Prominent/Bucked Teeth - the best way to do this?
clivewil2
Posts: 129
hello all.
as per the title, i have been trying to set up a way of doing prominent front teeth which i can dial in to whichever figure i want (just doing G8F for now)
i am trying to aim for a cute/friendly appearance, NOT a goofy look - think Felicity Jones, not Bugs Bunny.
i have made 3 custom morphs:
1 Head - moves the lower jaw back slightly, moves all front teeth forward slightly so they are closer to the upper lip.
2. Teeth - extends the upper central incisors downward, very VERY slightly outward, also makes them a tiny bit wider with a very slight central gap
3. Lips - creates a incisors-width indent on the lower lip (and a really small peak under the upper lip) for when the mouth is closed
using 3 separate morphs should let me fine-tune things better than if i'd done all the above in a single morph, or that's the plan anyway
right now i'm winging it by trying to get a combination that looks right, without knowing how they should *really* be done. i'm kinda sorta ok with how it's going so far, but it could be better (or can it? i find the lower lip doesn't have enough polys for me to make the exact shaped dent that i want)
pic shows the current state of things, perhaps dialed in a bit too high but suitable for demo purposes
any advice to help me make them look more natural? - something i may have missed or not considered? a better approach perhaps?
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Comments
looks good to me. Also, why do they call it buck teeth. Shoulda called it wabbit teeth.
thanks, after trying several other configs of morphs i ended up reverting back to those versions i used in the pic, so i'll just make do with those
i think it's one of those cases where, if i'm trying to find a 'one size fits all' solution, then near enough will have to be good enough.
yeah i never really understood the name either.
An adult male rabbit is called a "buck"; females are "does"... so they are calling it "wabbit teeth"/
Or you sure you really want buck teeth or an overbite? An overbite makes the entire front jaw stick out, so it technically covers buck teeth.
The actress who plays Maggie from The Walking Dead has something like that:
yep, i want both - buck teeth and an overbite.
in this pic of Ms. Jones you can see her upper lip is mostly straight, and the lower lip moves down to make way for her teeth. (i just watched Rogue One and took note of her side shots. in her side profile her jaw seems to be recessed a bit too)
in your pic you can see that it's mainly her upper lip that is raised, instead of the lower lip being pushed down - that to me is a separate thing altogether than what i'm trying to achieve here, but it is also on my list of morphs to make.
Daz PA maelwenn has a figure bundle 'Evelyn and Lynn' for sale here that has exactly that same upper lip morph, so i might either still try to make it myself, or probably take the easy way out and buy Evelyn and Lynn and use maelwenn's mouth morph (i am assuming that's what the 'lips open - apply/remove' preset is referring to)
https://www.daz3d.com/evelyn--lynn-hd-for-genesis-8-female
If you installed the G8F starter essentials, it comes with a Jaw Out-In morph, which can give you an overbite.
The essentials also come with a Lip Top Up-Down morph which moves the upper lip only, showing the teeth. But that moves the entire upper lip. To only lift the middle part, you would probably have to use something like the Open Mouth Morph from Evelyn & Lynn.
it also has a Lip Bottom Up-Down too but not quite what i was after, all of those morphs move the lips in front of the teeth, i am trying to simulate a lip being moved *by* the teeth.
the upper lip isn't a problem, it's relatively straightforward and doesn't need any change to the jaw alignment or proximity to the teeth, or the teeth themselves
the lower lip thing concerned me because i wasn't sure exactly what i should move or modify - e.g. do i simply move the lower jaw back to give me the overbite, or do i scale it back? do i angle the upper central teeth forward or move the whole upper teeth forward? etc. etc. - so, right now i have settled on a combination of:
- lower jaw slightly back
- all upper teeth tiny bit forward
- upper incisors longer and slightly angled forwards.
- dent in lower lip when mouth is closed
it seems to work okay-ish.
If I had to do it, I would move the jaw back until there's nothing underneath the front two teeth. Then slightly angle out the front teeth.
But, you know, just because someone has a overbite, it doesn't mean their teeth are necessarily crooked. I think their teeth can still grow straight, so I probably wouldn't even try to angle them.
what about the bottom lip? that's the main part of this equation, what happens to it when the mouth is closed?
this whole thing came about due to a friend of my mother's, she had an extreme case and when her mouth was shut her incisors sat very visibly on the outside of the lower lip.
the usual 'how would i do that in DS' followed and it all went on from there.
I think that's up to you. There are morphs for the skull, and morphs for the skin. You can find good reference pictures if you Google for 'overbite skull'. If you move the jaw, I think the skin is going to automatically move too, as the skin follows the bone to some extent. So, I would setup the bone morphs first to see what the jaw looks like, before moving on to the skin morphs. BTW, you can turn off the visibility of the face skin in Daz Studio to see the skull better for jaw alignment.
i was a bit disappointed that i'd made my head morph (jaw) a little understated and was planning on re-doing it, i'm ashamed to say that it didn't occur to me until just now to break the limit on my first attempt and set the new limit to 200% - that seems to work ok and doesn't look too unnatural, and though i'll never dial it to 200%, 120 -150 are quite possible. at least that's one thing i don't have to re-do.
on the teeth i had made a small increase in the gap between them, but because the morph is so extreme, you never get to see the gap because the morph is always dialed in very low. so that one i *will* have to re-do. one day. not today.
I managed to spot an excellent reference in Rogue One the other night, a good clear segment of Ms. Jones from the side showing the mouth both closed and slightly open, confirming my guess as to what should be where
with apologies to Mara, my poor figure who is suffering so much in the name of science, this is the current state of my morph set - i'll re-do the teeth but the rest can stay as is.