N.G.S. Anagenessis II - Revolution [Commercial]

wolfskinjackson

Fisty said:

If I'm understanding correctly Dimension-Z's previous response on the question - You make your character, use the script to get the correct values set (it still uses Iray Uber shader) adjust as desired for your specific skin, then save it as a regular material preset.  Do the same with your makeups, eyes, etc.  That way the end user still needs to buy the Anagenesis 2 stript if they want to have other characters be super pretty but yours will be super pretty out of the box.

Please correct me if I got anything wrong there, Dimension-Z

Thank you, Fisty!

Xenomorphine

Was really torn on whether to get thus, considering the price, but made the decision.

Holy... It actually makes Genesis characters made for the 3Delight era look perfectly compatible with Genesis 3 characters! You still have to do some fancy morphing to them, but the actual skin surface? Utterly incredible. Genesis characters have literally never looked so good!

Totally worth the price. It's meant that all my older inventory has a while new lease of life for Iray renders.

Now I just need to have that user guide, so that I can fully take advantage of and understand it. :)

Does anyone know which option/script to select for stand-alone figures, like Dragon 3?

xyer0

What is the default level setting for the pores? That is, what pores level loads with the basic N.G.S.?

Dimension-Z

xyer0 said:

What is the default level setting for the pores? That is, what pores level loads with the basic N.G.S.?

For Pores Shining: Curve 0= 12

For Pores Height: Top Coat Bump= 10

BeeMKay

I have a question. I used the conversion G2 on the characters below. The left character's skin at the neck has turned kind of chicken-skin yellowish and blotchy. Is there a way to keep that from happening?

I noticed this when rendering in 4.8, but this is the 4.9 render and the effect is the same.

Dimension-Z

BeeMKay said:

I have a question. I used the conversion G2 on the characters below. The left character's skin at the neck has turned kind of chicken-skin yellowish and blotchy. Is there a way to keep that from happening?

I noticed this when rendering in 4.8, but this is the 4.9 render and the effect is the same.

 

Decrease yellow values from Reflectance Tint & Glossy Color. Or you try dicrease Glossy Specural Color RGB Slider too.

Great Render Though!

BeeMKay

Dimension-Z said:

BeeMKay said:

I have a question. I used the conversion G2 on the characters below. The left character's skin at the neck has turned kind of chicken-skin yellowish and blotchy. Is there a way to keep that from happening?

I noticed this when rendering in 4.8, but this is the 4.9 render and the effect is the same.

 

Decrease yellow values from Reflectance Tint & Glossy Color.

Great Render Though!

Thanks. The skin is pretty good in itself, but it really started to look much more realistic using Anagenesis.

I'll try that when I'm back at my PC.

Dimension-Z

BeeMKay said:

Dimension-Z said:

BeeMKay said:

I have a question. I used the conversion G2 on the characters below. The left character's skin at the neck has turned kind of chicken-skin yellowish and blotchy. Is there a way to keep that from happening?

I noticed this when rendering in 4.8, but this is the 4.9 render and the effect is the same.

 

Decrease yellow values from Reflectance Tint & Glossy Color.

Great Render Though!

Thanks. The skin is pretty good in itself, but it really started to look much more realistic using Anagenesis.

I'll try that when I'm back at my PC.

Updated answer:

Decrease yellow values from Reflectance Tint & Glossy Color. Or you can try dicrease Glossy Specural Color RGB Slider too.

Great Render Though!

fastbike1

A caution for those who have just bought this after being on the fence (as I was). Do not be alarmed by what you see in the viewport window after applying the script (see first image). This is a Genesis 1 character. The second image is the same character with Dimension Theory's Real lLife Studio HDRI and V3Digitimes Iray Converter for V4. The third image is the same character and lighting with Anagenesis 2 and a bit less red.

My point is that if you think this is a one click solution for every character in any lighting, you will be disappointed. As can bee seen from the promo images and many of the images in this thread, the results can be outstanding. One can also see that the results can also be disappointing without some, to quite a bit, of tweaking, similar to "standard" Iray skins.

