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There seem to be a shipload of people doing portrait renders for fun or professional, who might need all those options for all the close-up renders.
Doing a scene with several figures being fully visible in an action scene... nah, those new options are not really needed.
Nope, but then I didn't get on the train with any of the other figures either.
It allows adjustment of the lips (or any other area) separately from the rest of the skin. For glossy you'd probably want to play with TopCoat
This discussion happens every time there's a new generation of figures. Eventually we all move forward with the technology.
I'm on the train.I've cloned a couple of G8 characters to G9. I can't do anything else with them until the body and head morphs are released. Although, I'll probably be getting off at the next stop, if they don't show up anytime soon. :/
I am happy with the autofit from previous generations. Unhappy with man poses that are not masculine. Very happy with the unique figure, it will save work when converting content and also disk space. I’m not interested in 8K textures because my job is toon style NPR. Still not seeing the advances in poses and expressions, but the unique figure has convinced me to convert everything to G9 instead of G8. Also separate eyes and mouth is a good reason.
Right now I don't see much reason. Sure you can convert all your stuff to G9 and make it work...but at that point why not just use a G8 figure instead?
The main things I like are the unified mesh and separate eyes and mouth. But these are not exactly revolutionary advances. G9 will need a lot more content to get me truly on board.
The thing I find most baffling is that Daz had a whole month to get this right, and still managed to botch the launch so badly. The slow trickle of content also makes it feel like this was just not planned very well. Where are the freakin morph packs? Converters? After all this hype, it doesn't feel like Daz put their best effort into this. Who is commanding this ship???
You have a chicken and egg situation here. You need G9 to storm out of the gate with a ton of content, otherwise you run a real risk of users being slow to adopt. If users are slow to adopt...that translates to slow sales for the PAs who jump on board. So this can become a serious problem. We need the content that lets users make the most of G9, and we needed that content yesterday.
The worst problem that Genesis 9 has is that Genesis 8 exists. You have an uphill battle to convince users to jump on board. I think Daz needs to be just as aggressive as they were in the early G8 days. Remember those buy this new G8 core and get 2 or 3 others free? The whole world is sliding into recession right now, Daz needs to sweeten the pot by offering a lot more free content with Genesis 9 products.
Also if you suck at lighting or posing people in a believable way, Genesis 9 is not going to make you any better. Most of the changes are pretty minor in scope. Victoria 9 has some nice textures...but that can be done with any model and there are plenty of G8 models that have amazing textures and quality.
The UV layout is weird to me. Did they really have to pull the ears out of the head like that? The body UV has these real skinny strips sticking out at the ends. The male gen mat IMO is pretty wack. You have a triangle with empty space in the middle, with the other parts split in half flanking it. There is no flow on the male gen UV, and you pretty much need a 3D painting app just to make a simple edit on this texture. I don't get how this is better.
I might get back since a single, universal figure appeals to me after DAZ abandoned the idea with Generation 5. I still think it was a stupid idea to get back to separate Male and Female figures.
But for now, will wait and see. Probably definitively decide by the holidays.
"Outrider42. ...makes me wonder if the release of V9 was why the PC...err, I mean...Daz+ Anniversary Sale (which is my favourite of all Daz Sale events) was cut short by almost 2 weeks. Couldn't this have waited until November when no other major sale events are happening? Usually new character rollouts were at the beginning of the Holiday Sale later in November.
What I regret is I didn't believe myself not to buy a single 8.1 character. It was my guts feeling for many years that 9 would be something really big. And it is.
Now I look back and know that we've never got the real deal like this. I will pay for it.
Uhm... no? The one and only thing that WE ALL (as in: the whole humankind) will do in the end is dying. Sooner or later each and everyone of us will end up a bit dead-ish. For each and every other "we all will" statement there will be more or fewer exeptions to these "rules". There's still people who use Vicky/Michael 4 instead of the later Generations are happy with them. There's also people - like me for example - who still have no need to use a smartphone and therefor don't own one. There's thousand of people on this planet who would be old enough to drive around in a car but don't do so - because they are living in a jungle mayhaps or because they just don't want to.
So... no, we not ALL move forward with this technology. Especially when it worth to discuss what direction is "forward"
I know (DeviantArt) quiete a few artists who never made the jump from G3 to G8, so not everyone switches.
After a bit of thinking about it, until now I pass G9 and stay with G8.
I have too many time and money (espacially money) invested in morphs and stuff for the 8th generation. Since I almost never do closeups, the "ultra closeup details" are not an argument for me.
The only argument would be more detailed face morphs, in the moment there are certain borders when it comes to custom morphs from Blender or zBrush due to the (relatively) low poly count and I still have to do many things with normal and bump maps that I would rather hard-code. But this remains the only argument for me pro 9.
Perhaphs things change, when there is a converting option G8F/G8M to G9F/G9M.
I would have preferred that genesis nine would have two separate models a female model and a male model not a single model that is a carbon copy of genesis 1 that has sliders that saying feminine and masculine. I'm sorry to say this but this is a bad product. Also Victoria 9 looks like a carbon copy of Victoria 8 and 8.1 just to let it out.
Very much agreed. Also, 'forward' is not inherently synonymous with 'better', is it?
I agree. To my eye the characters I made using G1 just didn't look right, so I'll be staying with G8. I don't render because I use DS to set up scenes that I use as drawing references. So I make do with the base Genesis models with the base body and head morphs. ( The last Victoria and Michael I bought was V5 and M5 and I never used them) So, the extra detailed textures and HD functions mean nothing to me. What does matter are proportions and posing. There was just something about the unified mesh that made the shoulder and chest areas of the male and female reference characters I created look odd,.
