very nice.

Artini

Small pool https://www.daz3d.com/small-whimsical-pool Daz Studio iray render and then applied

Topaz Clean and Vibrance from Filter Forge.

Artini

One more example of Topaz Clean and Vibrance from Filter Forge - Ember for Aiko 3.

Martirilla

Topaz Clean looks of interest, thanks for pointing it out.  Possibly especially useful for cleaning up cartoon backgrounds which have too much detail or texture because they're from 3D.

mmitchell wrote: "I feel cut off from the Genesis products, and it is limiting what I can do."

You do know about the free DSON importer for Poser, don't you? It's at the DAZ Store. I generally have no problem importing Genesis 1 and 2 and clothes into Poser to get the Comic Book effect.  It automatically detects a DAZ file and handles the import. Fairly quick too.

For Genesis 3, you can clothe and pose, then export as FBX or OBJ then import and Comic Book it in Poser.  That's a bit clunky, admittedly. There's also a much more convoluted scripted(?) way to get Genesis 3 to Poser - which looks way too complex for me. But if you really need a non-FBX G3 in Poser, then I'm sure someone here can tell you where the script and instructions are.

 

Martirilla

tkdrobert wrote: "wish I could afford an iPad 9 Pro or the Microsoft Surface, so I can draw changes and additions.  That would take me to the next level.  I do ok with the mouse and I have a drawing pad, but it's not the same as being able to draw like I would on a sketch pad.  Maybe someday."

Take a look at the Digital Art Live magazine review of the Ugee... 

mmitchell_houston

Martirilla said:

Topaz Clean looks of interest, thanks for pointing it out.  Possibly especially useful for cleaning up cartoon backgrounds which have too much detail or texture because they're from 3D.

mmitchell wrote: "I feel cut off from the Genesis products, and it is limiting what I can do."

You do know about the free DSON importer for Poser, don't you? It's at the DAZ Store. I generally have no problem importing Genesis 1 and 2 and clothes into Poser to get the Comic Book effect.  It automatically detects a DAZ file and handles the import. Fairly quick too.

For Genesis 3, you can clothe and pose, then export as FBX or OBJ then import and Comic Book it in Poser.  That's a bit clunky, admittedly. There's also a much more convoluted scripted(?) way to get Genesis 3 to Poser - which looks way too complex for me. But if you really need a non-FBX G3 in Poser, then I'm sure someone here can tell you where the script and instructions are.

I use it often, and when it works its good, but it's not always reliable. In fact, sometimes it's downright buggy. As for the workaround for Genesis 3, that is not worth the effort. Although I do know there is supposed to be an easier way to do it. Again, the lack of testing in Poser is a problem with a lot of the newer products. 

mmitchell_houston

Knittingmommy said:

mmitchell_houston said:

Dang. I thought I was finished, but it turned out that the black outlines were too thin when I reduced it for print. So, I had to go through and manually pump them up.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm finally getting caught up after time away doing some writing.  I think this is my favorite thing.  Nicely done, MM. 

You guys have all been busy on the thread.  I love the comic stuff.  I haven't delved into comics much yet.  You guys all blow me away.  So much talent!

Glad to hear you're writing again! Gotta keep the juices flowing. Comic work is a LOT of fun, but it does take a certain mindset and approach. I am getting a little faster at it, but for now it's taking me too long. Probably because I keep trying to make everything too "perfect." Gotta pick up my speed, or my next projects will not get finished this year.

And thanks for the kind words on my work! 

tkdrobert

Really played around with this one,  Rendered it in IRAY and did a lot of PW using Photoshop and Nix.  Combined Poster Edges with Oil Paining in PS and used Photo Stylizer and Tonal Contrast in Color Efex Pro (Nix).

tkdrobert

I think I need to tweak the oil painting settings.  I may have gone a little over board.  I'll play around with it more, maybe use VSS and 3Dlight.

