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Daz Studio 4.20[.0.x] Pro, General Release! (*UPDATED*)

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  • AndrewJJPAndrewJJP Posts: 711

    Richard Haseltine said:

    AndrewJJP said:

    Richard Haseltine said:

    barbult said:

    GarciaLopez99 said:

    Hello, I have massive problems with hair from the vendor outoftouch in the new version 4.20. The hair is permanently black and the color cannot be changed.

    Have you updated your graphics card driver to at least the minimum required version?

    The OutOfTouch hair issue is the way nVidia has changed (corrected) the behaviour of the TopCoat effect - there is some discussion of the issue in the Public Build thread and in the change log.

    Hi Richard,

    Is there a link to the discussion? I can't find it by searching for OutOfTouch or TopCoat. Neither can I find any reference in the change log.

    If it doesn't explicitly answer this question, perhaps you could. Is it possible to use OutOfTouch hair in 4.2.0, and if so, how do you do it? Thanks!

    (I use OOT hair almost exclusively so if doesn't work, Daz 4.2.0 is useless to me until it's fixed. I can't imagine it's quite that bad though!)

    Sorry, I keep gettng that wrong - Thin fil, not top coat:

    • Implemented a partial workaround for NVIDIA Iray thin-film changes

      • Approximates (does not replicate) the previous behavior

      • Cannot fully match the previous behavior, but does match color characteristics to some extent

      • Affects reflection and transmission - the previous behavior only affected reflection

      • Cannot match three-or-more color variations

    DAZ Studio : Incremented build number to 4.16.1.3

    http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dazstudio/4/change_log_4_20_0_2#4_16_1_3 ;

    Thanks!

  • MasterstrokeMasterstroke Posts: 1,983
    edited February 2022

    IT's DOING IT AGAIN !!!
    The installer can't  finish updating the CMS. I've had this issue with the previous install and it took a hell lot of time to have it fixed.
    SORRY, I can't remember, how it got fixed.
    (sorry, really upset)
    This screenshot of the install process is for about 20 minutes during cms update. I asume the installer has frozen.

    Temporary solution:
    cancelling the install process in the task manager. This won't roll back your installation.
    DS seems to work. Let's see, if I will run into problems.

    cmsInstall.jpg
    1867 x 779 - 276K
    Post edited by Masterstroke on
  • IceCrMnIceCrMn Posts: 2,129

    as far as I know, the CMS didn't get updated.

    If it did, I didn't notice it.

    Are you sure you need the 32bit version?

    Do you already have the 64bit version installed?

    You don't need both.

  • MasterstrokeMasterstroke Posts: 1,983

    Wait, why 32bits? when I download and install DazStudio_win64.exe, why does it say 32 bit?

  • KW001KW001 Posts: 13

    AndrewJJP said:

    Padone said:

    This update breaks most materials due to the top coat and opacity emission changes. Until DAZ and the PAs are going to fix all the affected items and publish updates, I advise to stay with 4.15. Do not update to 4.20 if you don't want your scenes broken.

    edit. It is reported that 4.20 also breaks tone mapping other than materials.

    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/551726/

    Can Daz and the PAs update the products? That would mean they would require 4.2.0 in order to work I think. The fundamental issue is that Daz 4.2.0 behaves differently to earlier versions in crucial ways. I'm sure it will get sorted out, but I'm going to wait a bit to see what happens...

    The "fix" (turning on "Enable Iray Matte" in the display properties, then setting the Opacity map to empty and  Opacity value 0.01) actually works in 4.16 as well so it wouldn't break those products for people who use them in new scenes going forward.

    The only difference is that in 4.16 the Luminance value can be left the same, while in 4.20 it needs to be multiplied x100 to compensate for the new Opacity influence to light output.

    In any previously-made scenes, the ghostlights would have to be replaced by updated versions and the lighting tweaked again.

  • IceCrMnIceCrMn Posts: 2,129

    Not sure, but I would reboot the PC to make sure nothing Daz related is running then I would delete the download files for the CMS installer then try to install it.

    Maybe a bad download or something.

  • ameliajanemurphameliajanemurph Posts: 26

    GarciaLopez99 said:

    Ok thanks everyone. A rollback seems to be the best way to me. How do you rollback?
  • ameliajanemurphameliajanemurph Posts: 26

    How do you rollback?

