IRM2019 Storytelling Feedback [Completed!]

FenixPhoenix

Apologies for the delay. I've now posted feedback for both @vwrangler and @dtrscbrutal. ~Stay safe everyone!

dtrscbrutal

That is some great feedback on my images FenixPhoenix, thank you for taking the time to write that up!
 The Sci-Fi runaway gave me a whole new appreciation for Mr. Rockwell's composition and artistic skill.  I think your examples are much better for creating this kind of image in 16x9. I look at my image now and think the wider format was not the best choice using the same POV as the original.
 Your vote for Chronicles Of The Witcher is much appreciated! Thanks for the compliment too! I have not seen the TV series, so this is definitely more inline with the Witcher games.
 I struggled a bit with how to present this image, as an action piece, or as more of a portrait and just let the scars do the talking. I ultimately chose the portrait route. 
 The examples you posted are inspiring all kinds of ideas for more The Witcher themed art!
 I really like how you use not only art, but movie, TV, and game images in your feedback. I think TV and game visuals are often under valued as artistic media and great story telling. 
   

FenixPhoenix

dtrscbrutal said:

That is some great feedback on my images FenixPhoenix, thank you for taking the time to write that up!
 The Sci-Fi runaway gave me a whole new appreciation for Mr. Rockwell's composition and artistic skill.  I think your examples are much better for creating this kind of image in 16x9. I look at my image now and think the wider format was not the best choice using the same POV as the original.
 Your vote for Chronicles Of The Witcher is much appreciated! Thanks for the compliment too! I have not seen the TV series, so this is definitely more inline with the Witcher games.
 I struggled a bit with how to present this image, as an action piece, or as more of a portrait and just let the scars do the talking. I ultimately chose the portrait route. 
 The examples you posted are inspiring all kinds of ideas for more The Witcher themed art!
 I really like how you use not only art, but movie, TV, and game images in your feedback. I think TV and game visuals are often under valued as artistic media and great story telling. 
   

My pleasure, @dtscbrutal! I'm glad you've found the feedback helpful and yes, something that works for one concept may not always work for another. The best way to start something would be to gather references and build what we call a "mood board" (where you determine the look & feel). Soon as you have that, everything else should come easier.

In regards to your Witcher entry, I understand. In fact, Esid (Alberto) and I didn't agree with your entry in various points. He thought that by giving him scars, the storytelling aspect was covered (even if briefly) while I maintained that the scars hinted at his story, but there was the actual storytelling (clarity) missing. Again, it goes to show how subjective everything is. Nonetheless, we both agreed that the mood and composition were stellar!

I haven't played the games, but I enjoyed the TV series.Yennefer stole the show for me, though. And as an avid fan of women portrayed not only strong but active, complex, capable of having ambition and interesting to boot, as well (which is sadly highly unusual), I appreciated the show even more. If you end up doing more witcher inspired art, please feel free to share! I would love to look at it!

And yes, you'd be surprised at the amount of visual artistry displayed by cinema and TV. I ended up getting hooked by Korean Dramas because they tend to be A LOT more poetic with their visual storytelling than American series. Though when it comes to instilling symbolism into almost every scene, you can look no further than Guillermo del Toro's work. If you haven't watched The Pan's Labyrinth (2006), you're missing out! To date, no movie, series or game has ever topped it for me. Trailer below:

The beautiful and sophisticated thing about this movie is that it is up to us and our interpretation whether the fantastical aspect is reality OR whether it's the girl's way to escape the horror of war. This is set during when General Francisco Franco is in power, five years after the Spanish Civil War. People live in fear under the Francoist regime and this girl, Ofelia, is brought into Captain Vidal's home (a man who married her sick mother). As the story unravels, this little girl ends basically and ironically ends up taking refuge with literal monsters to escape humans who act like monsters. Just writing this makes me want to go and watch it again!

vwrangler

Thank you so much for all your feedback!

I love this image! The storytelling accomplished with a single render and a short description is not only on-point but effective and well thought out. I have nothing to add to this image in terms of improvements and I'll even go as far as to say this was one of my favorite entries.

Thank you so much!