 

 

Martirilla

mmitchell wrote: "it's not always reliable"

Yes, and there are a few times when you open up a saved Poser scene, containing a Genesis 2 import, and the geometry has even been torn up a little. Thus, when working with G2 in Poser it's safest for people to always export an .obj of the final clothed and posed character, so there's at least a backup of your work if you need to re-render.  So I know what you mean about access to G2, in that such problems mean it's not really suitable for a production workflow (posing, re-posing, saving, etc) inside Poser.

Here's a Poser Comic Book lines render of a very heavily morphed Genesis 2 inside Poser, with the rougher skin-inking coming from an application of one of the edge-lined shaders that ship with Poser 11 (in the P11 / Materials / Cartoon / Toon folder).  He's not ideally optimised, as it takes huge amounts of fiddling around to get a character properly ready for tooning.  But it shows readers of this thread that Genesis 2 can be imported, clothed and tooned in Poser 11.  The only thing I did with Photoshop was to make the skin a little greener, and fix some tiny bits of poke-through.  You can see that the Comic Book lines have had no success on the left side of the chin, so such missing lines would be fixed if he was going into a comic or an artwork. The Comic Book lines are also mis-aligning and clipping the colours at the top of the gloves.

 

mmitchell_houston

Martirilla said:

mmitchell wrote: "it's not always reliable"

Yes, and there are a few times when you open up a saved Poser scene, containing a Genesis 2 import, and the geometry has even been torn up a little. Thus, when working with G2 in Poser it's safest for people to always export an .obj of the final clothed and posed character, so there's at least a backup of your work if you need to re-render.  So I know what you mean about access to G2, in that such problems mean it's not really suitable for a production workflow (posing, re-posing, saving, etc) inside Poser.

Here's a Poser Comic Book lines render of a very heavily morphed Genesis 2 inside Poser, with the rougher skin-inking coming from an application of one of the edge-lined shaders that ship with Poser 11 (in the P11 / Materials / Cartoon / Toon folder).  He's not ideally optimised, as it takes huge amounts of fiddling around to get a character properly ready for tooning.  But it shows readers of this thread that Genesis 2 can be imported, clothed and tooned in Poser 11.  The only thing I did with Photoshop was to make the skin a little greener, and fix some tiny bits of poke-through.  You can see that the Comic Book lines have had no success on the left side of the chin, so such missing lines would be fixed if he was going into a comic or an artwork. The Comic Book lines are also mis-aligning and clipping the colours at the top of the gloves.

All in all, that came out very nice. I really sympathize with you about the clean-up needed and the dropped/misaligned lines. I work almost exclusively in b&w, so I haven't encountered the problems you've had with the gaps in the color near his gloves. 

And you described exactly the reasons why I don't use any of the Genesis figures in Poser. They just aren't reliable -- or they can get damaged. And imported an OBJ file defeats the purpose of using 3D. Once I get the lighting where I want, I frequently need to adjust the pose (turn the neck a little to catch more light on the chin, open/shut eyes, increase brow ridges to catch/hide light). The "Live" feature of the Poser 11 Live Comic Book Preview is that you can instantly see the results with little tweaks to lights and poses. It's far more responsive than anything currently available in Daz Studio (and there are some GREAT options in DS, including Line Render 9000 and various Toon Shaders and Cameras), but they aren't quite as good as what I can get in Poser 11. The tradeoff (and it is an unfortunate one) is that I get better results by falling back on the huge library of V4 and M4 content available, and only dipping my toes into the new content occasionally.

mmitchell_houston

tkdrobert said:

I think I need to tweak the oil painting settings.  I may have gone a little over board.  I'll play around with it more, maybe use VSS and 3Dlight.

Gotta agree with you. It's a bit over done on the background. Foreground is good, although I would consider editing the red glow on Darth's chest buttons. I think they compete too much with the light sabre glow. Nice pose and scene, btw.

Artini

Poser 11 is better for the older generations of Daz figures. Even Aiko 3, XinXin looks great while applying unimesh rigging with subdivision level increased.

 

tkdrobert

mmitchell_houston said:

tkdrobert said:

I think I need to tweak the oil painting settings.  I may have gone a little over board.  I'll play around with it more, maybe use VSS and 3Dlight.

