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...and the problem is back with a vengence. I'm honestly starting to wonder why I've spent close to $900 in video cards just so I can use the CPU. the magic of this art form is dying. The over shadow and nagging feeling that even a test render will drop to cpu is always there.
This product has gone from stable to precariously sketchy.
Doesn't matter if I use the one RTX2070 and yank the (2) GTX960's or the other way around. CPU Rendering is becoming the standard process.
This product is not seeing the fun, the thrill, or even close to the creative moments it once had.
Ticket submitted.
R/ PDSmith
(DAZ when are you going to impliment a decent inhouse forum search engine and not have us resort to using Google?)
On animations in particular see http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dazstudio/4/change_log#4_12_1_41
nVidia is working on other issues, see for example
https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/5004096/#Comment_5004096
https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/5112641/#Comment_5112641
Still using Daz Studio 4.10 and Win7pro. I would suggest using the keyboard command (control alt delete) call up task manager and force crash the program daz studio and see if that recovers your ram and vram. This sounds drastic but if you are desperate extreme measures are required! I would also try the new free tier of Otoy Octaine for daz studio it has a 1 video card only restriction but for most hobbiest this is not an issue. Octaine vram handling in this render engine in daz is better and if you run out of vram it does not drop to cpu. I rarely use Iray these days I mostly use Opengl and Plaq Comic Life to make comics for my own amusment. If you are tired of Iray I would go back to 3delight less headaches. Just get a script here to make the iray to 3dl conversions at daz store they work well. Now, I would have a great suggestion for a new script that should be built into Daz Studio>> How much vram left and reset or clear ram and vram. If daz or someone would sell this it would sell like hotcakes for the Iray render crowd. just my 2 cents
@Silver Dolphin, I've spent the weekend relearning my "3Delight Foo'. it was nice to actually see a product and have that thrill of making 'art'
I was here using DAZ's product when they put out Studio version 3.2 (When Chris and company were still here) and I stuck with them since. Normally the product is fantastic and does as it should but lately.
Not so much.
when co-workers ask about a drawing or walk by my office and see some an image and ask where it came from I tell them I made it and what free software to use...now days I tell them to not even bother looking at Studio, the product is too buggy and unreliable. That's the faith I have right now and I've even had a hand in teaching people how to use the thing. (converted a few Poser users too). but not now.
So it's back to 3Delight until decent progress is made.
Yes I'm venting, This problem has been known about since the first RTX card and drastic driver change from Nvidia hit the scene and just now, almost a year later it's one of those 'oh we're just now seeing it's a problem.'
Though it can be a hassle with having to manipulate textures, may wan't to look at Octane Free.. It has proper dump to system capabilities, so if the vram fills up it will put the overflow into system ram.. The one big caveat is that the free version will only allow one GPU, eitherway it maybe something to look into..
But yeah I am running into memory issues with iRay, and that no amount of tweaking seems to stop my vram gettiing gobbled up.. I may have a scene that will load in 1.5 gig of data start the render and see that jump to 7.5 to 8 gig of vram usage, which is a pain when you have a 1070ti, shudder to think what that would be if I had a 2080ti..
I used Octane when it was a manual process of export ot obj and manually smooth each texture or set each texture for use. Years ago, when DAZ said they were going to go to an unbias render engine I had hoped they were going to work with Octane as the interface back then was ideal, it would have been a near plug and play idea.
Instead we have Iray and nearly everyone was doing a WTF? Which bythe way, Iray is still an infant compared to Octane, but I'd like to see DAZ fix this issue, get behind this issue, stope people from pointing fingers of who's to blam. It's their product and they're letting some other company dictate their success and stumbling blocks.
I personally like Iray but at the same time love 3delight for it's sheer simplicity. It's a shame someone hasn't come up with a bridge to let 3delight tap into the GPU processors.
I'm currently showing minor success running 441.66 Gamer edtion drivers since the whole Studio version kills off my other two cards (they are not supported). It kind of works at the moment but vram packs in, builds up, and never dumps until shut down, reboot and make sure you don't have more than 3 figures and a simple background set in your scene.....sniffle... I miss 4.9...when it was the stable system.
