Harpsburg for DAZ Studio - Nitpicking on details

nonesuch00

Sevrin said:

I don't get all the fuss.  Pigs and whistles don't especially go together, but a pub called Pig and Whistle wouldn't raise eyebrows.

Is pigs slang in the British Isles for a cop too? I know bobby is. Pig was a slang word very popular in the 70s for policeman in the USA and is still used pretty frequently by the same types that swear it's their right to make up whatever traffic laws they please to, whenever they please to. The whistle would be referring to the whistles traffic cops used back before automated traffic lights.

maikdecker

nonesuch00 said:

Here the difference is massive population growth. e.g. I spent me 1st 30 years only seeing 1 turkey in the wild, no foxes, otters, bears, deer, elk, buffalo, bluebirds, vultures, owls, falcons, hawks, eagles, and pretty much every other sort of wild animal that wasn't a bird adapted to urban surroundings (eg sparrow and starling) or a small rodent likewise adapted (mice, rats, squirrels) to the sitation now where I have seen of those and continue to see them regularly.

When I lived in Europe I only saw tourist / zoo favorite wild animals if I visited the Alps, eg, Steinbock, Murmeltier, hmmm, and that's it actually. Everywhere else nothing except water birds at the lakes and other small birds and so on. I guess foxes raiding trash cans at 2 in the morning should count as wild animals.

I would hazard the guess that the main reason of seeing more wildlife in the USofA than in Europe nowadays is probably the fact that here in Europe the amount of rural areas in which that wildlife can spread is a little bit more scarce compared to the USofA, which it's large areas of non-populated landscape. With hunting no longer being the main source of meat production, the probability of wildlife to multiply in numbers should be high in those areas, which should lead to the offspring of said wildlife moving into new areas when their origins get crowded.

In Europe on the other hand, the wild/rural areas are sparse and small, so most of the animals are rather close to dying out than to become a menance. Add to that, Murmeltiere, Steinböcke and many other european animals are quite specialised in their needs of food and habitats and can't just go from the Alps to the Flatlands. But yes, some animals do move into villages/cities to live there. Foxes are quite shy and probably not that often seen, except in small villages. But raccoons, who either fled or were freed from pelt farms, become a more common sight in some cities in Europe. As do wild boars, as mentioned. In Mecklenburg-Western Pommerania there's a small population of Nandu (zoological American Rhea) is roaming the landscape after escaping a breeder's enclosure. But on the other hand, in most parts of (at least western) Europe there's not much large wildlife around to get into cities. Deer usually is too shy, except for Swedish Mooses. Wolves and Bears are rare and also tend to stay away from humans. Some birds of prey have adapted to cities (as big buildings aren't that different from big rocks to nest upon) but it depends on the food they can find. Buzzards are often seen on the ground besides roads taking care of roadkill (usual rabbits) but Eagles are a rare sight in a city.

In the end it's that the USofA have way more rural and uninhabited areas than europe. And that Europe has been way more densely inhabited than the USofA for centuries. We had more time to kill off our wild animals

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Gordig said:

DaremoK3 said:

I believe I finally understand why they named the giant combat robots "Jaeger" in Pacific Rim.  If I was working on Japanese Kaiju story, I would not have thought to research German for my naming conventions...

Well, Pacific Rim isn't really a Japanese story, despite the clear Japanese influence. Even so, it's not unheard of for modern Japanese storytellers to pull from a variety of mostly European languages to make their names more exotic. Hell, a lot of viz kei bands have elaborate French names that are unpronounceable in Japanese. 

The japanese Manga industry clearly has a fetish for foreign languages and on the other hand don't give a flying eff about using them in the proper context. Those Jäger/Jaeger in Pacific Rim are one of the positive exceptions, as IIRC it was their job to hunt those Kaiju, making them Kaiju Hunters or Kaiju Jäger 

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Sevrin said:

I don't get all the fuss.  Pigs and whistles don't especially go together, but a pub called Pig and Whistle wouldn't raise eyebrows.