My personal thought is the greatest advantage is for non-Genesis 3 figures. Several of the converters available ( I think I have them all) work well, excellently, or pretty good, depending on a number of variables. Genesis 3 characters often work pretty well "out of the box". Results for Genesis 3 with standard skins or ANY of the current solutions are variable. Perception of skin quality is an exceptionally personal perspective.

My final summation, for what it's worth, is that Anagenesis 2 is a worthy tool for the toolbox, but it is not the Holy Grail, Magic Bullet, or Fairy Godmother to make all your skins super excellent with no work on your part (nor has the PA represented it as such.)

Dimension-Z

fastbike1 said:

A caution for those who have just bought this after being on the fence (as I was). Do not be alarmed by what you see in the viewport window after applying the script (see first image). This is a Genesis 1 character. The second image is the same character with Dimension Theory's Real lLife Studio HDRI and V3Digitimes Iray Converter for V4. The third image is the same character and lighting with Anagenesis 2 and a bit less red.

My point is that if you think this is a one click solution for every character in any lighting, you will be disappointed. As can bee seen from the promo images and many of the images in this thread, the results can be outstanding. One can also see that the results can also be disappointing without some, to quite a bit, of tweaking, similar to "standard" Iray skins.

My personal thought is the greatest advantage is for non-Genesis 3 figures. Several of the converters available ( I think I have them all) work well, excellently, or pretty good, depending on a number of variables. Genesis 3 characters often work pretty well "out of the box". Results for Genesis 3 with standard skins or ANY of the current solutions are variable. Perception of skin quality is an exceptionally personal perspective.

My final summation, for what it's worth, is that Anagenesis 2 is a worthy tool for the toolbox, but it is not the Holy Grail, Magic Bullet, or Fairy Godmother to make all your skins super excellent with no work on your part (nor has the PA represented it as such.)

Good work fastbike1!

I have to say that I agree with you.

I never said this is one click solution for skin color, as I don't have presets for this. Because Skin Color is subjective for everyone, and so we'll be need 5000 presets for this option.

But the feeling of the skin texture is common for ANY kind of Skin. Maybe less gloss, more velvet etc. 

That is what I tried to make.

So are you sure that you have seen such a feeling of skin until now in DAZ? (Not the color. the feeling)

P.S.

And why people have to be alarmed of what they see in the viewport?

I think DAZ Viewport was never reliable.

It's not an attack, just wanna say to new users to be more objectives when they criticize a product.

 

Thnx for your kind words and for purchasing my product

D-Z

Dimension-Z

fastbike1 said:

@Fisty  "I'm very impressed by this product.  I've been having a bear of a time getting skin to look good since "upgrading" to 4.9"

Are you sure some (all?) of your problem is that you're using pre 4.9 shaders in 4.9? The 4.8 shaders typically had a light blue SSS Reflectance tint. (as does Finley). The 4.9 shaders have a pale yellow SSS Reflectance tint.

Here's my version of Finley with FWSA Whitley skin (4.9 shader). Same Dimension Theory HDRI as yours. 38% render. Look any better to you (image on left)? Image on right is the Finley skin (i.e. blue SSS)

FWIW, FWSA skins tend to be a bit too tan to me, but not gray (with a 4.9 shader).

So conclusion

N.G.S.2 works with default diffuse map color. You will get what diffuse map color is.

fastbike1

That's too simple a conclusion. While true, the diffuse map color may not be what you expected or want. The previous issues with Gianni are a good example. 

Dimension-Z said:

fastbike1 said:

@Fisty  "I'm very impressed by this product.  I've been having a bear of a time getting skin to look good since "upgrading" to 4.9"

Are you sure some (all?) of your problem is that you're using pre 4.9 shaders in 4.9? The 4.8 shaders typically had a light blue SSS Reflectance tint. (as does Finley). The 4.9 shaders have a pale yellow SSS Reflectance tint.

Here's my version of Finley with FWSA Whitley skin (4.9 shader). Same Dimension Theory HDRI as yours. 38% render. Look any better to you (image on left)? Image on right is the Finley skin (i.e. blue SSS)

FWIW, FWSA skins tend to be a bit too tan to me, but not gray (with a 4.9 shader).