  • areg5areg5 Posts: 617
    edited February 2022

    ameliajanemurph said:

    How do you rollback?

    It ain't easy, if you didn't save a copy of the version you want to roll back to.  Finding it online can be tough.  When I want to roll back, provided I have a copy of the version I want to roll back to, what I do is uninstall the current version using DIM.  Then I delete the file in DIM downloads.  Then copy the good version into DIM downloads, then run dim.  It will install the version you want.  Just avoid the temptation of updating DAZ until you're sure you want it. Based on what's going on with this latest update I can see I'll be using 4.16 for a while.

    Post edited by areg5 on
  • barbultbarbult Posts: 24,240

    ameliajanemurph said:

    How do you rollback?

    Did you save a backup copy of the DIM download files for Daz Studio and the Daz plugins before you updated? If you did, you can copy them to the DIM install folder and reinstall them to roll back.

    Did you backup your whole computer before you updated Daz Studio? If so, maybe a restore there is an option.

    If you didn't bother to make a backup, you will have to submit a help request and beg customer service for an older version. They are under no obligation to preserve or distribute old versions, so that request may not be granted.

    It would be illegal for anyone other than Daz 3D to give you the files.

    The lesson is, always make a backup before installing a new version. 

  • AndrewJJPAndrewJJP Posts: 711
    edited February 2022

    KW001 said:

    AndrewJJP said:

    Padone said:

    This update breaks most materials due to the top coat and opacity emission changes. Until DAZ and the PAs are going to fix all the affected items and publish updates, I advise to stay with 4.15. Do not update to 4.20 if you don't want your scenes broken.

    edit. It is reported that 4.20 also breaks tone mapping other than materials.

    https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/551726/

    Can Daz and the PAs update the products? That would mean they would require 4.2.0 in order to work I think. The fundamental issue is that Daz 4.2.0 behaves differently to earlier versions in crucial ways. I'm sure it will get sorted out, but I'm going to wait a bit to see what happens...

    The "fix" (turning on "Enable Iray Matte" in the display properties, then setting the Opacity map to empty and  Opacity value 0.01) actually works in 4.16 as well so it wouldn't break those products for people who use them in new scenes going forward.

    The only difference is that in 4.16 the Luminance value can be left the same, while in 4.20 it needs to be multiplied x100 to compensate for the new Opacity influence to light output.

    In any previously-made scenes, the ghostlights would have to be replaced by updated versions and the lighting tweaked again.

    Thanks. That sounds promising, so probably just an inconvenience I guess.

    What I'm more troubled by is the report that OutOfTouch hair doesn't work. I know the reason now, but knowing why it's broken doesn't help.  sad

    It can't really be that bad can it? Surely the forum would be alight with complaints if one of the top vendor's products have been "rendered" useless? I've spent a fortune on that hair, I have pretty much all of it, and other than an occasional go with Windfield hair, I don't ever use anything else.

    I'm in no rush to upgrade, so I'll wait until everything stabilises I think..

    Post edited by AndrewJJP on
  • f7eerf7eer Posts: 123
    edited February 2022
    What I'm more troubled by is the report that OutOfTouch hair doesn't work. I know the reason now, but knowing why it's broken doesn't help.  sad

     

    I haven't run across any OOT hair that is broken in 4.20. For example, "OOT Top Updo" hair is not broken in 4.20. "2021-16 Hair" is not broken. "2021-13 Hair" is not broken. If someone thinks any OOT hair is broken, I'd like to know which one it is.

    Post edited by f7eer on
  • maraichmaraich Posts: 492

    I rolled back to 4.15, and I'm happy to see that the ROG products look good again. I'll give 4.2 a go again once a few things get straightened out.

  • barbultbarbult Posts: 24,240
    edited February 2022

    f7eer said:

    What I'm more troubled by is the report that OutOfTouch hair doesn't work. I know the reason now, but knowing why it's broken doesn't help.  sad

     

    I haven't run across any OOT hair that is broken in 4.20. For example, "OOT Top Updo" hair is not broken in 4.20. "2021-16 Hair" is not broken. "2021-13 Hair" is not broken. If someone thinks any OOT hair is broken, I'd like to know which one it is.

