GPU question (yes, I saw the other threads)

radego01

Hello everyone. As I mentioned in the title, my question will be directed for the GPU but I will list the whole PC build for a better overview. The "work" I do in DAZ studio is just creating images for the "Visual Novel", no videos or animations. A scene, 2-3 characters and that's it. Of course, I will also include the render settings I use (they are also published in the guide on this forum). What I'm interested in is whether this GPU is capable of handling what I'm doing with the settings I'm using and should I expect to spend hours rendering a single image or will it be at least somewhat fast? Many people have already written here that it takes them 10 hours to render, but I don't know what they are rendering, so I can't determine where I am approximately and what it will be like for me. Thanks for every answer!

CPU: Intel Core i5 12400F Alder Lake 4.4 GHz
GPU: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3060 12 GB
RAM: 16GB DDR4 3200MHz
SSD: 1000GB M.2
PSU: 750 W
 

I'm rendering in full HD 1920x1080 and I don't plan to go higher, so yeah, I'm just an amateur who does it for fun.

Render settings are located on the screen

Richard Haseltine

The Rendering Quality seems rather high, especially paired with 99% convergence - do you need that to get acceptable results? Render Quality sets how fussy Iray is about counting a pixel done - seting it to n roughly multiplies render time by n, so your rnders will take about four times longer than a render at a quality of 1. Converged ratio determiens how many of the pixels must be counted as done for a render to stop, a high value like that would usally be needed if there were small areas that were slow to converge (reach their final state), leaving small patches of the render that were noticeably noisy (e.g eyes, which may be an issue for you, or shadowy corners, which probably won't be). I would try less demanding settings (even the defaults, quality 1 and 95% convergence) and see how well they work.

PerttiA

Richard already covered the rendering settings.
Looking at your hardware specs, you need more RAM, minimum 32GB's

Catherine3678ab

Personally I won't render anything for 10 hours.

I would go with doubling the RAM*. I learned when buying my new shinie that the type of RAM card should be the same as the existing one for best performance [and no conflicts]. Very happy with my 32 RAMs.

* if you can, not all boards will accept more.

radego01

Richard Haseltine said:

The Rendering Quality seems rather high, especially paired with 99% convergence - do you need that to get acceptable results? Render Quality sets how fussy Iray is about counting a pixel done - seting it to n roughly multiplies render time by n, so your rnders will take about four times longer than a render at a quality of 1. Converged ratio determiens how many of the pixels must be counted as done for a render to stop, a high value like that would usally be needed if there were small areas that were slow to converge (reach their final state), leaving small patches of the render that were noticeably noisy (e.g eyes, which may be an issue for you, or shadowy corners, which probably won't be). I would try less demanding settings (even the defaults, quality 1 and 95% convergence) and see how well they work.

To be honest, I don't need such high quality. I used these render settings more or less completely without any knowledge and only based on the recommendations I found on this forum. Of course, the result is quite different compared to the default settings, but unfortunately, I'm not a professional and I won't even have a PC for several thousand €, so I don't want to expect the same result as if I owned an RTX 3090 :D But I'm mainly interested in whether the RTX 3060 12GB is capable of handling such work so that I know where my limit is

PerttiA

denisvavra3 said:

Richard Haseltine said:

The Rendering Quality seems rather high, especially paired with 99% convergence - do you need that to get acceptable results? Render Quality sets how fussy Iray is about counting a pixel done - seting it to n roughly multiplies render time by n, so your rnders will take about four times longer than a render at a quality of 1. Converged ratio determiens how many of the pixels must be counted as done for a render to stop, a high value like that would usally be needed if there were small areas that were slow to converge (reach their final state), leaving small patches of the render that were noticeably noisy (e.g eyes, which may be an issue for you, or shadowy corners, which probably won't be). I would try less demanding settings (even the defaults, quality 1 and 95% convergence) and see how well they work.

To be honest, I don't need such high quality. I used these render settings more or less completely without any knowledge and only based on the recommendations I found on this forum. Of course, the result is quite different compared to the default settings, but unfortunately, I'm not a professional and I won't even have a PC for several thousand €, so I don't want to expect the same result as if I owned an RTX 3090 :D But I'm mainly interested in whether the RTX 3060 12GB is capable of handling such work so that I know where my limit is

Quality of the rendered image is not dependent on the GPU one uses, or even if one does rendering on the CPU. On something like the 3090, the rendering is just faster.