You might not know you can access the 3Delight pathtracer with scripted rendering. It will of course not solve the issues with GPU rendering, as it's CPU only, but if you want to do PBR rendering it might be an option. The disadvantage is you have to convert both IRay and the default 3DL materials to aweSurface. However there are a number of scripts to apply, for basic materials like metals, glass, fabric, and converter scripts for all the generations from V4/M4 up to G8. And for other figures there are a number of skin presets. (And nails, eye- and mouth surfaces). Here are a couple of links, in case you want to look into it:
aweshading-kit-10-for-daz-studio /awe-surface-shader-a-new-physically-plausible-shader-for-daz-studio-and-3delight/p1
awe Shading Kit User Guide
awe Surface user Guide
wowie's free stuff
3delight-laboratory-thread-tips-questions-experiments#latest
I'm on it. Thank you.
Ok people; try using a Core i9; 2080 GForce Nvidia, SSD, Liquid Cool, 64 Gigs of RAM. My Rendering time is less than 2 minutes for iray. I never have rendering issues.
DAZ requires a power system; my old computer always crashed or it would freeze up, sometimes I just made the render after two or 3 hours. So i just went out and purchased a power system that could handle the daz system. Core i9, ssd, 2080 nvidia graphic card with 64 GIGs of RAM, Liquid Cooling system with proper clocking your system will never crash. My system renders everything within 1 and a halth minutes not over 2 minutes. Remember DAZ GUI Requires a power computer system. That is my experience.
Must be nice being a millionaire :P
I'm currently using a GTX 1070 on 10 year old hardware with 8 GB DDR2 RAM, hardly ever had any problems or dropping to CPU (simply can't max out VRAM with only 8 GB RAM) before 4.12, where it drops to CPU constantly.
@Silver_Dolphin, OMG you were dead right, Octane DOES use system RAM as over flow for scenes. It even has a monitor/meter to show how much!
TOTAL system stability!
and the renders....20 minutes are down to 4 minutes and because of what I knew from 5 or so years ago when I used it and did the old manual conversions. It all worked and look dang near the same.(still gotta wrap my head around the whole emmitors bit, that's going to take a bit)
Seriously twenty plus test renders with 3 different scenes that promised CPU rendering. I peaked out VRAM but it overflowed to System RAM and kept going!
Didn't crash to CPU. Not once. (the downside is only being able to use 1 of my 3 video cards but thats up from just a CPU.)
Thank you so much! (Yes I still prefer Iray and 3delight due to all the shaders and native content but this is a god send of a interim fix)
412pro using a titanx 12 and 980 ti 6 gig with 430.60 and having no problems
I'm beyond that... Except for the 2080 card... Totally doesn't matter, in this situation. You just crash faster. It depends what you are rendering and what you have within your library.
Core i9, Check... Mine is a 36 logical-core CPU @ 3.1 GHz
64GB RAM, Check... Corsair Dominator Platinum DDR4 @ 2133Mhz
SSDs, Check... 2TB Samsung 970 Evo Plus NVMe M.2 and 4TB Samsung 860 Evo SSD
Liquid cooling, Check... Corsair H150i (However, Arctic-coolers with heat-pipes are better at cooling. Though, Daz doesn't make my CPU blink much, unless I render with it. It could be air-cooled, and live happily.)
2080 card, No check... I have 2x Titan-V (12GB) cards and 2x Titan-Xp Collectors Edition (12GB) cards, and a Titan-X (Maxwell) which I am no longer using now.
The issue is something within the update, which, in combination with everything-else... (IRAY, Daz, Gen8, Video-Cards), the SUM of all parts are leading to a system-wide failure for many of us. Enough so, that it is sparking whole forums, outside of Daz, to be created about the issues. This is going to hurt Daz a little, along the way. Nvidia is in a similar boat, with the gaming community, in relation to "RTX", drivers not working right for RTX cards, and non-RTX cards, sue to the whole inclusion of this RTX "stuff", they are adding to the drivers.
Having a beast is irrelevant, when 95% of the work is done on the video card. This runs on an old-gen i5, with 16GB of slow DDR3 ram, normal hard drives and while being air-cooled with stock coolers. If your system isn't crashing now, its simply because you got a card with more VRAM, or you found the ONE CARD which this isn't happening to, or you are not rendering things where this happens.
I am sure there are others, with lesser systems, not having any issues too.
