We need muscle simulation system
opppoe_c02b0d86
Posts: 53
The original body deformation is always wrong, especially the back, shoulders, and chest
Waist, hips, etc.
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That would be a dream come true: muscle, body fat and skin simulation on a anatomical correct skeleton making correct joint bending possible without the need for JCMs. I'm afraid, that' s still high end technology only. Does Maya have it? Just curious.
They call it "Maya (r) Muscle". Been in for at least 10 years.To be honest, I find binding a muscle capsule to a skeleton, a fat capsule to a muscle, skin to fat to be easier than joint controlled morphs. JCM has alwasy seemed too much like voodoo to me.
Unfortunatley, fantasy figures often defy biomechanical principles like fluid incomprehensibility and have to be treated as magic.
The problem is that the muscles span across three sections of the body, and DAZ and others are stuck in the same section. Think of the clay motion wooden puppet.
huh
What do you mean here?
I think they're saying that the way DAZ figures generally work, each section is essentially separate, only really interacting at the joints. But muscles can span notjust the joint between two body sections, but three, which DAZ Studio (as it currently works) wouldn't be able to handle.
However, the way you'd do a muscle system is actually closer to a cloth simulation, which doesn't particularly care how many body sections it spans.
Seen Ziva? It's interesting but looks like a lot of work (these things are always a lot of work...).
JCM's are amazing cos of the freedom to tie in all kinds of morphs.
Haha, exactly. Which is why really like JCM's, and hope that freedom is never lost.
What would love is a an XML based Physics system to bring the mesh via bones (and maybe even JCM's to life) with all kinds of parameters defineable. Springs etc. Full meal deal.
Bullet Physics has been already used to make skinned mesh physics in Real time. But DAZ would need to find someone who loves bullet physics full-time to implement that.
Makehuman actually has a rigged muscle option, not sure how effective that is though
@WendyLuvsCatz
Sometime ago you shared a fun vid made in Unreal RT with body physics. That all ties in with simulation of body components (muscle,tissue). Have you done more? or discovered anything else? Am still keeping an eye on Unreal for the future. By then blueprints may be even more advanced as I really want less to do with programming.
i dont know if jcms will allow us to do something like this but it'd be nice (this vid is 8 years old)
https://player.vimeo.com/video/52668394
we also need tension/stress maps to really sell the realism
https://blender.community/c/rightclickselect/zQfbbc/
all this is being discussed on chris jones' blog on blender forums.
Or we need AI, that just learns, how human antomy works.
I don't think you need AI. The problem has already been solved, more or less. It's a question of if/how to implement it. JCM can't possibly work though, as you have two variables (joint position and flex amount), whereas morphs are simple linear interpolations to a target. So I suppose some system is required for realism. You'd also need some soft-body going on there too.
I was secretly hoping that this will be the next big generational upgrade. Gen8 figures are getting a bit old now, maybe gen 9, will make the leap. At least that would make it worth the upgrade, because unless there is some ground breaking improvement I'd be reluctant to move on from Gen8.
I'm just afraid, there is no leap, and this is the reason, why we don't have a G9 yet. It just doesn't make sense yet.
We're stuck
I just added spring to bones
it's not really accurate
Cinema4D has a toon rig that lets you do more than just rotate and move bones. Since we can already scale bones, maybe there is a way to implement that? Might not make things anymore realistic, per se, but more options?
How sophisticated & detailed & customizable are the parameters for what you are using? Do you have a /resource link showing features & options of that one physics item?
I am confused as to what you are talking about to be honest
I was assuming you meant one of my videos with the bouncing boobs
muscles?, Cinema4D has that, very complex to aproach with real sense, is like a secondary weight mapping over your primary rigging AND primary weight mapping, ugh!
Yes that was the topic.
Physics with springs can be very complex, and on top potentially with some systems you may weightpaint mesh with different and more bones for increased effects. When you wrote it's not really accurate, I was wondering about what you were using and how customizable it is.
I just added a spring bone to each of the pectorals in the Unreal Third Person animation Blueprint
but it is not really physics
well looks like you can do what I did in Unreal in DAZ studio now
https://www.daz3d.com/spring-dynamics-for-daz-studio
Yes, but that one is expensive
The works I want to do are about dance, gymnastics, and jiu-jitsu, but the effect is very bad, and the deformer can't save it. Carving is too troublesome
This is great
I've spent a bit of time with C4D's muscle system, and might implement it with an original character I modeled, but it's quite a lot to deal with.
There's already flex-based muscularity morphs released for genesis one, genesis two and Genesis eight Although, I really like the original genesis muscle morphs and have since copied them over to genesis 8 via GenX. But the morphs I really want to see are from Faux2d!
Yup, got it today plus FacialAnim. Very good price when include my DO coupon. Want to support Daz and animation initiatives, so bought today, though am busy with other stuff ATM.
Based on Video, it's a nice start, and not as complex as was alluding to. Like you wrote maybe not that accurate. But until check out, won't say that too loudly yet. Will have to see if maybe adding secondary bones to rig with weight paint will work for extra dynamics. Wish Daz weightpainting was easier to use. Find it a bit awkward for anything less than 100% or 0. Did recode the color system for weights display so more intuitive for me. But the weight-brush option is too coarse depsite all the options for customization. That's after many efforts over last 2 years.
I am currently working on a real-time realistic muscle deformation system for Daz. Progress is slow but I think it will be worth the wait.
Here is a sample: