EVGA no longer doing business with NVidia.
gsil247
Posts: 224
in The Commons
Not sure if its against terms of service, so I won't post a YouTube or news link, but RIP to EVGA whom was my go to for GPU's.
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That is a bummer-I had a great experience with EVGA and the 3090.
Same here friend.
I only have ever bought from EVGA. Well that sucks.
Me too, they were always reliable. I even have a 3090ti from EVGA in my wishlist at Amazon right now. :(
Same as everyone else. :(
It is not a rumor or speculation. It is indeed a confirmed fact. GamersNexus does their best to present both sides of the story, so I don't see how that can be against TOS.
This stings. I've talked about my own experience with EVGA, where they replaced my 1080ti that died from a storm lightning strike. I bought that card used off eBay, so I wasn't the original owner, and that seamless experience won me over as a customer big time.
I bought a 3090 Founder's card, but I didn't have much choice because...you know...2021. Still my plan was either EVGA or Founder's, or bust. However I did manage to get the EVGA 3060 model, I had no plans to buy any other brand.
I don't have any idea what brand I will get next time I upgrade. :(
I saw the news on Tomshardware, but wasn't sure if linking sites is violation or not. I know on other forums elsewhere it is, so I wasn't sure. And I'm in the same boat as far as what brand to go next. Have to do my research now.
https://www.theverge.com/2022/9/16/23357031/evga-nvidia-graphics-cards-stops-making
"The company claims that Nvidia wouldn’t tell EVGA how much it would have to pay to obtain GPU cores before publicly announcing the price of cards like the RTX 3080, which made it difficult for EVGA to figure out how much it would have to charge for its own products, built around Nvidia’s tech. According to JayzTwoCents, Nvidia sent the drivers required to take full advantage of its GPUs to journalists before it sent them to EVGA and would keep the manufacturer in the dark about how many GPUs it would get to integrate into its own designs and products."
"Gamers Nexus also reports that EVGA has to sell high-end cards like the RTX 3080 or 3090 at a loss of “hundreds of dollars” in order to keep its prices even remotely competitive with Nvidia’s own Founders Edition cards."
Who manufactures Founders cards? "Founders Edition is Nvidia's fancy term for the reference cards they release with every new chip they design. For those who are still not aware, Nvidia has partnered with other companies, known as add-in board (AIB) partners, to do the actual manufacture of the graphics cards containing the GPUs they design."
NVIDIA undermining it's GPU manufacturing partners. Too much power. Thank goodness EVGA is a tech company with the foresight to manufacture other tech. I had at least one EVGA card in the early 2000's.
Man what a sad list - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_defunct_graphics_chips_and_card_companies
Against whose terms of service? I don't get it.
"This is not a financial decision - it is a principled decision"
Uh OK . . . what an odd statement considering how much of EVGA's business video cards account for! It couldn't have anything to do with the roughly 10 million used cards that have no mining to do anymore hitting the market, could it?
I would encourage people to consider getting some info other than just that Gamers Nexus video. I feel bad for the people who work there.
- Greg
didn't they have the biggest problems lately?
but they had great guarantee and fair prices. always not great to lose some manufacturers.
I wasn't sure if it was against Daz's terms of service becuase other forums (not Daz), its against there terms to talk about anything other then them, such as video game forums.
I saw it as well. I think my first Nvidia card was from them.
I just bought two EVGA 3090s and was so happy with them that I had decided to stick with them in the future, after I had a mixed experience with Gigabyte support.
This is sad news. I've been a happy EVGA customer since 780ti, and despite heavy gaming and rendering use not a single one of my cards have ever burned or got damaged, so I was planning to get the next 4000 series card from EVGA also. While I understand EVGA CEO reasoning, I can't really say I support it. If it got too stressful for him to work with Nvidia antics, he should have stepped down or relocate to head or the board or something, and leave CEO position to someone younger who could have handled Nvidia. If he is retiring soon, even selling the company would have been a better solution. Seems really unfair that because CEO is getting tired and wants to spend time with his family, hundreds of their empoyees will get fired. I hope those people find new jobs, since they've been making fantastic job for years.