So conclusion

N.G.S.2 works with default diffuse map color. You will get what diffuse map color is.

 

Dimension-Z

fastbike1 said:

That's too simple a conclusion. While true, the diffuse map color may not be what you expected or want. The previous issues with Gianni are a good example. 

Dimension-Z said:

fastbike1 said:

@Fisty  "I'm very impressed by this product.  I've been having a bear of a time getting skin to look good since "upgrading" to 4.9"

Are you sure some (all?) of your problem is that you're using pre 4.9 shaders in 4.9? The 4.8 shaders typically had a light blue SSS Reflectance tint. (as does Finley). The 4.9 shaders have a pale yellow SSS Reflectance tint.

Here's my version of Finley with FWSA Whitley skin (4.9 shader). Same Dimension Theory HDRI as yours. 38% render. Look any better to you (image on left)? Image on right is the Finley skin (i.e. blue SSS)

FWIW, FWSA skins tend to be a bit too tan to me, but not gray (with a 4.9 shader).

So conclusion

N.G.S.2 works with default diffuse map color. You will get what diffuse map color is.

 

Sure. But Gianni dif map has not by default so tanned skin as default shader gives to us. 

So conclusion again, because we're always talking about skin colors.

What do we want? A good color skin for our tastes or a good feeling skin? Sure we need both.

But we can't take good results from a flat skin even with a perfect color.

Dimension-Z

fastbike1 said:

 This is a Genesis 1 character. The second image is the same character with Dimension Theory's Real lLife Studio HDRI and V3Digitimes Iray Converter for V4. The third image is the same character and lighting with Anagenesis 2 and a bit less red.

 

NGS 2 is a bit red, but I V3Digitimes Iray Converter for V4 is a bit orange.

Colors for ALL tastes! 

Vendor's will never catch all color tastes.

The point is how many have caught skin feeling?

Navi

OK, I think I've found the faulty parameter for my issue :) ... Slowly progressing.

Scatter&Transmit (in "Base color effect") gives incoherent and uncontrollable results on my PC, for some reasons. Once set on "Scatter only", it works normally. So here with NGS, I have to set it on Scatter only, and then slightly adjust the transluency up, then I get a good results, no more greenish/redish/yellowish characters, no more too dark/saturated skins, and no more color hues that spreads irregulary over the figure (with scatter&transmit, depending of the poses, some characters had the chest/head greenish, while the rest of the body was looking normal...).

Now the question is, why does it do that on my PC, while other people don't seem to have this issue with the scatter&transmit setting ? But anyway I'm happy, finally found the fix :) .

Dimension-Z

Navi said:

OK, I think I've found the faulty parameter for my issue :) ... Slowly progressing.

Scatter&Transmit (in "Base color effect") gives incoherent and uncontrollable results on my PC, for some reasons. Once set on "Scatter only", it works normally. So here with NGS, I have to set it on Scatter only, and then slightly adjust the transluency up, then I get a good results, no more greenish/redish/yellowish characters, no more too dark/saturated skins, and no more color hues that spreads irregulary over the figure (with scatter&transmit, depending of the poses, some characters had the chest/head greenish, while the rest of the body was looking normal...).

Now the question is, why does it do that on my PC, while other people don't seem to have this issue with the scatter&transmit setting ? But anyway I'm happy, finally found the fix :) .

Scatter only gives more flat things. If you like it thats your taste. But did you like the result?

Navi

Dimension-Z said:

Navi said:

OK, I think I've found the faulty parameter for my issue :) ... Slowly progressing.

Scatter&Transmit (in "Base color effect") gives incoherent and uncontrollable results on my PC, for some reasons. Once set on "Scatter only", it works normally. So here with NGS, I have to set it on Scatter only, and then slightly adjust the transluency up, then I get a good results, no more greenish/redish/yellowish characters, no more too dark/saturated skins, and no more color hues that spreads irregulary over the figure (with scatter&transmit, depending of the poses, some characters had the chest/head greenish, while the rest of the body was looking normal...).