Proving my point, as a "pub" (or rather Kneipe) in Germany called "Schwein und Trillerpfeife (or "Flöte")" would stand out like a pink panda and surely raise many eyebrows.

PerttiA

maikdecker said:

In Europe on the other hand, the wild/rural areas are sparse and small, so most of the animals are rather close to dying out than to become a menance.

... But on the other hand, in most parts of (at least western) Europe there's not much large wildlife around to get into cities. Deer usually is too shy, except for Swedish Mooses. Wolves and Bears are rare and also tend to stay away from humans. 

In the end it's that the USofA have way more rural and uninhabited areas than europe. And that Europe has been way more densely inhabited than the USofA for centuries. We had more time to kill off our wild animals

Ahem... We are also part of Europe and EU up here, and unlike our friends in the central and southern regions, we do not like having the neighbours within shouting (note the spelling) distance. Deer and moose can be seen almost every day, birds are so common/plenty that it would feel quite strange if one didn't see/hear any, the wolves that had been exterminated some hundred years ago, are fast spreading into the 'densely' populated southwestern areas, and even bears are found (no, not polar bears) throughout the country instead of just along the eastern border.

Jason Galterio

DaremoK3 said:

Great thread, I have learned a lot.

@Jason Galterio :

"Why do you have the Chinese character for soup as a tattoo?"

I respectfully disagree.  Unless your wife is a life-long professional linguist, she probably does not know every meaning of every character, symbol, or radical that makes up every character in existence.

Let alone, the comparable differences between the Hanzi, Kanji, or Hanja, and that one character could have several different meanings all depending on context.

So, while the person who saw that character on their Chinese food soup container saw that same character on some other persons body and believes only that person had some tattoo artist erroneously tattoo the word soup on them by mistake, indifference, or pure mallice might not be correct, and the character could mean exactly what the recipient of the tattoo intended (luck, brave, strong, flower, whatever [don't know off-hand and my learning/translation software is on my workbox that I have no access to check for "soup", find all variable characters, and cross-reference them to other meanings while writing this in Linux]).

However, I believe she would be strongly correct in her assessment of the character appearing upside down or even backwards, because an artist might not know how it was supposed to be orientated correctly, but surely a Chinese woman would (even I can tell when I look at characters from my many years of study).

 

For the rest of this interesting conversation, I know nothing of the German language, so I find all your insights enlightening.

I believe I finally understand why they named the giant combat robots "Jaeger" in Pacific Rim.  If I was working on Japanese Kaiju story, I would not have thought to research German for my naming conventions...

The quote is from an episode of The Big Bang Theory where Sheldon noticed the tattoo on Penny's lower back.

My wife speaks fluent Chinese, having been brought up speaking / writing / reading, so I don't think you need to be a linguist to make an informed guess.

For my case all I am looking for is an informed guess. "Does that actually say restuarant in the background?" for example.

Jason Galterio

Gordig said:

DaremoK3 said:

I believe I finally understand why they named the giant combat robots "Jaeger" in Pacific Rim.  If I was working on Japanese Kaiju story, I would not have thought to research German for my naming conventions...

Well, Pacific Rim isn't really a Japanese story, despite the clear Japanese influence. Even so, it's not unheard of for modern Japanese storytellers to pull from a variety of mostly European languages to make their names more exotic. Hell, a lot of viz kei bands have elaborate French names that are unpronounceable in Japanese. 

Kaiju / sentai / rider shows commonly use non-Japanese words for characters / creatures. So Pacific Rim adopting the same approach makes sense.

50-52 episodes a year, plus the movies / TV specials, with multiple shows running concurrently... You run out of names for the monster of the week quick.

Edit to add: A good example is "Red King" from the Ultra shows. He's (at least I think it's a he) probably one of the most recognizible Ultra kaiju having been around from the beginining...  Yet he isn't red and isn't the king of anything.

maikdecker

PerttiA said:

maikdecker said:

In Europe on the other hand, the wild/rural areas are sparse and small, so most of the animals are rather close to dying out than to become a menance.