I especially loved the subtext the man in the balcony gave me. The pose suggested to me he might have superpowers and he might've used them at that moment.

I have to admit, that did not occur to me!

> TIME PASSAGES

I love this image as well and I wasn't surprised to see it win the main competition. Like with the previous one, it's hard to find an area of opportunity to improve an already strong entry. So rather than any improvements in regards to composition, I'll offer some feedback (highly subjective, like everything when it comes to art) on the concept.

Areas of opportunity: Both Esid and I felt that the second frame/iteration felt disconnected to the other two by the absence of the father figure. Since the story to us was about the evolution of their father-son relationship (not just the son's life), adding the presence of the father to the second frame could tighten everything up more, even if subtly.

Two ideas that come to mind to achieve this:

• The first is to simply add a picture frame of him and his father to the shot.
• The second is to incorporate the father perhaps trying to tidy up the son's room.

I couldn't find any references for those ideas, so I hope the description is enough. If I do find any, I'll add them!

Yes, those make a lot of sense. I couldn't think of a good way to add the father for the middle image, but I realize now that I just should have made the son a little younger there, and have the father doing something like turning out the light. I want to eventually redo those images as part of a longer series, so I'll incorporate your ideas then. Thank you!

FenixPhoenix

Apologies for being MIA, life's been crazy with the pandemic.

I've now added feedback for @zombietaggerung and @Mollytabby.

vwrangler

@FenixPhoenix: somewhere on the first page of the thread is a link to a site called wallpapervortex.com; my AV blocked access to it as a threat/malware site.

FenixPhoenix

vwrangler said:

@FenixPhoenix: somewhere on the first page of the thread is a link to a site called wallpapervortex.com; my AV blocked access to it as a threat/malware site.

Hi Vwrangler, I'm thinking the link you mentioned would've been on the newest feedback post, but I couldn't find it. So I took out the images and linked them instead. That way, at least, people should be able to read the post and decide whether to open the images or not. To be frank, the feedback for these entries can be understood without the images.

zombietaggerung

FenixPhoenix said:

Username: @zombietaggerung

DECISIONS

Both Esid and I loved this one. I think if we had awarded someone for the sheer potential in regards to storytelling through subtext, this entry would've won hands down. That's because the mood in combination with some of the objects in your scene makes for a great setup; one which could be enriched with symbolism!

Areas of opportunity: Therein lies the areas of opportunity. You have a ton of objects which aren't being explored and used to push your storytelling.

Clarity:

• Before jumping into the symbolism, I think it's important to point this out. The low light and shallow depth in combination with the camera angle in regards to the gun's position made it difficult to discern what we were seeing. Now, keep in mind that Esid understood what it was right away. I sort of guessed given the bullets but wasn't entirely sure. When I asked another person, she ironically made out the gun but she wasn't sure what the bullets were. So perhaps you could change the positioning of the gun so it's a bit more apparent.
• Also, in the right corner of the picture, there's a metal sphere. I'd paint that out to avoid becoming a focus point (because of the contrast).

Symbolism:

Okay, now let's examine the objects you've added to your scene.

Gun, Drink & Bullets:

• I love that the title of your piece invites us to interpret what's happening. These three objects (right at the center of the piece) are the richest in storytelling. Usually "having a drink" or showing an alcoholic beverage implies depression or being torn about a difficult decision. So that pulls us into this depressing mood. The addition of a gun and bullets may signify that this character is about to do something drastic which may involve killing several people.
• Now, you could add clarity on top of the layer you've already created, by positioning one bullet and a drink on one side (grouped close together), then the gun in the middle, then a group of bullets on the other side of the gun. In that respect, we now have a character torn between killing those who wrong him or killing himself. The title, thus, comes into play even more as the character mulls over his dilemma.

The Piano:

• Oftentimes a piano can represent romance, loneliness, and/or introspection. Adding a layer of dust to this piano may help you showcase neglect, for instance, which can contribute to the sad mood.
• Perhaps he used to play the piano for someone who was murdered by a group of thugs? Or maybe that piano used to be played by that someone and, since she's gone, he's unwilling to touch it for fear of erasing his/her touch?

• In that respect, you could add that missing link in storytelling by either placing a photo atop the piano (or maybe he's holding that picture frame) or even adding a newspaper atop it with the title big enough to be discernible and give us a hint of what's going on.

The Window & the Clock:

• While I like the illumination, I find what's being shown through the window a bit distracting. My advice would be to set a better time of the day so the window contributes to the story. Then use the clock to make it clear what time of the day it is. In addition, a clock can symbolize your character is under the "pressure of running out of time".
• A stormy day, for example, would tell us that the character is torn; increasing pent-up anger threatening to spill out.
• A sunset (red and oranges) would let us know that he's depressed, that life as he knows it has ended.
• A sunrise (yellow, purples, and blues) would tell us he's made his decision as the light of a new day comes in. Sunrise usually signifies hope, but it could also be used to add contrast with the situation: beauty in the face of tragedy, for example.
• Showing an ocean rather than a mountain can symbolize that he's drowning (if the ocean is stormy) or he's settling down (if the ocean is tranquil). If the ocean seems to go on forever, he may be feeling lost or adrift.

Although I didn't provide many visual references, I hope my explanations sufficed. Again, great work in building that mood!

---

Useful feedback, thank you. I wasn't really happy with the BG either, but I don't have any stormy sky HDRis; I should invest in some. And I'm glad the dark tone of the image was apparent without being too dark. The sphere in the right corner is actually the wall light from the set, but if I cropped the image a bit tighter it wouldn't be visible. 

It's been awhile, but I'll revisit this image and make tweaks. Thank you again. 

FenixPhoenix

Apologies once again for the delay. I'm doing my best, but I've just been very busy lately. Feedback for @xmasrose (aka tulipe) and @Gerterasmus has been added to the first page of this thread!

Diomede

I will be taking a ZBrush sculpting class so hope to revise my toon-style figures as per your suggestions. I will start over for the card-soldiers as per your suggesitons.   Thanks again for all your time and attention.  

FenixPhoenix

Diomede said:

I will be taking a ZBrush sculpting class so hope to revise my toon-style figures as per your suggestions. I will start over for the card-soldiers as per your suggesitons.   Thanks again for all your time and attention.  

That sounds great, best of luck on your new adventure, @Diomede!

FenixPhoenix

Feedback for @Sisyphus1977 has been uploaded. And I should have @LaPartita's and @Dartanbeck's feedback added shortly! I deeply apologize for the delay in getting to you guys. I can't believe it's been almost a year already. I hope that, although quite late, the feedback will still be of some use!

FenixPhoenix

And with that, we have finished! I hope to see you all participate again in this year's It's Raining Men 2020 Contest! Thank you very much for your patience and understanding!

Diomede

Diomede said:

I will be taking a ZBrush sculpting class so hope to revise my toon-style figures as per your suggestions. I will start over for the card-soldiers as per your suggesitons.   Thanks again for all your time and attention.  

Just glancing over changes in the rules.  Notice the comment on limiting embedded text.  Would polishing this still be in the spirit of the new rules?  Obviously, I can try to polish it without the text, so I'm really asking about preference.  Not just abiding by the letter of the rules, which I guess 4 lines still is, but is it still in the spiirit of the rules?

 

FenixPhoenix

Diomede said:

Diomede said:

I will be taking a ZBrush sculpting class so hope to revise my toon-style figures as per your suggestions. I will start over for the card-soldiers as per your suggesitons.   Thanks again for all your time and attention.  

Just glancing over changes in the rules.  Notice the comment on limiting embedded text.  Would polishing this still be in the spirit of the new rules?  Obviously, I can try to polish it without the text, so I'm really asking about preference.  Not just abiding by the letter of the rules, which I guess 4 lines still is, but is it still in the spiirit of the rules?

 

Good question, so long as the text is part of the image, we'll allow it. The four-sentence limit was for narrative added to explain the render. Last year we got some entries that, were it not for the written narrative, wouldn't really be considered storytelling if we looked at the render only. So we want to push the visual part of the storytelling by adding this limitation.

Richard Haseltine

Scurried is Succried in the second image