    Same here - no problem found so far. I tried Classic Bob and 2021-02 Hair. Both worked perfectly as far as I can see. 
    DS 4.20.0.2, Nvidia Studio Driver 511.17, Windows 10, RTX graphics card, HDRI lighting

    My test renders are attached.

     

    Teen Josie 8 Capri Outfit OOT Classic Bob.jpg
    2000 x 1500 - 1M
    Teen Josie 8 Capri Outfit OOT 2021-02 Hair.jpg
    2000 x 1500 - 1M
    Post edited by barbult on
  • GarciaLopez99GarciaLopez99 Posts: 4

    ameliajanemurph said:

    How do you rollback?

    I simply installed the 4.16  

  • AndrewJJPAndrewJJP Posts: 711

    f7eer said:

    What I'm more troubled by is the report that OutOfTouch hair doesn't work. I know the reason now, but knowing why it's broken doesn't help.  sad

     

    I haven't run across any OOT hair that is broken in 4.20. For example, "OOT Top Updo" hair is not broken in 4.20. "2021-16 Hair" is not broken. "2021-13 Hair" is not broken. If someone thinks any OOT hair is broken, I'd like to know which one it is.

    Thanks, and thanks too to @barbult, that looks great!

    It makes sense to me. Ghost lights don't work, and lots of people talk about it, but not much about this one made me wonder.

    I'm still worried about the upgrade though, not because of this, and not because of ghost lights, I just worry laugh

  • barbultbarbult Posts: 24,240

    AndrewJJP said:

    f7eer said:

    What I'm more troubled by is the report that OutOfTouch hair doesn't work. I know the reason now, but knowing why it's broken doesn't help.  sad

     

    I haven't run across any OOT hair that is broken in 4.20. For example, "OOT Top Updo" hair is not broken in 4.20. "2021-16 Hair" is not broken. "2021-13 Hair" is not broken. If someone thinks any OOT hair is broken, I'd like to know which one it is.

    Thanks, and thanks too to @barbult, that looks great!

    It makes sense to me. Ghost lights don't work, and lots of people talk about it, but not much about this one made me wonder.

    I'm still worried about the upgrade though, not because of this, and not because of ghost lights, I just worry laugh

    Stop just worrying and do something about it!

    1. Save a backup copy of the current version of the DIM installer zip and dsx files for Daz Studio and the plugins that were updated at the same time. Hopefully you didn't delete those DIM packages after you installed them. You must do this BEFORE you download the updated version - not just before you install, but before you download via DIM. If you save the current DIM files and the update goes south on you, you can copy the saved files back to the DIM Downloads folder and reinstall the old version. I always save a copy of the installer files right after I download them, so I don't forget months down the road and  carelessly overwrite them with an update.
    2. If you are currently running the 4.16 or earlier release version, you can download and install the 4.20 beta version. It will not overwrite your good release version and you can try 4.20 safely in the beta version. If you are currently using an older beta instead of the release, you can download and install the 4.20 release and try it. The point is that beta and release are independent and can exist on the same computer and not interfere with each other.
  • AndrewJJPAndrewJJP Posts: 711
    edited February 2022

    barbult said:

    AndrewJJP said:

    f7eer said:

    What I'm more troubled by is the report that OutOfTouch hair doesn't work. I know the reason now, but knowing why it's broken doesn't help.  sad

     

    I haven't run across any OOT hair that is broken in 4.20. For example, "OOT Top Updo" hair is not broken in 4.20. "2021-16 Hair" is not broken. "2021-13 Hair" is not broken. If someone thinks any OOT hair is broken, I'd like to know which one it is.

    Thanks, and thanks too to @barbult, that looks great!

    It makes sense to me. Ghost lights don't work, and lots of people talk about it, but not much about this one made me wonder.

    I'm still worried about the upgrade though, not because of this, and not because of ghost lights, I just worry laugh

    Stop just worrying and do something about it!

