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Respectfully, I disagree and previous experience with the forums and DAZ announcement are why.
The REASON there is another forum at Cafe is because THESE forums did a nosedive about 4-6 months ago and we had nothing AT ALL for weeks.
ANOTHER REASON is that Daz Forums are HEAVILY monitored and actively edited, Cafe's are not.... We can be openly critical there.
YET ANOTHER REASON is that most users felt we needed a "space" that was dedicated to Carrara, not the house of Vicky. No one can access these forums without seeing barbarian boobs (ironically they are currently MAN-boobs) and that is "shameful" and stupid, but it is NOT EVER going to change. It KILLS Carrara's legitimacy in the 3D world, but this is Vicky's house. The end. All hail Vicky's magnificent morphing breasts that pay the rent.
I still say calling any announcement "shameful" is so over the top as to be hyperbole. There's no reason to back peddle. In 2 weeks this bitch fest will sink into the quagmire of the DAZ forums, LOOOONG before we see any update.
The whole point of Cafe was to have a community-driven site. The forums here are in NO WAY community driven by any stretch of the imagination - it's just where the heavy traffic is. It was also decided that Cafe could be a less formal way for DAZ to make announcements, and that's EXACTLY what this was: informal. When it's time to make the announcement "official" we will also be given downloads hopefully or something useful.
Everyone needs to stop the bitchfest and go render something or contribute something useful. If Cafe isn't all it could be then WHO'S FAULT IS THAT? No representative of DAZ is going to stand here and patiently respond while the community throws tomatoes.
As you can plainly see here is the splash page of the forums complete with barbarian MANboobs...
http://forum.daz3d.com/
If anyone here can spot the CARRARA™ link... or any mention that Carrara exists at all on this splash I'll give you a cookie.
Well, I appreciate the information in the announcement, but I would also say that I expected more.
"We will finish up Carrara 8.5 by the summer and plan on Carrara 9 by Year's end" is a nice announcement, but it is hardly worthy of an announcement to announce it. You could just come out and say that. You do not need to keep everyone waiting for 2 months as you compose that press release. So I guess we were expecting a bit more substance.
The "heavy" traffic here results from only one reason: because it is community driven! Without the community and the helpful posters here there would be no traffic at all. Without Andy, Wendy, Dartanbeck, you and some more there would be no Carrara forum. Or have I missed some secret forum part where the admins are answering the bread-and-butter question regarding functions of Carrara?
So it's like some official statement made through some less formal medium is less official?
Why not make the announcement simply on the "heavy" traffic forum? (Yes, I know why: the bitching on an official statement would be much heavier than on 3drendero who doesn't deserve to be the scapegoat for DAZ's lack of communication skills.)
Rendering test animations gives lot of time to do something un-useful, like posting here :)
If you followed the community then you already knew a week ahead of the "announcement" that the bug tracker was active again. I said so.
Months ago the C8.5beta was taken private. That means they still offered the old betas for download for C8 buyers, but further development (if there was much) happened outside of the public sphere. It's a beta.
If you think DAZ benefitted in some way from this announcement, I'd like you to explain how. We wanted information. For a long time there was nothing to tell. Now there is something to tell (seems like the first GLIMMER of something to tell since it isn't very fleshed out) and what do we do? Say thank you? No we bitch and moan -- which is exactly what we were doing before.
If we want them to be more open, maybe we should try accepting info at face value and stop with the drama and histrionics. Maybe?
I mean, if you worked at DAZ would YOU be the one to rip off this band-aid? Or would you just keep quiet until there was something real to download?
Notice which forum members are NOT posting here? I'm willing to bet they are our private beta testers.... Shouldn't we bitch at them for keeping us in the dark all this time?
or they get deleted for responding to trolls
I'm not back peddling. I stand by what I said. DAZ can't even make an announcement on their own forums, and I think that's shameful in the light of their past performance. Their customer service (and not just to Carrara users) really is shameful as of late. This isn't the only forum with complaints. I'm a loyal DAZ customer, and if I think they can improve something, I'll say so.