The RTX 3060 12GB is a good card, I have one and my indoor scenes render with 2 to 3 G8 figures usually in 15 to 20 minutes at 1908x1147px.

DS + Iray rendering does not require an expensive monster computer, but what it does need is enough RAM and a recent Nvidia GPU with enough VRAM - You still need more RAM

radego01

PerttiA said:

denisvavra3 said:

Richard Haseltine said:

The Rendering Quality seems rather high, especially paired with 99% convergence - do you need that to get acceptable results? Render Quality sets how fussy Iray is about counting a pixel done - seting it to n roughly multiplies render time by n, so your rnders will take about four times longer than a render at a quality of 1. Converged ratio determiens how many of the pixels must be counted as done for a render to stop, a high value like that would usally be needed if there were small areas that were slow to converge (reach their final state), leaving small patches of the render that were noticeably noisy (e.g eyes, which may be an issue for you, or shadowy corners, which probably won't be). I would try less demanding settings (even the defaults, quality 1 and 95% convergence) and see how well they work.

To be honest, I don't need such high quality. I used these render settings more or less completely without any knowledge and only based on the recommendations I found on this forum. Of course, the result is quite different compared to the default settings, but unfortunately, I'm not a professional and I won't even have a PC for several thousand €, so I don't want to expect the same result as if I owned an RTX 3090 :D But I'm mainly interested in whether the RTX 3060 12GB is capable of handling such work so that I know where my limit is

Quality of the rendered image is not dependent on the GPU one uses, or even if one does rendering on the CPU. On something like the 3090, the rendering is just faster.

The RTX 3060 12GB is a good card, I have one and my indoor scenes render with 2 to 3 G8 figures usually in 15 to 20 minutes at 1908x1147px.

DS + Iray rendering does not require an expensive monster computer, but what it does need is enough RAM and a recent Nvidia GPU with enough VRAM - You still need more RAM

According to the motherboard info, I can upgrade the RAM up to 128GB.... Will 32GB be enough? If possible, I'm willing to go for 64GB, but to be honest, I don't know if it will all work with the CPU and such. I'm not very educated when it comes to hardware

PerttiA

32GB's is enough, but if your budget allows going to 64GB's, that's better. Your CPU is just fine.

frank0314

You can never have enough RAM so get what you can afford.

nicstt

denisvavra3 said:

Richard Haseltine said:

The Rendering Quality seems rather high, especially paired with 99% convergence - do you need that to get acceptable results? Render Quality sets how fussy Iray is about counting a pixel done - seting it to n roughly multiplies render time by n, so your rnders will take about four times longer than a render at a quality of 1. Converged ratio determiens how many of the pixels must be counted as done for a render to stop, a high value like that would usally be needed if there were small areas that were slow to converge (reach their final state), leaving small patches of the render that were noticeably noisy (e.g eyes, which may be an issue for you, or shadowy corners, which probably won't be). I would try less demanding settings (even the defaults, quality 1 and 95% convergence) and see how well they work.

To be honest, I don't need such high quality. I used these render settings more or less completely without any knowledge and only based on the recommendations I found on this forum. Of course, the result is quite different compared to the default settings, but unfortunately, I'm not a professional and I won't even have a PC for several thousand €, so I don't want to expect the same result as if I owned an RTX 3090 :D But I'm mainly interested in whether the RTX 3060 12GB is capable of handling such work so that I know where my limit is

When rendering, stop it when YOU are happy with the result.

If a small patch is not finished, stop rendering and spot render that part, before merging them in photoshop (etc).

The majority of my images are 82% and quality of one.

radego01

nicstt said:

denisvavra3 said:

Richard Haseltine said:

The Rendering Quality seems rather high, especially paired with 99% convergence - do you need that to get acceptable results? Render Quality sets how fussy Iray is about counting a pixel done - seting it to n roughly multiplies render time by n, so your rnders will take about four times longer than a render at a quality of 1. Converged ratio determiens how many of the pixels must be counted as done for a render to stop, a high value like that would usally be needed if there were small areas that were slow to converge (reach their final state), leaving small patches of the render that were noticeably noisy (e.g eyes, which may be an issue for you, or shadowy corners, which probably won't be). I would try less demanding settings (even the defaults, quality 1 and 95% convergence) and see how well they work.