    1. Save a backup copy of the current version of the DIM installer zip and dsx files for Daz Studio and the plugins that were updated at the same time. Hopefully you didn't delete those DIM packages after you installed them. You must do this BEFORE you download the updated version - not just before you install, but before you download via DIM. If you save the current DIM files and the update goes south on you, you can copy the saved files back to the DIM Downloads folder and reinstall the old version. I always save a copy of the installer files right after I download them, so I don't forget months down the road and  carelessly overwrite them with an update.
    2. If you are currently running the 4.16 or earlier release version, you can download and install the 4.20 beta version. It will not overwrite your good release version and you can try 4.20 safely in the beta version. If you are currently using an older beta instead of the release, you can download and install the 4.20 release and try it. The point is that beta and release are independent and can exist on the same computer and not interfere with each other.

    Thanks! I guess the beta would be easier, I didn't think of that!

    I'll try after work. I will now start worrying about the beta breaking my content (as reported in "The Commons" the other day) and whether I can mix DIM and DC installations. Those are not questions BTW, that's just how my mind works. I'm a software developer, we tend to anticipate issues, it kind of goes with the job...

    Post edited by AndrewJJP on
  • barbultbarbult Posts: 24,240

    AndrewJJP said:

    Thanks! I guess the beta would be easier, I didn't think of that!

    I'll try after work. I will now start worrying about the beta breaking my content (as reported in "The Commons" the other day) and whether I can mix DIM and DC installations. Those are not questions BTW, that's just how my mind works. I'm a software developer, we tend to anticipate issues, it kind of goes with the job...

    If you've never used the DS beta before, you will first need to "purchase" it for $0 in the store, to get it added to your product library. Then you can download and install it with DIM. Release and beta can use the same content library. Just map to the same library in the Content Manager.

  • vrba79vrba79 Posts: 1,357

    Well, I'm pleased to say that 3DL shaders like PWToon still work just fine.

  • rokkrrokkr Posts: 163

    Awful update... a render that used to take 30 seconds now is taking more than 3 minutes and counting (a  simple small portrait of a character with and HDRI background/light, no clothes and the lightest hair available; 540x720p)... Is Daz trying to destroy itself? I was thinking about spending a lot during this Presidential sale but now I'll withhold to see if they'll fix the issues and the software we'll still be useful... or maybe I'll try Poser or Blender. A lesson in how to shoot your own feet... And the render ended by now while I was writing... I think it took more than four minutes. And it's not because my computer is crap because, as I said, the same thing would take less than a minute with the same setup; between half a minute and a minute depending on the character and skin... In fact, I had another setup a lil more complicated (with 2 ghost lights) and with clothes and heavier hair, in the worst scenario, it would take what took now with this pathetic bare-minimum setup.

  • AndrewJJPAndrewJJP Posts: 711

    barbult said:

    AndrewJJP said:

    Thanks! I guess the beta would be easier, I didn't think of that!

    I'll try after work. I will now start worrying about the beta breaking my content (as reported in "The Commons" the other day) and whether I can mix DIM and DC installations. Those are not questions BTW, that's just how my mind works. I'm a software developer, we tend to anticipate issues, it kind of goes with the job...

    If you've never used the DS beta before, you will first need to "purchase" it for $0 in the store, to get it added to your product library. Then you can download and install it with DIM. Release and beta can use the same content library. Just map to the same library in the Content Manager.

    Thanks, I "bought" it yesterday. I'll probably stick it on my laptop as that uses DIM exclusively and it's not so important.

    There are some overlay geoshell products I want to test...

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 100,804

    rokkr said:

    Awful update... a render that used to take 30 seconds now is taking more than 3 minutes and counting (a  simple small portrait of a character with and HDRI background/light, no clothes and the lightest hair available; 540x720p)... Is Daz trying to destroy itself? I was thinking about spending a lot during this Presidential sale but now I'll withhold to see if they'll fix the issues and the software we'll still be useful... or maybe I'll try Poser or Blender. A lesson in how to shoot your own feet... And the render ended by now while I was writing... I think it took more than four minutes. And it's not because my computer is crap because, as I said, the same thing would take less than a minute with the same setup; between half a minute and a minute depending on the character and skin... In fact, I had another setup a lil more complicated (with 2 ghost lights) and with clothes and heavier hair, in the worst scenario, it would take what took now with this pathetic bare-minimum setup.