..a sad announcement.
My old Maxwell Titan-X is EVGA and it still soldiers on without issue in spite of the latest version of Iray in Daz that requires it to emulate the new RTX cards thus losing some of its VRAM.
I purchased a 3060 about a year ago at a very good price direct from EVGA (when 3060s were going for upwards of 750$ to even 1,000$) which I unfortunately discovered is not recognised by my old motherboard's BIOS So looking to perform an upgrade so I can make use of it, but right now the funds are not there (LGA 2011-3 workstation/server boards are not cheap).
Hearing this, I need to consider the Mythology contest as it may be the only way I can get an EVGA 3090.
Several years ago Apple broke up with Nvidia over disagreements and the latest verion of iOS does no longer supports Nviia drivers. so for Mac users its back to glacial CPU rendering. with Daz.
Here's another one:
So they just exit the GPU market completely just because of that? That makes no sense. Mining is not a new thing. Recessions are not a new thing. The exact same thing happened with major mining booms in 2014 and 2017, followed by an equally major bust. You ride this rough patch out and you will be fine. Every business has to understand this. On a side note I bought both my 1080tis during the 2018 bust period.
The 4090 is going to double the 3090 performance. Double. There are people who want the fastest, well, there's your fastest. People bought 3090s for over $2500, some are in this forum right now. The 4090 is still going to sell because of course it will. 3090s can drop to $600 (which I am predicting) and 4090s will still sell reasonably well because, again, they double the performance. We have people here already chomping at the bit anticipating the 4090. The 4080 will also easily beat the 3090. I don't see a massive problem here, because the cards Nvidia is releasing this year are all going to destroy the existing 3000 cards by a mile. People will buy these cards because even during a recession there are still enough people doing fine, just like there were enough people doing well enough to buy $2500 3090s for almost 2 years. While miners bought a lot of cards, miners didn't really buy at those prices. The big miners bought in bulk, they bought entire pallets. If you look at the mining Reddits you will find people talking about how the distributors only sell bulk in quantities starting at 100 or so. These people were not buying from Newegg, they were competing with Newegg by buying straight from the distributors up the supply chain. That is why Newegg didn't have cards. Nvidia also stated that they sold directly to miners in their financial reports, which confirms this. But the distributors under Nvidia were also selling directly to miners. Miners were paying prices that Newegg paid, not prices we paid. It is important to understand this, because it needs to be understood that people paid the high prices for Ampere.
If people were paying $2500+ for a 3090 for so long, why wouldn't they do it again for a 4090 that is twice as fast and possibly cost a little less? The situation is not as dire as people make it out to be. Plus these companies all made mad money for almost 2 years. They should have enough in the bank to deal with the down turn. If they don't, that is poor management.
GamersNexus broke this story, there was a rumor the day before, but GN actually spoke directly to EVGA and their CEO. Who else has done that? Now their story is backed up by additional sources like Jay2Cents. Also, Moore's Law Is Dead spoke at length how angry the AIBs have been at Nvidia over 2 years ago about the BOM costs of Ampere cards. The 3060 in particular was a serious sticking point, as the parts needed to build a 3060 simply did not line up with the MSRP...and when you look at how the 3050 and 3060 continue to sell for high prices even now, I think it shows just how their MSRPs were never realistic. This was long before the crypto crash.
You can go even further back to when Nvidia first introduced the "Founder's Edition" branding. Nvidia had certainly made reference cards in year's past, but they were basic cards. The Founder's Edition changed all of that. Since its introduction, the FE has drastically improved each generation. Today Founder's Editions are factory overclocked themselves, and the 3090 FE possibly has the best air cooler design of all the cards available, but it also costs the least. It was the only card you could get at MSRP if you got lucky for a long time, which I happened to be one of the lucky people who scored a MSRP $1500 3090 during the crypto madness. If you go back to when the FE line started in 2016, you will also find talk about how the AIBs were not happy with having to compete with Nvidia. 3rd Party cards used to always be better, and they cost more because they were built a little better with better coolers. The FE flipped that, and Nvidia had the huge advantage of being vertically intigrated. Someone (I can't recall who) predicted way back in 2016 that Nvidia could wind up killing off its own AIBs because of the FE cards. I can't help but think about that today. The FE is certainly a big part of what happened here.