Can we move on now?
I can try the next time, but you need to remember that we are volunteers, not paid and skilled journalists.
Also trying to learn from the feedback here in the Forums, some bits were changed after feedback here, hard to please everyone.
And I am a volunteer as well, a disabled health advocate. I meant no disrespect, merely the voice of my own experience. Long-term and hard-earned experience. But whatever.
Contrary to what some think here, most companies are not open for the world to see and do not put all their cards on the table. And Holly has a point I've brought up before... why would DAZ want to even participate in this forum. They used to and certain members would jump all over them because they thought they were not being honest or whatever when they couldn't duplicate a problem the poster was complaining about. We have a bunch of chronic whiners and complainers here and it is really a damn shame. DAZ could fix everything and they'd still find something to complain about. Time to grow up and do some actual work with the program to show it's worth DAZ's efforts to improve it.
"much ado about nothing"
I didn't want my last post pulled so I'm making this one separate.
lets just all go to the carraracafe and let DAZ worry about Studio. After all studio is the golden child.
Thank you Holly.
I'm sure you're speaking for many people that don't post much due to a reluctance to get in the firing line.
I just thought that needed to be said.
Lets be real here. Folks are actually complaining what forum an announcemnt comes from? Come on. 3drendero already said what he did which to me seems pretty reasonable. Everyone got it one way or another . You wanted something flashy maybe ? Unfortunately there was not a lot said to set off fireworks in the announcement.
That said .....It was an important announcement folks. There will be a Carrara Nine ! That is news and that was important for me and I am sure for many potential buyers now and in the future.
So ---I get the whole Daz does not tell us much but this week they have (and maybe albeit not the best way) but I have to say thanks to Daz . There are a whole graveyard of dead 3d programs and Carrara will not be on the list. Continued development is important. Applause !!
Given the realities of what we have here --------this has been a good week despite what you read sometimes.
Rich
Wow, well said. Lesson learned.
And now for something completely different: post a decent render.
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/14050/
Funny th Bryce guys are getting on a nd doing a plethora of not bad renders and all being nice to each other.....
;)
I think the good news about the announcment was that Daz envisages a Carrara 9.
envisages 3rd person singular present of en·vis·age (Verb)
Verb
1.Contemplate or conceive of as a possibility or a desirable future event.
2.Form a mental picture of (something not yet existing or known).
In recent months Carrara seemed to have come to a stand still. As mentioned, it could be all the new issues with Genesis code, web site, resources, costs(etc.), overwhelmed Carrara developement. If so, a simple mention of this in the beta topic would have given some direction for any delays. Especially for those(like myself) wanting to make or sell Carrara specific content. I might wait this long for one development cycle/communications, but not repeated.
I've been here awhile, enjoy the community and want Carrara to succeed, however,...If what is posted at Carrara Cafe is truly the official announcement(or communication) from DAZ then, I have to agree with Kodiak3D or what others said along the same lines about Carraras recent handling. I may possibly missed it but, how are new users supposed to know about Carrara Cafe from the DAZ site marketing pages? Kodiak3D said, "Why not redirect to Cafe?" etc.
I also appreciate the efforts for info/news/support from 3drendero and others, but have been wondering just how many DAZ employees actually use Carrara. Im no expert by far in Cararra or 3D, but I still easily find bugs with each release(and report them when possible) that should have never made it into the program. If it is a matter of resources for these delays, then Im afraid there wont be any change until there are more resources. Carrara 8.5 final release will make or break my decision to continue to upgrade.
Wow, well said. Lesson learned.
And now for something completely different: post a decent render.
You're welcome to view my gallery. Links in my sig.
http://carraracafe.com/?page_id=2022/general/a-dance-before-dieing
So is that the goal in an online forum like this? Is it really important that everyone posts renders? Seems like everyone here always wants to redirect discussions to a bottom line of "oh yeah, well post a render". I don't get it. Why is that important?