Gotta agree with you. It's a bit over done on the background. Foreground is good, although I would consider editing the red glow on Darth's chest buttons. I think they compete too much with the light sabre glow. Nice pose and scene, btw.

This was a realistic render that I decided to play around with to see if I could do a nice NPR with it.  The lightsaber and chest glow come from the IRAY Bloom settings.  It's the only way I know how to do the lightsaber glow effect in IRAY.  Problem is, it effects all the lights.  The realistic version of this render is in my 2 galleries linked below.  I think if it had started out as a NPR, it would 've turned out better.  In order to make it a true NPR, I'd have to replace all the textures in the sceane.  Vader has a lot of texture zones, so it would be time consuming.  I have't decided if I'm going to redo it as I like the realistic version.

mmitchell_houston

tkdrobert said:

mmitchell_houston said:

tkdrobert said:

I think I need to tweak the oil painting settings.  I may have gone a little over board.  I'll play around with it more, maybe use VSS and 3Dlight.

Gotta agree with you. It's a bit over done on the background. Foreground is good, although I would consider editing the red glow on Darth's chest buttons. I think they compete too much with the light sabre glow. Nice pose and scene, btw.

This was a realistic render that I decided to play around with to see if I could do a nice NPR with it.  The lightsaber and chest glow come from the IRAY Bloom settings.  It's the only way I know how to do the lightsaber glow effect in IRAY.  Problem is, it effects all the lights.  The realistic version of this render is in my 2 galleries linked below.  I think if it had started out as a NPR, it would 've turned out better.  In order to make it a true NPR, I'd have to replace all the textures in the sceane.  Vader has a lot of texture zones, so it would be time consuming.  I have't decided if I'm going to redo it as I like the realistic version.

Unless you think there's something to learn from remaking the entire image, I suggest moving on. This is a very solid image as it is. 

As for toning down the red on the chest, you could do that in photoshop. Do a soft/feathered selection around the red glow on his chest, then use the Huse/Saturation tool and select the Reds and then desaturate. GiMP has similar tools, as do most photo editing software. You could also try dabbing the area with the sponge tool (set to a soft selection and a low power). But I think it looks good, so it may just be time to move on.

Leonides02

A goblin my D&D party befriended. What could go wrong?

 

tj_1ca9500b

This is still currently a WIP.  I'm working on getting the whirlpool/portal dialed in, and I am not currently happy with the texture I'm using for the vortex (too many colors going on in the swirl, need to try again), but I'm liking the overall look here.  My intent wasn't to get the 'airbrushed' look or whatever you want to call this, but thanks to how I've set up the emissive surfaces, bloom, etc., it has really softened the faces and such in a good way I think...

The scene environment is The Pit by Midnight Stories.  The product is set up for Poser, but I've managed to get the textures working well enough.  I also punched a hole in the lava pool for the vortex underneath the pentagram.

I did some minor adjustments to the contrast, added the text, and reduced the image size 4x in Photoshop, but this is pretty much how the render looks at the moment.

wsterdan

Sammy_jr_mart said:

A fan art 

Very nice, I especially like the background and grass. Nicely done.

-- Walt Sterdan

wsterdan

tkdrobert said:

Really played around with this one,  Rendered it in IRAY and did a lot of PW using Photoshop and Nix.  Combined Poster Edges with Oil Paining in PS and used Photo Stylizer and Tonal Contrast in Color Efex Pro (Nix).

Great pict, well-done. I might try to make the characters a little more distinct from the background and, as mentioned, tone down Vadar's lights a bit, but overall a very nice image. Thanks for sharing. 

-- Walt Sterdan

Headwax

Carrara render worked up in post work using Carrar's native render passes as isolation masks.  Used Topaz Simplify and Topaz impression amongst other things.

Going for that storybook feel so pushed the saturation a wee bit.