At least I know now, that it is nothing in my system of "Awesomeness", which is leading to the problems, other than, potentially, my video-cards, with this software. Which, was always my belief, from the beginning, since I never had a problem with the old software 4.10, and these cards. (Well, 4.10 beta, for the Titan-V cards to run. I don't think they ran on the 4.10 public release.)
It's funny because my work station running an older CPU and a 1080 can wipe a scene in a seconds that my new home i7 with x2 2080's can take hours deleting. It isn't system RAM they both have 64Gig. Both systems running same versions of drivers and Daz.
It maybe how a lot more apps are taking advantage of GPU processing, like dropbox and windows apps, which reduces your aloted GPU memory. Also check your task manager when exiting one daz scene to load another, you will probably find the old daz app still running for a LONG time in the background and reducing your GPU memory as well. Just click on it and kill the old one to free it up, I haven't dove into memory dumps yet to see what the frack it is doing for so long after it is suppose to have closed. Memory leak or missfiring messages or the new 2080 architecture still needing some driver improvements most likely....or PCIexpress?
I run a cheapo video card for my displays and the good ones for dedicated rendering, and I use 3 screens minimum with one always open to task manager to monitor GPU usage before kicking off renders.As long as my render GPU is idle and my scene doesn't exceed the GPU memory I never dump to CPU.
It was suggested to me by one of DAZ's trouble shooting techs who stated that they are aware of the issue and I should contact Nvidia and point out the problems. okay then....
Ignored. Other forum posters (who don't use Studio from what I could tell) Suggested I update my system. My rig isn't as good as some, but it's in the top 25%.
Upgrade a video card? Why? I have a RTX 2070 that still crashes to CPU, even when the other two GTX960's are pulled. Why spend money when the problem isn't going away?
It's not the driver or card. It's iray. I'm using Studio 4.9 on a laptop. 8 G8F, different skin, diffent hair, different clothing, Stonemason Urban 6. even with 2gb of Vram. it never crashed for a second. 12 test renders in the display port. still ran just fine. again and again.....it's Iray.
I did find coding to dump session GPU VRAM but it's all coded for Linux. not helpful here and I'm not a programer so it's all greek to me. a simple google search will show what's needed but of no use here...unfortunatley.
I'll miss denoise and dforce and the other features and all but it looks like the only solution at the moment for me is roll back to 4.9.
So until a soltion is found through upgrad/implimented script and temp fixes being a thing of the past. Peace out.
Same issue here. I have a GTX 1070 with 8 gigs of ram and when using Iray my CPU carries most of the load with only 2 figures and basic backdrop for a scene. My CPU temps get up to around 65-70 degrees. I can have a much bigger scene in Octane with temps in the 50's for CPU and GPU. I have DAZ studio configured to use the GPU but it doesn't matter....CPU carries most of the load.
I never render in DS, I render in Lightwave, faster and more options.
I've seen some animations done in lightwave and they look great! The only thing stopping me using other faster render programs is that they don't look anywhere near as good as iray and even if they are capable, any saved time is more than eaten up by bugs, incompatibilities for some items and having to mess with shaders for hours (ie octane). Is it easy to export to Lightwave or quite a hassle for part time hobbyists like myself? If its easier than Octane I'd give it a go. Tried Octane again this weekend and the glitches and bugs drove me insane before I had anything worth rendering lol.
DAZ Studio + IRay = Free
Lightwave Commercial version = $1,000
Pretty big elephant in the room, no?
The elephant everyone ignores when discussing alternate render engines.
Not to mention the time required to learn it.
What's situation with materials and, in general, the importation of Daz assets? And what do you use for a physics solution in lightwave? Imagine dforce assets are not recognized.
Those questions are part of what i mentioned.
It can take just a few minutes to export/import, but can take an inordinate amount of time, hours or even days, to set material definitions and reapply texture maps, depending on scene complexity. Not to mention any weirdness that can arise due to texture map/uv issues or material problems due to the mesh itself, scaling related problems, etc, etc, etc.
As far as physics, lightwave has a pretty good physics engine, but you'd probably have to spend a good deal of time setting up the particular cloth for the simulation and working out all the details to get it to work correctly.
It would be easier to to the sim in ds then export to lightwave, if doing a still. An animation on the other hand, i have no idea at this point how involved that might get.