... But on the other hand, in most parts of (at least western) Europe there's not much large wildlife around to get into cities. Deer usually is too shy, except for Swedish Mooses. Wolves and Bears are rare and also tend to stay away from humans. 

In the end it's that the USofA have way more rural and uninhabited areas than europe. And that Europe has been way more densely inhabited than the USofA for centuries. We had more time to kill off our wild animals

Ahem... We are also part of Europe and EU up here, and unlike our friends in the central and southern regions, we do not like having the neighbours within shouting (note the spelling) distance. Deer and moose can be seen almost every day, birds are so common/plenty that it would feel quite strange if one didn't see/hear any, the wolves that had been exterminated some hundred years ago, are fast spreading into the 'densely' populated southwestern areas, and even bears are found (no, not polar bears) throughout the country instead of just along the eastern border.

I'm sorry to have only spoken from my middle-european standpoint, forgetting the sub-arctic regions (Sweden, Norway, Finland and Denmark) and the alpine ranges (where wolves aren't that rare and eagles fly) or the more eastern parts, where it sometimes advised to carry a gun when going into the woods if one doesn't wants to get bit in the gluteus maximus by a bear...

---

Jason Galterio said:

Edit to add: A good example is "Red King" from the Ultra shows. He's (at least I think it's a he) probably one of the most recognizible Ultra kaiju having been around from the beginining...  Yet he isn't red and isn't the king of anything.

King Crabs aren't ruling over any kingdome either, so I'm okay with that...

Jason Galterio

Heh. My all time favorite is "Company President Gravestone" from Dairanger.

Not only does the name sound like someone picked random English words out of a bag, but the costume has gibberish for the name.

And, just because, the gravestone opens to reveal a zippo lighter top. Which of course is used as a flamethrower. Because why not?

maikdecker

Jason Galterio said:

Heh. My all time favorite is "Company President Gravestone" from Dairanger.

Not only does the name sound like someone picked random English words out of a bag, but the costume has gibberish for the name.

And, just because, the gravestone opens to reveal a zippo lighter top. Which of course is used as a flamethrower. Because why not?

And he goes into combat wearing soccer cleats? Curiouser and curiouser, as Alice would say...

Jason Galterio

maikdecker said:

Jason Galterio said:

Heh. My all time favorite is "Company President Gravestone" from Dairanger.

Not only does the name sound like someone picked random English words out of a bag, but the costume has gibberish for the name.

And, just because, the gravestone opens to reveal a zippo lighter top. Which of course is used as a flamethrower. Because why not?

And he goes into combat wearing soccer cleats? Curiouser and curiouser, as Alice would say...

I think it's called "this is what we had laying around and we're all out of budget."

I can't imagine how they come up with a new costume (or two), write the script (whatever little there is of that), choreograph the fight scenes, film, and edit one episode a week for almost a full year. Granted they reuse a lot of stock footage, but still. It seems insane.

Gordig

maikdecker said:

nonesuch00 said:

Here the difference is massive population growth. e.g. I spent me 1st 30 years only seeing 1 turkey in the wild, no foxes, otters, bears, deer, elk, buffalo, bluebirds, vultures, owls, falcons, hawks, eagles, and pretty much every other sort of wild animal that wasn't a bird adapted to urban surroundings (eg sparrow and starling) or a small rodent likewise adapted (mice, rats, squirrels) to the sitation now where I have seen of those and continue to see them regularly.

When I lived in Europe I only saw tourist / zoo favorite wild animals if I visited the Alps, eg, Steinbock, Murmeltier, hmmm, and that's it actually. Everywhere else nothing except water birds at the lakes and other small birds and so on. I guess foxes raiding trash cans at 2 in the morning should count as wild animals.