Now the question is, why does it do that on my PC, while other people don't seem to have this issue with the scatter&transmit setting ? But anyway I'm happy, finally found the fix :) .

Scatter only gives more flat things. If you like it thats your taste. But did you like the result?

More flat, perhaps, still have tests to do, but at least, it's usable. Scatter&Transmit just doesn't work on my setup, for some strange reasons. Like I said in my previous post, it was even "spreading" irregulary on the figure depending of the poses/lighting (normal body with a *very* green head, etc).

Dimension-Z

Top Coat Bump Tip!

KEEP IN MIND!
Top Coat Bump is a Varnish Mask.
YOU CAN USE ANY MAP YOU WANT OR ANY MAP MIXING (LIE)!

Navi

One picture made with scatter only transluency, just to show my results :)

 

bluejaunte

Navi said:

One picture made with scatter only transluency, just to show my results :)

 

That looks great. What cute character is that anyway?

fastbike1

You are misunderstanding my original post. I did not criticize any of the design choices you made. I was trying to inform those who are still undecided what they might experience. This lengthy thread makes it pretty clear that running the script is rarely sufficient by itself. Look at the number of times you have offered color correction afvice to people. It also seemed to me that many folks seemed to believe that all they had to do was run the script and they would great great skin. You frankly missed Serene Night's point about Gianni. You have also stated multiple times that this is a one click solution when that is clearly not the case. This is a useful tool for many people but if you to insist it's a one click solution, a lot of people will be disappointed when the one click gives a too red, too pale, too dark, or whatever result. There is obviously a wide range of diffuse map tones that vendors PAs have used over many years. It's also pretty clear that for many original mats, the diffuse map did not drive the tone of the final render.

Finally, I wonder if the decision to replace all the maps with the diffuse map will prevent people from taking full advantage of increasing Iray capabilities. The current beta for example has some new features for spectral rendering. I wonder if those will give predictable results when an origimal spectral map gets replaced.

Dimension-Z said:

fastbike1 said:

 This is a Genesis 1 character. The second image is the same character with Dimension Theory's Real lLife Studio HDRI and V3Digitimes Iray Converter for V4. The third image is the same character and lighting with Anagenesis 2 and a bit less red.

 

NGS 2 is a bit red, but I V3Digitimes Iray Converter for V4 is a bit orange.

Colors for ALL tastes! 

Vendor's will never catch all color tastes.

The point is how many have caught skin feeling?

 

Xenomorphine

I'm still curious which of the scripts should be selected for Daz Horse 2 or Daz Dragon 3, as in the promotional images. They're stand-alone figures. I tried the basic Genesis one on Dragon 3, but it didn't seem to change the render quality.

Still very impressed with it on human figures! It really has given the older characters new Iray life. It even makes Genesis 3 skin a lot more realistic.

Dimension-Z

fastbike1 said:

You are misunderstanding my original post. I did not criticize any of the design choices you made. I was trying to inform those who are still undecided what they might experience. This lengthy thread makes it pretty clear that running the script is rarely sufficient by itself. Look at the number of times you have offered color correction afvice to people. It also seemed to me that many folks seemed to believe that all they had to do was run the script and they would great great skin. You frankly missed Serene Night's point about Gianni. You have also stated multiple times that this is a one click solution when that is clearly not the case. This is a useful tool for many people but if you to insist it's a one click solution, a lot of people will be disappointed when the one click gives a too red, too pale, too dark, or whatever result. There is obviously a wide range of diffuse map tones that vendors PAs have used over many years. It's also pretty clear that for many original mats, the diffuse map did not drive the tone of the final render.

Finally, I wonder if the decision to replace all the maps with the diffuse map will prevent people from taking full advantage of increasing Iray capabilities. The current beta for example has some new features for spectral rendering. I wonder if those will give predictable results when an origimal spectral map gets replaced.

Dimension-Z said:

fastbike1 said:

 This is a Genesis 1 character. The second image is the same character with Dimension Theory's Real lLife Studio HDRI and V3Digitimes Iray Converter for V4. The third image is the same character and lighting with Anagenesis 2 and a bit less red.