So the BOM costs are bad enough, but now you have Nvidia's own FE cards to compete with as well? That is a real one-two punch to the gut there.
EVGA shocked everyone in June 2021 when they announced they would produce AMD motherboards, that was the first time in their 20+ year history of building an AMD product. Back at that time there were rumors of EVGA possibly making AMD GPUs as well. EVGA has been tied super close to Nvidia all this time, so even though a motherboard has little to do with GPUs, the simple fact that EVGA was working with AMD at all was a surprise to everyone. Even people close to EVGA were surprised by the AMD motherboards. Looking back, this was possibly the start of their break up with Nvidia. In today's video GamerNexus mentioned that EVGA was not expanding their product lines after dropping Nvidia, but really, EVGA already expanded BEFORE this breakup by adding all these new products over the past year or two. I think GN overlooked this aspect.
Earlier this year, right as crypto started to crash, Moore's Law Is Dead stated that there was a "AIB revolt" against Nvidia. Considering the timing of that, and that EVGA stated they informed Nvidia of this breakup in April, that is right after the AIB revolt that MLID talked about. April was also a key time for production of engineering samples, so perhaps EVGA also didn't like what they saw. The rumors about the crazy 450 Watt and even 600 Watt beasts were already around. MLID would further state that Nvidia bought over supply stock of cards back from AIBs. This and they also pushed the original Lovelace launch date back a couple months. This was all to appease the AIBs so they could get rid of some stock.
So this has been building up for a while, since at least 2016, and in 2022 it all came to a head. The shock is that is ever got to this point.
I figured that Nvidia would do something more to keep EVGA happy. They have been building Nvidia cards for over 20 years. Surely whatever problems they had over the BOM costs and things would be worked out. I was completely wrong.
This will be interesting to say the least. As I commented on Jayz2Cents video, Nvidia may want to be careful with what comes next, as all the AIB's may well stop producing Nvidia products altogether.
And that this may need to happen so as to teach Nvidia not to treat their partners and customers like garbage.
And Jensen Huang would probably be totally happy with that. GN reported that the sentimentality at nVidia is that Jensen Huang doesn't give a crap about AIBs and that it's *his* company's hard work that companies like EVGA, PNY, Asus, etc are profiting off of by reselling nVidia chips.
The problem there is that not everywhere can get Founders Edition cards, and have to rely on AIB's for Nvidia products. But if Jensen Huang thinks like that, then I reckon that there will be a few people out there who are willing to give Nvidia the bird and go to AMD instead.
EVGA's decision reduces choice and competition in the market and that's bad. I like Asus - I buy theri mobos whenever I build a system and the 3060 I bought is a well-engineered, stout card. I think Gigabyte is also a good choice for graphics cards. I haven't had one, but they are generally well-reviewed. So, EVGA will be missed, but the graphcs card industry is not ending.
I'm sure EVGA made fine graphics cards, but the thing I heard most about them is their long warranty period, rather than praise of their boards. Those warranty liabilities would have contributed to the tightening of their margins.
Point is: Those days are soon coming to an end
Also, it's interesting that they don't want to make AMD-based graphics cards, either. They just don't want to be in the graphics card business anymore.
the CEO just want more time for his family in the END, if it would be Nvidia they would just produce AMD or Intel Cards. they made 80% of their money with Nvidia so that company is in big trouble now
And lets be honest, AIBs are really not doing a lot. there are no AIBs for CPUs, Monitors, Mice, Keyboards, cars or whatever. Imagine iphones would be made by AIBs =D
Warranty is another topic, in the EU, every product has 2 years warranty (new) and used products 1 year. And on amazon I can buy additional warranty (which cost money but it costs EVGA money too)
As has been said, sorry to see EVGA go. There may be more to it than we've been told. And the net result is as Sevrin said. They are going away. That will mean different things to different people. It won't be especially good for customers as it means more industry consolidation.