I would hazard the guess that the main reason of seeing more wildlife in the USofA than in Europe nowadays is probably the fact that here in Europe the amount of rural areas in which that wildlife can spread is a little bit more scarce compared to the USofA, which it's large areas of non-populated landscape. With hunting no longer being the main source of meat production, the probability of wildlife to multiply in numbers should be high in those areas, which should lead to the offspring of said wildlife moving into new areas when their origins get crowded.

In Europe on the other hand, the wild/rural areas are sparse and small, so most of the animals are rather close to dying out than to become a menance. Add to that, Murmeltiere, Steinböcke and many other european animals are quite specialised in their needs of food and habitats and can't just go from the Alps to the Flatlands. But yes, some animals do move into villages/cities to live there. Foxes are quite shy and probably not that often seen, except in small villages. But raccoons, who either fled or were freed from pelt farms, become a more common sight in some cities in Europe. As do wild boars, as mentioned. In Mecklenburg-Western Pommerania there's a small population of Nandu (zoological American Rhea) is roaming the landscape after escaping a breeder's enclosure. But on the other hand, in most parts of (at least western) Europe there's not much large wildlife around to get into cities. Deer usually is too shy, except for Swedish Mooses. Wolves and Bears are rare and also tend to stay away from humans. Some birds of prey have adapted to cities (as big buildings aren't that different from big rocks to nest upon) but it depends on the food they can find. Buzzards are often seen on the ground besides roads taking care of roadkill (usual rabbits) but Eagles are a rare sight in a city.

In the end it's that the USofA have way more rural and uninhabited areas than europe. And that Europe has been way more densely inhabited than the USofA for centuries. We had more time to kill off our wild animals

---

Gordig said:

DaremoK3 said:

I believe I finally understand why they named the giant combat robots "Jaeger" in Pacific Rim.  If I was working on Japanese Kaiju story, I would not have thought to research German for my naming conventions...

Well, Pacific Rim isn't really a Japanese story, despite the clear Japanese influence. Even so, it's not unheard of for modern Japanese storytellers to pull from a variety of mostly European languages to make their names more exotic. Hell, a lot of viz kei bands have elaborate French names that are unpronounceable in Japanese. 

The japanese Manga industry clearly has a fetish for foreign languages and on the other hand don't give a flying eff about using them in the proper context. Those Jäger/Jaeger in Pacific Rim are one of the positive exceptions, as IIRC it was their job to hunt those Kaiju, making them Kaiju Hunters or Kaiju Jäger 

Again, though, Pacific Rim was neither Japanese nor manga/anime. I suspect the intended audience was fans of Transformers and other blockbuster action movies far more so than, say, Gundam and Ultraman, and I'm sure a significant portion of its (American) viewers had never even heard the word "kaiju" before that movie. 

marble

I know that many Americans learn Spanish at school and that the northern European countries put the English to shame with their spoken English which is often more correct than many native English speakers but, as an Englishman, I use the excuse that I have travelled to many countries and have almost always found a local English speaker to help translate for me. I failed abysmally when attempting to learn French at school which is a shame because I enjoy France and would have gone there more often if I could speak reasonable French. I suspect that the French are almost as bad as the English in failing to learn another language.

This is quite typical of the English command of the French language ...

MKDAWUSS

Reminds me of this one time when I bought a figure that had East Asian characters (Chinese? Japanese?) as part of an overlay and I asked the seller what those characters meant (1 for reference, and 2 so I could figure things out for said figure's nationality purposes), and more or less got back an "I don't know" (I don't know what these things mean! It just looks cool! And in DAZ World, the East Asian nations have happily unified nationally and become a cultural melting pot!)

DaremoK3

@Gordig :

I should have stated 'If I was working on a Japanese influenced Kaiju story' instead of 'If I was working on Japanese Kaiju story'.

My bad...  It was clearly inspired by Japanese giant robots/Kaiju stories by an American writer growing up in the 80's/90's.

I never said it was Japanese, nor Manga/Anime, and no matter how correct a writer/author/artist/etc. outside of Japan is with their material, it will never be Manga/Anime if it is created outside of Japan by non-Japanese.