 

NGS 2 is a bit red, but I V3Digitimes Iray Converter for V4 is a bit orange.

Colors for ALL tastes! 

Vendor's will never catch all color tastes.

The point is how many have caught skin feeling?

 

Big text! Fortunately Rendering is not only digital technics, but art technics too. Thnx again for your good words.

Navi

bluejaunte said:

Navi said:

One picture made with scatter only transluency, just to show my results :)

 

That looks great. What cute character is that anyway?

Thank you :) - She's basically a Keiko 6, with a lot of morphs kit-bashing (Growing up, some bits from various morphs packs here and there, some V4 morphs converted with GenX2 etc). The texture is a V4 one (Primrose for S4).

jardine

i'm impressed with this product and really enjoying it.  but please, Dimension-Z, do give us a manual/guide for it.

my first test render:  draupadi.

i reapplied her original eye materials after applying the shader.  just because.

j

 

MJW

I was going to ask how to make this work with genitals (3Feetwolf's, to be precies) but I think I saw that you have not yet issued the nedessary extras. Is this right? If so, when do you anticipate something coming, please? Very effective system.

SimonJM

There are definite pros, but a couple of cons, too - though I suspect they can be ironed out with a little tweaking.  This is Edgar, 'out of the box' and with A2R applied, lighting the same (Ultra Genesis: Studio Env 007 Bright, with one UG Box Light Fill set to emitter temp 300 and stepped down with an Intesnity -3)

xyer0

xyer0 said:

Redz said:

xyer0 said:

I've been testing N.G.S. on a bunch of G2F FW skins, and I'm getting (some) lacrimals that are grey to greenish. I change the Glossy Color, but I can't get rid of the grey/green in the larger part of the lacrimal. Help?

I found this with Olympia 7, but once I switched her surfaces back to the correct UV (Olympia 7) then the lacrimal looked correct, so perhaps worth checking the correct UV for the character maps is selected. 

Bless you, my dear Redz, that may be the issue. But where do I find the character map? (in > > > flow) I clicked on the Surfaces tab, and looked through Map Transfer and Load UV Set, but I can't find anything.

The cause of the green/grey tint on the lacrimals was the Top Coat Color. However, after changing it to a more pinkish hue, the lacrimals took on a metallic tone, although not any more glittery than the skin.

xyer0

Navi said:

OK, I think I've found the faulty parameter for my issue :) ... Slowly progressing.

Scatter&Transmit (in "Base color effect") gives incoherent and uncontrollable results on my PC, for some reasons. Once set on "Scatter only", it works normally. So here with NGS, I have to set it on Scatter only, and then slightly adjust the transluency up, then I get a good results, no more greenish/redish/yellowish characters, no more too dark/saturated skins, and no more color hues that spreads irregulary over the figure (with scatter&transmit, depending of the poses, some characters had the chest/head greenish, while the rest of the body was looking normal...).

Now the question is, why does it do that on my PC, while other people don't seem to have this issue with the scatter&transmit setting ? But anyway I'm happy, finally found the fix :) .

Navi, thanks for this post. My African/Indian skins were coming out 3 tones darker than I had ever seen them, but I could not discover why. When I changed the Skin and Lips surfaces to Scatter Only, I got the colour I expected, albeit with less glow/sparkle. If you want a really dark skin to shine (as really dark skin often does in real life) then N.G.S. unedited gives you even darker skin with shine. BTW, really gorgeous poolside render.

RAMWolff

Dimension-Z said:

RAMWolff said:

Used my newly made MicroDetails map in place of yours and tweaked quite a few values and colors.  Still needs more tweaking but happy with the results for the most part. 

 

 

Great job. I wanted to tell you that. If I am not wrong, your character has a toon style so my micros wouldnt fit or with lower bump values. As I posted earlier white/pale skin need specular color decreasing.

I'm so sorry, I didn't see this post for some reason.  I like the micro on the skin, it adds a nice velvet to it.  So her skin isn't pale it's more naturally lightly tanned but not dark at all.  Not sure what to call that!  lmao