I believe one of the things said about EVGA in at least one of those videos was that, while the video cards were 80% of their business, most of their profits came from the other products, because the profit margin on those cards was so small.
The family excuse is as old as time. Anytime somebody leaves or steps down or screws up they will say they want to spend more time with their family. The dude is CEO, he can delegate tasks to other people. Its not like some one man show here. LOL.
The second paragraph is what Jenson Huang would say. But they actually do quite a lot. They engineer the power delivery on these cards, and cooler design is kind of important. Have you looked at GPU versus a CPU? Maybe watch the Jay2centz video. I am not a fan of Jay, but this video explains things well. He also got to speak directly with EVGA's CEO. AIBs also have to take care of the customers. If your EVGA breaks, you contact EVGA, not Nvidia. If that product needs RMA, EVGA pays for that, not Nvidia. The AIBs take on all these responsibilities.
GPUs were 80% of REVENUE. Not profit. Those are different things. GPUs have surprisingly low markups. EVGA has a higher markup on a power supply than a 3090. Especially right now. The 3090ti being sold for $1400 now is losing money. Yet the FE 3090ti is being sold for $1100 at Best Buy. So the reality is that EVGA makes more money selling other stuff than GPUs.
Warranties are more than just words on paper. Warranties are about how you handle your customers when something goes wrong. EVGA does that consistently better than anyone else, that is not just my opinion, you will find that everywhere.
I told my story. I bought a 1080ti used off eBay. Lightning strike killed it. I called EVGA, spoke to an an English speaking person who was very nice. He answered all my questions. Les than 14 days later I had a replacement 1080ti.
My friend who had a Gigabyte GPU die had to wait over a month for his replacement.
I ask you...which one is better? Both of us had 3 year warranties, but one of us had a vastly worse experience dealing with that warranty.
BTW, warranties on GPUs in the US are 3 years...
EVGA also offered extended warranties that covered 5 and 10 years. Do you have 10 year warranties on GPUs in Europe? The 5 year was $30 and the 10 was $60.
Additionally, these warranties transfer. If you buy a EVGA used, you get that warranty too. Opening your card doesn't invalidate the warranty. Mining Crypto doesn't invalidate the warranty (some warranties do this.)
EVGA also offered a cheap rapid replacement program you could add on when buying new. This program would express ship a replacement GPU the same day you filed the RMA. Yes, that is before you even shipped your bad GPU to them! So with this program, you could be back up just a day or two after your RMA. How cool is that? This program was popular among Daz users who need their GPUs to make money rendering and can't have downtime.
EVGA also offered a special step up program. Say you buy a 3090 today, you could step up to the 4090 when it releases for low additional cost. (Though EVGA is not making a 4090, so that isn't happening now.) They gave full credit on the GPU you just bought, so no this isn't some trade in program where they offer pennies on the dollar.
Most of these things I just talked about were unmatched by anybody else.
EVGA also treated press and reviewers respectfully. When HardwareUnboxed made a particularly unflattering video about Nvidia, Nvidia essentially blackballed them. They stopped supplying review samples and cut communication. However, when reviewers gave some EVGA cards criticism over cooler design, EVGA addressed this and made a better cooler next time around.
When 3090s were mysteriously dying after their launch, instead of hiding or deflecting these reports EVGA investigated the issue and publicly posted their results. They even faulted their own design in this report. That stands in stark contrast to many other companies that tried to deflect any faults in their products. Link below.
https://www.techradar.com/news/evgas-broken-rtx-3090-graphics-cards-were-victims-of-poor-workmanship
Moreover, there were other GPUs reported to be dying during this time period, even AMD. It would have been very easy to sweep this away and just say "well, a very small number of users experienced issues", which is the go-to response for PR folk. But EVGA fixed it, and even shipped replacements out right away, before they received the defective ones.
Basically, EVGA actually appears to care about their products and customers more than most other companies in this field. Whether this is genuine or not, many people felt like EVGA was the best AIB in the business.