Do you want a place where everyone is always saying everything is awesome and just posting renders and not discussing any issues at all? Where never is heard a discouraging word? Why? Why is disagreement so painful to so many?
I guess I'll never understand...
[I had to delete my first answer, because it wasn't fair on you.]
I don't know what style of render you want to achieve but the hair needs more work regardless of what style.
[I had to delete my first answer, because it wasn't fair on you.]
I don't know what style of render you want to achieve but the hair needs more work regardless of what style.
Please post comments on whichever of the over 150 images you are referring to in my galleries. All criticism is welcome. I really don't get enough.
You mean nobody here has posted a decent render? Ever? Personally, I've seen many outstanding Carrara renders here and at Carrara Cafe.
I yield. I don't know how anything I said was construed as complaining, but never mind; I have some problems with interpersonal communication — not usually with writing — or anywhere else much. Awesome, OK? Just really great. Sorry. Very sorry.
4 sho! Eventually things will settle down. I don't recall ever being in any creative environment where everyone got along all the time. It's just the nature of the beast that is Being Creative. It's a little crazy I know, but reading through some of the threads here I have this voice in my head asking "What would Bob Ross do?" He'd shrug it off and get back to creating (while talking about happy lil trees and clouds with imaginary squirrel friends) ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLO7tCdBVrA
We have had to remove a number of posts from this thread, again. If it reaches the point of needing additional trimming the moderators have decided that we will lock the thread, so please make a greater effort to post in a civil and constructive manner.
You mean nobody here has posted a decent render? Ever? Personally, I've seen many outstanding Carrara renders here and at Carrara Cafe.
I prefer posting indecent renders but I'd have to censor the NVIATWAS that would inevitably result. :red: :red:
I vote better content browser for C9 plus Finder-type searching support. :)
So is that the goal in an online forum like this? Is it really important that everyone posts renders? Seems like everyone here always wants to redirect discussions to a bottom line of "oh yeah, well post a render". I don't get it. Why is that important?
Do you want a place where everyone is always saying everything is awesome and just posting renders and not discussing any issues at all? Where never is heard a discouraging word? Why? Why is disagreement so painful to so many?
I guess I'll never understand...
I wouldn't say disagreement is painful. The part that is bothersome is all the folks who like to nag and rag on DAZ and then come down on the folks trying to be helpful. It's too much needless drama. I always think it's crazy even when folks come down on you, Joe, when you are trying to be helpful and sharing your knowledge and experience (and it's some of the same people who take issue with you - they just simply are overwrought emotionally about things, or are having a tough time with thinking or with life in general). People, if you have a Carrara problem that nobody can help you with here, E-mail DAZ instead. Don't post that stuff here, because DAZ will NOT see it. How many times do we have to be told that they don't read the forums. The moderators are not the people from DAZ and they aren't our messengers. Save it and pursue ways of doing things instead. Solving issues we can solve. Otherwise, put it in the bug tracker and contact DAZ directly, because there's nothing we can do except feel the pain. I do think we'd get more participation in this forum from DAZ if some were more civil here. But I can think of numerous times in the past when certain individuals would come down hard on a DAZ person trying to help, just because the certain individual couldn't get his issue solved. If that's the way it's going to be, let the DAZ folks work on the program and wait until they are good and ready to tell us news. And really, some issues could be avoided if people would just stop and re-read their post before posting. If you are angry or frustrated about something, better to wait until you've cooled down before posting your drama.
sorry about that Adam!
Got a news post at
www.jurn.org/dazposer/
and the German Carrara forum:
http://www.3d-board.de/76-carrara/27230-carrara-lebt-weiter/?s=f69225878d00d18956e80b2da74db56bb60f385b
and Renderosity:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2864185
Any suggestions for other sites to send the news to, to get more PR for Carrara?