Thanks for info. Sounded like you knew a bit about Lightwave and was curious.
Know very well how much work moving assets to other environements are. So have stayed away from this trend to move stuff to UE4, blender, Octane. Heard lots of good things about Lightwave so was curious. DAZ has a good thing going here. Hopefully this RTX - IRAY wrinkle gets sorted out sooner rather than later.
Back to 4.12.0.86/441.66 on win 7 with RTX2080Ti. Lucky for me that works great. As for DS Beta, where I do have big drop to CPU issues, yeah, i got same official reply as PDsmith posted. Hope given that DAZ chose IRAY to be at the heart of their rendering product, that they have a well-worn comm path to Nvidia IRAY, and that they are actually discussing and working on this issue together. Really hope.
Win10 is an issue too. It handles VRAM differently than win7, and it's worse for iray rendering. On win10 I would get constant drops to CPU in the middle of a render for no reason. Win7, the only time it will suddenly drop to CPU if it starts on GPU is a total driver crash. On win7 I can watch a 1080p movie/tv show while rendering no problem. Win 10 I couldn't even surf the net. Hell, sometimes just leaving it be, go do somethign in real life while rendering, I came back and it had dropped to CPU. Then gotta save, close, reopen and start the render over at square one. Hope it don't drop again. Was so annoying, I had to slipstream drivers and forget about using my ethernet to use win7 on this rig(no win7 driver for it at all).
Windows 10
Intel i7 - 3770 (3rd Gen)
Intel 800GB SSD
32GB Ram
Nividia RTX 2080 Ti - 11GB (using latest Nvidia studio driver)
Initially I had redering issues, crashes and dropping to cpu rendering, narrowed it down to mainly a problem with the driver, but also my bad rendering practices (bad habits) and my settings. I streamlined my rendering protocols for faster and smoother sailing when rendering.
Things I learned:
1. Don't Overclock the graphics card or the system. (while it does speed things up a bit, it also causes weird display issues in preview and kicks over to CPU rendering, and no noticable difference when pushed to final render)
2. Keep scene at or below 75% of your available "graphics card" memory (not total available). - 11GB Grapics Card memory x 0.75 = 8.25GB Max Scene size
3. Render Size Matters ( I now render small and achieve 100% convergence with a Render Quality of 4, and up the Render Time to 14400 and max samples to 30000) - still finishes the render in about 45 minutes with ~20000-25000 Iterations.
- at those settings, I have no need for noise filtering or the caustic/architectural Optimizers (these settings, I found, eat up video card and ram memory, causing the render to get kicked to the CPU)
4. I keep the smallest side of the image at 1000 pixels, and use ON1 Resize if I find the need to enlarge it. (with the amout of detail with the render settings I use - mentioned above, resizing is not an issue at all)
5. Also, when doing my final render, and after my final file save, I switch my Extened Dual monitors to a Single Display and I change the viewport to "Wire Bounding Box" while it renders. (dual displays and the viewport setting are adding a small load on the grapics card, that little bit could be enough to get kicked to CPU if DAZ is needing more mem).
6. All these things and it affects can be seen in realtime in the Performce tab in the Windows 10 Task Manager (right-click on your task bar). Your graphic card stats, including the load on your cuda cores, can be seen there.
Hope this helps
For me, the denoiser is the main culprit that crashes me. It crashes whenever one of my cards is almost full on memory because it tries to top on like another 2gb. After turning it off, I no longer crash.
as for more memory usage, I think every new version of iray is supposed to take up more memory to add slight gains to speed (although it's probably not worth the tradeoff).
How do you find ON1 Resize - do you notice any artefacts in the upscaled image? I tried Topaz Gigapixel AI (they have a trial download) and was impressed at first until I noticed that it made the results unrealistically sharp and had noticeabe artefacts. Still, it seemed to work better than the normal bicubic or lanczoz options in most image editors.
To be frank, I find all these tricks and workarounds very frustrating after paying a considerable amount to buy one of the recommended NVidia cards. I don't have the luxury of 11GB because I only have a 1070 but all of these problems since the release of 4.12 and NVidia RTX have rather dampened my enthusiasm for DAZ Studio and I'm looking at other options for a creative hobby.