 

 

mmitchell_houston

head wax said:

Carrara render worked up in post work using Carrar's native render passes as isolation masks.  Used Topaz Simplify and Topaz impression amongst other things.

Going for that storybook feel so pushed the saturation a wee bit.

 

Push away, push away! You nailed the "storybook" look with this image. Two thoughts: The Photoshop lens flair around the candle actually detracts from your painted look, and there seems o be a nick in the kneeling guy's sword near the tip. Probably an errant reflection, but it is distracting. Man, you are really SOLID on this technique, especially with this subject matter. 

Headwax

@mmitchell_houston 

 

hey thanks for that, yes I thought hard before I did the photoshop light flare (don'ty want to fall into cliche's)  - so good call on your part, will seek other ways in the future. I've been using Ron's brushes usually.

Ah the nick in the sword - I think that's poke through :) !!! Normally I don't worry about it cause I fix it in post , nice spotting.

thanks for the kind words !

 

cheers from Oz :

 

 

Worlds_Edge

@head wax - you could probably just remove the red part of the flare and leave the yellow in.  Looks really good, and very convincing as a storybook illustration.

mmitchell_houston

Worlds_Edge said:

@head wax - you could probably just remove the red part of the flare and leave the yellow in.  Looks really good, and very convincing as a storybook illustration.

I agree. If you nix the red ring and maybe make the interior glare a little coarser, then I think you would achieve the look you're going for.

mmitchell_houston

head wax said:

@mmitchell_houston  

hey thanks for that, yes I thought hard before I did the photoshop light flare (don'ty want to fall into cliche's)  - so good call on your part, will seek other ways in the future. I've been using Ron's brushes usually. Ah the nick in the sword - I think that's poke through :) !!! Normally I don't worry about it cause I fix it in post , nice spotting. thanks for the kind words !

cheers from Oz :

Ahhh, poke through! I see it now (the bane of all our existence! I definitely like the look you're going for. Very solid stuff. While we're on the topic, one thing I think needs another look is what's inside the chest. It looks a bit bare, and those things that are in it are unclear to me. Man, you DEFINITELY are achieving solid results. I would love to have time to experiment with this look right now, but I've got to get out some Western illustrations with a sketched/inked look before the end of the month. No time for play! Keep up the good work!

Headwax

Worlds_Edge said:

@head wax - you could probably just remove the red part of the flare and leave the yellow in.  Looks really good, and very convincing as a storybook illustration.

 

thanks @Worlds_Edge    and   @mmitchell_houston  ! I will try that :)  ! 

 

 

Headwax

mmitchell_houston said:

head wax said:

@mmitchell_houston  

hey thanks for that, yes I thought hard before I did the photoshop light flare (don'ty want to fall into cliche's)  - so good call on your part, will seek other ways in the future. I've been using Ron's brushes usually. Ah the nick in the sword - I think that's poke through :) !!! Normally I don't worry about it cause I fix it in post , nice spotting. thanks for the kind words !

cheers from Oz :

Ahhh, poke through! I see it now (the bane of all our existence! I definitely like the look you're going for. Very solid stuff. While we're on the topic, one thing I think needs another look is what's inside the chest. It looks a bit bare, and those things that are in it are unclear to me. Man, you DEFINITELY are achieving solid results. I would love to have time to experiment with this look right now, but I've got to get out some Western illustrations with a sketched/inked look before the end of the month. No time for play! Keep up the good work!

 

thank you !1 yes you are very observant. I loaded up the chest and it was full of coins with black  textures for some reason so I went and changed all the coins to gold but left the bump map on, but it was a bit of a failure - I think the uvees are out on the coins - that will teach me not to model my own stuff!

yes, you are right, there is no time for play,  thanks for the encouragment. cheers :)

 

 

Headwax

Another Carrara job. Same poor lot as last night.... Dangerous job being a Bosun. I treated the candle differently. Thanks for the c an c on the previous image !

Carrara render passes (about ten) plus a ToonPro 111 pass. Postworked in topaz simplify and impression. Attached is also two of Carrara render passes (covverage and toon pro 111) joined up.