Like the Pacific Rim writer, Travis Beacham, and countless others before him, says, "Write what you love (and/or 'know')".

After living over half a century on this planet, and dedicating the last four decades studying Japanese Samurai/Ninja, Chinese Kung Fu, Korean and Filipino warrior arts, wars, and history, as well as the last 46 years practicing Martial Arts of those nations, I believe I am writing what I love/know for my graphic novels.

And, yes, I agree.  I see evidence of other non-asain influence in some Japanese Manga/Anime, but I was referring, as an American, to writing a story based on Japanese influence, I might not think of naming conventions for principal objects based on non-Japanese/Asain.

I wouldn't name one of my character's Katana 'Blitzkrieg', for example, as opposed to something more akin to 'Kamikaze'.

Though, if I had a character of German descent who wielded one, I just might (at least Blitzschwert or Blitzklinge [internet translation -- am I even close?])...

DaremoK3

@Jason Galterio :

I concur.  For an informed guess with context, it should be no problem for her.

The Big Bang Theory  --  That was my first thought when you wrote it...

Question for your wife;  I was just watching the episode yesterday that ended with Sheldon conversing with Chen ( James Hong) at the Chinese restaurant, and he was saying crazy sentences that were annoying Chen.

As someone with an Eidetic memory (real-world debatable), Sheldon, having read before the sentences he strings together, or individual words to make up the sentences, I would suppose he is saying the correct words (as read).

But, I believe (and this is where your wife comes in), when spoken, he is using the wrong tone which changes the intended word to something completely different, and ending up speaking utter nonsense.

Please, ask her if this is possibly a correct assessment, or am I way off base?

Gordig

DaremoK3 said:

I never said it was Japanese, nor Manga/Anime, and no matter how correct a writer/author/artist/etc. outside of Japan is with their material, it will never be Manga/Anime if it is created outside of Japan by non-Japanese.

I know you didn't say it was anime or manga, because I wasn't responding to you when I made that point. Also, Pacific Rim is a live-action movie, which immediately disqualifies it from being either anime or manga, whatever other qualifications one considers important.

Jason Galterio

DaremoK3 said:

@Jason Galterio :

I concur.  For an informed guess with context, it should be no problem for her.

The Big Bang Theory  --  That was my first thought when you wrote it...

Question for your wife;  I was just watching the episode yesterday that ended with Sheldon conversing with Chen ( James Hong) at the Chinese restaurant, and he was saying crazy sentences that were annoying Chen.

As someone with an Eidetic memory (real-world debatable), Sheldon, having read before the sentences he strings together, or individual words to make up the sentences, I would suppose he is saying the correct words (as read).

But, I believe (and this is where your wife comes in), when spoken, he is using the wrong tone which changes the intended word to something completely different, and ending up speaking utter nonsense.

Please, ask her if this is possibly a correct assessment, or am I way off base?

Sure, I can do that. She hates when I quote things though ("How do you remember this nonsense and not...")

I will need to look for a clip of the scene and ask her casually. :)

namffuak

Interesting thread. Back in the 70s I administered a Honeywell mainframe with a DataNet 8 communications processor. The DN8 was designed and manufactured by CII Honeywell Bull in France and some of the more abstruse documentation was quite hard to interpret. Until a British tech got a copy of the original documentation and sent out a short memo "Gentlemen - in re DN8 HDLC documentation, read 'fields' for all instances of 'pastures'".

maikdecker

Okay, it's not about Harpsburg, but it fits the theme of the thread: A (southern) European (/Mediterranean, probably Italian) Street view with a sign saying "Happy Hour (which is okay, because most of Europe adopted that) 11:00 am to.." whatever.. can't make it for sure due to low visibilty on the promo. But it's obvious that the am/pm timescale is used. Which isn't really "a thing" in most of Europe. To discover more less European tidbits in that product, I would have to buy it... which I'm only enclined to do, if it ends up in a DAZ+FAD sale due to the need to edit it into something European