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A large percentage of the time I see people in the forums asking to contact a vendor, it's just becaue they want to know which hair they used in their promos. How many of those are they supposed to answer a day?
Ah, I see. I misunderstood your meaning. Apologies.
Short answer: If you don't know what's going on, it's about money
It would certainly be nice if Daz handled tech support in a reputable manner for vendors, but Daz's version of TS leaves a lot to be desired. I have a 20 day old ticket open and have yet to even get a hello, and this isn't the first time. It pretty much motivates me to just return products whenever I can, and I don't see how that is really living up to their end of the bargain.
I honestly don't blame PAs since people can get angry and not know what they are talking about
Customer: "This skin looks terrible!"
PA: "How is your lighting and shader settings?"
Customer: "Tell me how to get it to look like the promos!"
PA: "I'm sorry but that is secrets. But maybe turn down bump map?"
Customer: "This is terrible!"
So yeah
I'm going to put in a quick note that that Daz-Deals plugin, which I resisted using for quite some time, has the wonderful feature of linking to forum threads where a product is mentioned (a mention has to include the link to the store page to count). That means if there's an existing tech support thread, it's fast and easy to find it without searching.
I can't go back to using Daz without Daz-Deals. If you want to direct your spending to the more accessible PAs, it's a fast way to tell how responsive a PA is - check out the forum posts where the product is listed, see if there's an official tech support thread, and how the PA has been responding. Not the same as the official mechanism you're looking for, but pretty close to the opt-in mechanism being requested here.
The problem with that is, of course, that sometimes a product has been mentioned a lot in a thread that has very little to do with the product and there's a lot of noise to signal, so it might be nice if Daz had 'official tech support threads' that could be linked on the store page without needing the plugin if a PA has provided such a thread. That would be pretty much the opt-in mechanism I think is being requested in the thread.
A lot of PA's are willing to talk with their customers if they have the time. We are in constant development and in many cases are working on a very tight schedule and deadlines. If it's something technical with the pack Daz contacts the PA and has them fix it. Some don't like to talk with customers cause they can be rude to a very extreme manor if it doesn't work exactly the way they want it to, but it's not that common. We've always allowed our customers to talk with us and we ask if they are having problems to contact us directly. Who knows the pack better than we do? We've told Daz to direct our customer's questions to us. There isn't much we won't tell you to get you to the point of getting what you expect, but 9.8 times out of 10 if you can't get the same results that are in the promos it has to do with your lighting and render settings. In regards to the product not working right, a lot of times their are dials that are being missed on accident and on some rare occasions it's an error on our part and most will put a fix through. These are just the common problems we've ran into. Each PA has their common problems they run into.
The PAs that have open forum threads are generally very receptive to customer feedback. It is also very easy to send a PM. But it is important to remember that DAZ3D takes 50% of every transaction to run the store and provide customer support. That's real money for a real service.
Requesting a refund is legitimate customer feedback.
One doesn't need to spend that much time here to understand why some PA's do not want direct contact with the customers "There is nothing wrong with my computer and I have installed everything correctly, it is your product that doesn't work [cencored]"
On top of that, when one takes into account the possible language barriers and the PA possibly not being a computer wizard him/herself, not wanting to receive such messages is perfectly understandable when DAZ is already taking a cut for being in the middle and filtering out the ones that the PA has nothing to do with.
Sadly, the only time I really get issues resolved that are general bugs is by going to the pa customer service doesn't seem to escalate or inform pas of issues. And these are legit issues, ones that are in bug tracker. Usually the pa says they have not been told about the issue.
Sadly, there was a message here within the last week, where the PA said he/she just got the information about a problem and was making the fixes... The previous message on that thread was posted a year ago...
ChangelingChick
Very valid reasoning.
Matt_Castle
Bearing in mind that the problem is often not the product itself, but how it's being used.
This is true, kit bashing is big example of that. I should have stated I was referring to properly used items.
AlmightyQUEST
I think real world interactions with various stores crept in when I said that.
BandoriFan
This person makes a valid point and something I had responded to in another thread.
To expand on that other post...When I am looking through the store and I see so very little information on a product. You can't blame a customer for bypassing said product as a result. There are two problems with this.
The first is the multitude of questions about what products are used in the promos. I was under the impression everyone was to give credit for items used in images and animations. Why should a customer do this, if the vendors don't? The readme is only helpful if you have already bought the product, not so helpful to those who want to know beforehand. Also only helpful if the vendor gave the information in the readme and I find many don't.