To be honest, I don't need such high quality. I used these render settings more or less completely without any knowledge and only based on the recommendations I found on this forum. Of course, the result is quite different compared to the default settings, but unfortunately, I'm not a professional and I won't even have a PC for several thousand €, so I don't want to expect the same result as if I owned an RTX 3090 :D But I'm mainly interested in whether the RTX 3060 12GB is capable of handling such work so that I know where my limit is

When rendering, stop it when YOU are happy with the result.

If a small patch is not finished, stop rendering and spot render that part, before merging them in photoshop (etc).

The majority of my images are 82% and quality of one.

I usually see a good result after 1 hour, but the pictures are full of smaller "red dots" (I don't know what to call it) and this is mostly a thing that is gradually removed until the very end

PerttiA

denisvavra3 said:

nicstt said:

denisvavra3 said:

Richard Haseltine said:

The Rendering Quality seems rather high, especially paired with 99% convergence - do you need that to get acceptable results? Render Quality sets how fussy Iray is about counting a pixel done - seting it to n roughly multiplies render time by n, so your rnders will take about four times longer than a render at a quality of 1. Converged ratio determiens how many of the pixels must be counted as done for a render to stop, a high value like that would usally be needed if there were small areas that were slow to converge (reach their final state), leaving small patches of the render that were noticeably noisy (e.g eyes, which may be an issue for you, or shadowy corners, which probably won't be). I would try less demanding settings (even the defaults, quality 1 and 95% convergence) and see how well they work.

To be honest, I don't need such high quality. I used these render settings more or less completely without any knowledge and only based on the recommendations I found on this forum. Of course, the result is quite different compared to the default settings, but unfortunately, I'm not a professional and I won't even have a PC for several thousand €, so I don't want to expect the same result as if I owned an RTX 3090 :D But I'm mainly interested in whether the RTX 3060 12GB is capable of handling such work so that I know where my limit is

When rendering, stop it when YOU are happy with the result.

If a small patch is not finished, stop rendering and spot render that part, before merging them in photoshop (etc).

The majority of my images are 82% and quality of one.

I usually see a good result after 1 hour, but the pictures are full of smaller "red dots" (I don't know what to call it) and this is mostly a thing that is gradually removed until the very end

That sounds almost like running out of VRAM and dropping to CPU. 

How long does it take, if you put just a G8 figure into the scene, no clothing, no hair and render?

radego01

PerttiA said:

denisvavra3 said:

nicstt said:

denisvavra3 said:

Richard Haseltine said:

The Rendering Quality seems rather high, especially paired with 99% convergence - do you need that to get acceptable results? Render Quality sets how fussy Iray is about counting a pixel done - seting it to n roughly multiplies render time by n, so your rnders will take about four times longer than a render at a quality of 1. Converged ratio determiens how many of the pixels must be counted as done for a render to stop, a high value like that would usally be needed if there were small areas that were slow to converge (reach their final state), leaving small patches of the render that were noticeably noisy (e.g eyes, which may be an issue for you, or shadowy corners, which probably won't be). I would try less demanding settings (even the defaults, quality 1 and 95% convergence) and see how well they work.

To be honest, I don't need such high quality. I used these render settings more or less completely without any knowledge and only based on the recommendations I found on this forum. Of course, the result is quite different compared to the default settings, but unfortunately, I'm not a professional and I won't even have a PC for several thousand €, so I don't want to expect the same result as if I owned an RTX 3090 :D But I'm mainly interested in whether the RTX 3060 12GB is capable of handling such work so that I know where my limit is

When rendering, stop it when YOU are happy with the result.

If a small patch is not finished, stop rendering and spot render that part, before merging them in photoshop (etc).

The majority of my images are 82% and quality of one.

I usually see a good result after 1 hour, but the pictures are full of smaller "red dots" (I don't know what to call it) and this is mostly a thing that is gradually removed until the very end

That sounds almost like running out of VRAM and dropping to CPU. 

How long does it take, if you put just a G8 figure into the scene, no clothing, no hair and render?

Do you mean like this? Well, this is specifically 21 seconds with the default render settings. But if I were to create a normal scene where there is an environment + 2 characters with clothes and hair, I would render it for 6-7 hours with default settings

PerttiA

Ok, the 21 sec is what it's supposed to be.

A scene with environment and two figure with clothing and hair taking 6-7 hours, is CPU rendering time when the scene doesn't fit the VRAM on the GPU and drops to CPU.
Although... Having just 16GB's of RAM, may also have an effect. Usually one should have 3 times more RAM than VRAM.

Maybe you could show us what your log says (Help->Troubleshooting->View Log File)
Do not paste the log to the message area, but attach the txt file to your post like you did with the sample render.

alan bard newcomer

two things will bring your computer to a noticable halt. 
One the cpus being maxxed out 
Two the ram being maxxed out in usage.
When either of those conditions are met you can't do anything including stopping what it is causing it. 
----
Richards assessment of the settings is correct. 
---
You can use battle encoder to limit dazs cpu usage. 
The only time I have ever had daz run the ram up high in usage to freeze the computer was when I had the wrong setting on ultra-scenery and it tried to load all the instances which can even stop up 64 g. 
But ram is only used by daz to one carry the scene and ten gigs is a huge scene with 12 characters 
granted I wouldn't be happy with only 16 because I couldn't do  anything else but I often have one daz rendering ... another I'm working in, photoshop, twenty tabs open in chrome, my music player a couple games 
I'm using 21 g now ... 8 g daz, 4 g eso, system is probably using 4 and rest is chrome and music player. 
---
so 16 is probably enough for a system just running daz. 
---
his card has the same specs as my titan X (cudas and gram) and much faster processors so his shouldn't take anywhere near that time. 

Richard Haseltine

Daz Studio has its own settings for the number of CPU cores that it uses.

alan bard newcomer

Richard Haseltine said:

Daz Studio has its own settings for the number of CPU cores that it uses.

where is it? There's a setting in prefs for multithreading and that's always been on. 
I have 16 cores and except when cpu rendering I've never seen more than one or two functioning while daz is doing anything else.
But I will watch again for a while .... 
But in terms of cpu activity occasionally during the loading to the gpu for rendering will the the overall cpu usage jump to 40/50% and that's about it. 
When I sit and wait for daz to do something and the cpu indicator just sits there drives me crazy. Because if it's thinking it's not using much of the thinking space I have available for it. 

Or are you saying that the number of cpus cores is hard coded like the font size? 

Richard Haseltine

alan bard newcomer said:

Richard Haseltine said:

Daz Studio has its own settings for the number of CPU cores that it uses.

where is it? There's a setting in prefs for multithreading and that's always been on. 
I have 16 cores and except when cpu rendering I've never seen more than one or two functioning while daz is doing anything else.
But I will watch again for a while .... 
But in terms of cpu activity occasionally during the loading to the gpu for rendering will the the overall cpu usage jump to 40/50% and that's about it. 
When I sit and wait for daz to do something and the cpu indicator just sits there drives me crazy. Because if it's thinking it's not using much of the thinking space I have available for it. 

Or are you saying that the number of cpus cores is hard coded like the font size? 

I meant for limiting the use of the CPU in rendering - Advanced tab of Render Settings, at the bottom.

radego01

Okay, so... I went to buy the PC I wrote about up there + so I bought more RAM and I have 32GB. Things that previously took me 5-6 hours to render can now be done in 10 minutes. So great. Thanks for the advice everyone :)

DrNewcenstein

I've been getting acceptable results with no "spots" using the following render settings and a single 1080ti.

(Note if it's not stated here, it's the default setting)
General:
Dimensions: 1920x1080

Progressive Rendering:
Max Samples: 200
Max Time: 0
Post SSM: On

Filtering:
Firefly: On
Post Denoiser: On/On/Alpha Off

Environment:
Scene lights only (items in the scene are Iray Emitters, camera headlamps off)
 

I render 8-figure scenes (mix of G2, G3, G8) with hair, "some" clothing, with indoor environments, and props with bump, transparencies, and dForce in about 2 minutes. I just added another 1080ti yesterday and render the scene in about 1 minute to 1:20.

I7-4770K
32GB RAM

It may also help if you reduce figure textures to 50% of their size, especially if you're using 4K textures.