    It's probably dropped to CPU because your GPU driver is too old - update and it is likely to be about the same speed as before.

  • SabbySabby Posts: 108

    I've reached out to the support at Daz3D and haven't recieved any reply regarding why this is happening, I can not determine what is causing it, I thought it was an issue of case sensitivity but that is solving the issue, so unfortunately until someone gets back to me, I am at a loss. However, I have seen these messages regarding SASE products and we are trying to find a solution.

     

    The products load correctly despite the message, even the texture that the error claims it can not find, is in the right place when it loads.

  • DoctorJellybeanDoctorJellybean Posts: 8,464

    Sabby said:

    I've reached out to the support at Daz3D and haven't recieved any reply regarding why this is happening, I can not determine what is causing it, I thought it was an issue of case sensitivity but that is solving the issue, so unfortunately until someone gets back to me, I am at a loss. However, I have seen these messages regarding SASE products and we are trying to find a solution.

     

    The products load correctly despite the message, even the texture that the error claims it can not find, is in the right place when it loads.

    According to the DAZ Studio log, this is the error message:

    Could not resolve: /textures/SASE/Marina/SASEMarinaEyesB_1007.jpg

    It seems that it is referring to /textures/.... instead of Runtime/ textures/....

    So maybe your code is missing Runtime?

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 100,804

    DoctorJellybean said:

    Sabby said:

    I've reached out to the support at Daz3D and haven't recieved any reply regarding why this is happening, I can not determine what is causing it, I thought it was an issue of case sensitivity but that is solving the issue, so unfortunately until someone gets back to me, I am at a loss. However, I have seen these messages regarding SASE products and we are trying to find a solution.

     

    The products load correctly despite the message, even the texture that the error claims it can not find, is in the right place when it loads.

    According to the DAZ Studio log, this is the error message:

    Could not resolve: /textures/SASE/Marina/SASEMarinaEyesB_1007.jpg

    It seems that it is referring to /textures/.... instead of Runtime/ textures/....

    So maybe your code is missing Runtime?

    I just had a look at the main, all maps, file for SASE Jazz For Sahira 8, which shows the issue. In the .duf file there ar several lines where the path strts with two slashes isntead of 1

    //Runtime/Textures/SASE/Jazz/SASEJazzEyes05_1007.jpg

    and fixing those allows the file to open without error.

  • SabbySabby Posts: 108
    edited February 2022

    I was just coming to update this, cause I found that two slash issue just a few minutes ago, myself. It is weird that JSON validators and none of the previous versions of Daz|Studio had any issues loading it, but I am going to be issuing updates to every product with this error at Renderosity. 

     

    Thank you both for your help on this too. I wasn't checking back here, but I do appreciate it very much! <3

    Post edited by Sabby on
  • mikethe3dguymikethe3dguy Posts: 515

    Since upgrading, the render progress window no longer reports whether it's using the GPU or falling back to CPU.

  • robertswwwrobertswww Posts: 790

    @Sabby After seeing @Richard Haseltine's post (above), I manually went through the SASE Jazz for Sahira 8 files too.

    I can confirm that the file: Jazz All Maps.duf has 3 instances of the //Runtime (double slash) mistake (opened in Notepad to verify).

    All 10 eye color materials have the //Runtime mistake twice in each of the 10 .duf files.

    Also, if you manually try and extract the IM00069579-01_SASEJazzforSahira8.zip file, there is 1 unspecified error in extracting this duf file: Jazz LIE 00 Options.duf

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 100,804
    edited February 2022

    robertswww said:

    @Sabby After seeing @Richard Haseltine's post (above), I manually went through the SASE Jazz for Sahira 8 files too.

    I can confirm that the file: Jazz All Maps.duf has 3 instances of the //Runtime (double slash) mistake (opened in Notepad to verify).

    All 10 eye color materials have the //Runtime mistake twice in each of the 10 .duf files.

    Also, if you manually try and extract the IM00069579-01_SASEJazzforSahira8.zip file, there is 1 unspecified error in extracting this duf file: Jazz LIE 00 Options.duf

    I would suspect the last is a 0-byte empty file to make an informational thumbnail appear in the cotnent library. Some zip tools don't like those.

    Post edited by Richard Haseltine on
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