Secondly, people are attracted to a product based on the promo's used. If a customer can not acheive that same look, they are disappointed and may return said item, resulting in loss of revenue. Now I am aware that not all promo's have been done by the vendor, in many cases they are from product testors. In either case, having the promo's in the gallery with a brief on how the image was created, listed items used and then linked in the store, that would solve many questions, reduce let downs and product returns and quite the tempers of more vocal customers.
On a separate note...If I have a problem with a product, of which I currently do with one from Mada, which I think is actually my fault this time, I will make a thread, name the vendor in the title and add help or problem, to get their attention. If they respond, great, if they don't, maybe someone else will respond and lastly, I get no help and, after banging my head on the keyboard a few times, move on.
If I would ever encounter a problem that would make a product useless for me in it's sold form, and if i could return said item without having to cancel a special deal I managed to get through it, then returning it would be the obvious thing to do, as waiting for DAZlands Tech Department to fix any bugs can take any time from "none at all" to "never at all".
And sadly just a few years ago this wasn't the case, or didn't seem to be. The store support was generally quick, responsive, and on top of things. I'm hoping that whatever has been going on starts getting better again, since I know they can do better as they have in the past.
A few years ago there were less than half the PA's and products coming out weekly too and far fewer customers as well.
For the Daz Deals wanting an "official" forum for products-- that's what the commercial forum is for. That's where we're supposed to post commercial threads for support and info about our products. If it's in that forum, it's an "official" thread.
In an instance like that I totally agree, but that is not what was posted and what I responded to. I am all for refunds on products that are faulty, don't work as advertised or not what the user envisioned or wanted, but not just for the sake of trying to make some statement to hurt the PA and DAZ which is how that came across to me. I work in retail and don't have much sympathy for most customers as they are usually entitled idiots that are quick to go off without taking a minute to try and get a solution or see both sides of the issue.
I guess when you encounter a customer like that you would rather give him/her a refund and ask him/her to leave, right? It's a win-win situation: trouble makers (though it's always debatable whether someone is indeed a trouble maker...) gone, and your time saved. I work in customer service industry too, and I have the tendency to treat customers who ask questions as trouble makers by default (let's be honest, who likes to answer customers' questions especially when you think they are just babbling 'nonsense'?)
I just don't even bother to ask either the PA or DAZ if the product is faulty. For instance, I once bought a G8.1M character with wrong map in the package. I don't even bother to know whose fault was that. PAs and DAZ are on the same ship. If the ship sinks, both parties suffer.
We have no problem to be contacted directly by any customer. If any of you have any problem with a product of ours, or need help with it, you can contact us directly through these ways:
- Facebook fan page: https://www.facebook.com/EmmaAndJordi
- Email: jordircardona@yahoo.com
We will try to reply through those ways as soon as possible.
But then Daz's refund policy discourages too many refunds "To prevent abuse of the refund policy, if the number of returns from a customer is excessive or repetitive, Daz 3D reserves the right to discontinue refunds for that customer..." So they expect you to write off your losses if you see too many issues with products bought here.
Moreover, given that the sales strategy often encourages purchases in bulk, many buyers aren't likely to test every product they bought within 30 days of purchase.
Reserves the right doesn't mean always will - I'm sure they take account of the circumstances, and would be less concerned about refund requests for cause.
That might have been understable if the policy mentioned it that way. But instead, it is worded in a way that only considers the "number of returns".
I believe most users don't abuse the refund policy and only request refund for items which they really got fed up with. Look how many threads in the forum asking for help from fellow users and you know most users actively seek help instead of just sitting there screaming for refund. But yeah some people just can't test out all products in 30 days if they bulk purchase.
My point was if someone got really distressed by a product and what he/she said was likely to be interpreted as something aimed at hurting PA or DAZ (well guys never forget the benefit of the doubt okay?) then obviously he/she should go request a refund. At least all parties would feel better.
No one should be accused of voicing out his/her dissatisfaction when he/she made the decision to buy something because he/she wanted to achieve the same result as the promo image. That's just really normal. And no one should interpret those words of dissatisfaction as something planned to hurt PA or DAZ. There's a saying in where I live: "I speaking to you at the top of my lungs does not mean I am being impolite" Sounds ridiculous to some of you? Well, benefit of the doubt, guys. Benefit of the doubt.
Huge thanks to PAs who interact with us forum users (or... ahem 'forumites'... I actually find this name hilarious and I kind of like it). For PAs who rely on DAZ to answer user questions, maybe a little more love should be given to the customer service/tech support team to help them clear those old tickets. Thanks everyone.
As Daz don't implement any form of DRM, their refund policy is largely reliant on the customer's honour that they've removed the product and all back-ups from their system.
This is Daz's back-up clause for if they think a customer's refund requests seem fraudulent.