@AllenArt
is this more of your liking for the male physique?
Not until there are products released that allow me to copy morphs skins and poses from G3 and G8/8.1 I have WAY too much invested and am not going to spend thousands more. I love the new G9, just not enough to spend like someone who has money to burn.
Am I allowed to comment? I'm going to comment anyway!
I feel the torso and chest area is a bit too uniformly V-shaped (as in there's not much definition in waist area) and shoulders a bit too wide compared to the size of his arms but he kinda looks like this guy proportions wise. I'd either pump up the arms (and legs) a lot to get this or give the waist a bit definition like this. Regardless, I feel he could maybe use a bit more definition in obliques/waist/hip area. Seeing that you are aiming for a muscular male by the looks of it.
Still looks much better than anything I could do, so who am I to talk? You do you!
Thanks for the comment. This is just 15 minute work in Zbrush. To see what i could do in a couple of minutes. The problem for me is the joints. I try to work with the existing joints. I will play with the model again somewhat later . I think i wil figure it out but takes a little bit more time.
For sure it looks good for 15 minutes of work. I couldn't do that in any number of minutes so consider at least me impressed. I'm also curious to see what solutions folks find for the rubbery bends and joints in general.
Yes me too, i can morph the mesh into anything I want, the problem are the rubbery joints. I think we just have to have a bit of patience to see what people come up with.
Same here. I'm into story telling so I have a set cast of characters-- mostly g8. On the fence for now. Hopefully maybe Riversoft or Zevo will get around to making a converter if possible. ; )
Call me dense, but what still don't get what the big deal is about g9. It doesn't seem any more 'expressive' than 8.1 and I didn't notice additional options for skin details in the four mats provided as an intro.
Time will tell. : )
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edited for style & clarity
For me, V9 will be on the back burner until shaping morphs show up, as well as better gens from other stores. This time around I'm going to focus more on creating my own characters rather than purchasing a bunch from the various stores. I have waaay too many G8 products that I never use. I also have many G8 characters that are perfectly useful so I won't be dropping those any time soon.
Like I made for previous generation, I looked for a similar texture and edited it in GIMP :) So I'll reuse Genesis 9 textures and modify them. What I like to do is using a light texture as a base for all my characters and apply a color to itso I'm saving a lot of VRAM ;p
I think they released now to get everything running smooth by the week of American Thanksgiving, when shoppers start really spending money.
My G9 problems: getting prior gen clothing to autofit right on male base shape (I've been trying the loose fit, I guess I should try the tight fit as loose fit is not flying), changing back & forth between "base" male & female shapes (eyes not in the correct place, ugh!, I am not sure how I did that but with these realistic G9 eyeball material sets, it's gross!), and the head, body, and expression morph products missing on generation release.
I haven't bought into any of Gen9 yet, I've just tried out the base G9 figure and the available morphs (proportional sizing and assymetry morphs, which you can do a surprising amount of change with) and autofitted clothing. I got far too much Gen8 stuff early on and don't want to do all that again, so I'm trying to be more selective this time round.
Having said that, I am likely to buy the head and body morphs when they are available and certainly expect to pick up a couple of characters in December, when the first few are likely to figure in store sales.
I'm finding it tricky to masculinise the base figure effectively - here's a rather girlish example. Also my first portrait of G9F with some asymmetry morphs applied. On the plus side, autofit of some Gen8 clothing I have tried has so far been quite succesful.
When I have more time I plan to try doing some custom morphs - one of my most-used G8M characters is still one I self-modelled in Blender early on.
I am weak I will admit it. I bought the bundle on the first day available. Yeah, not pleased with the roll out.
My opportunities to play have been spotty, but today I sat down and tried to use one of the G9 poses released that looks like a man on the G9 Masculine slider form. It was a kneeling pose from the Viking Sword and Sword Poses for G8 and G9. But when I tried to move the upper right arm, I couldn't seem to find the bone. Power Pose does work to a very limited degree, but that bone didn't appear, and the best I could do was move the upper body around. So not an expert in this, not even novice class. After six years you would think I would be able to do it. No bone showed up in the scene pane. Went to another pose from the sucky G9 set that is all ultra-fem stuff.
If the rest of the G9 offerings are like this, so not buying into it. I do have money reserved for the morph packs and for RiverSoftArt's G9 Bone Minion Pack. Already bought Growing Up for G9.
After seeing the damage to my upload times during G8, I will be extra choosy about any characters/morph packs I buy. And since the death of the old Core characters, with others based on them during G8.1, I don't think I will let myself get suckered into G9 Core Bundles this go round. I have a few favored character PAs I will watch for.
I have also used G8/G8.1 clothing on the characters, with only one problem, pair of flat sandals the shoe converter couldn't deal with. No big. So wardrobe not an issue, just buy shoes until SY & RiverSoftArt do their magic. Hair has been iffy.
I have tested G9/V9 on both Win10 1080/108Ti and now my MacBookPro M1 (render of V9 still converging 90%, 3:34:32, 6815 iterations) and may stop it. No issues with it, either during simulations or renders, other than my own mess-ups.
My biggest mark on this generation is against the poor quality control and management that failed to make sure all the elements were in place and WORKING before announcing the release and video. As one who was in a manufacturing company for 20 years, I am fully aware of the issues that can come up, but we also had QC breathing down our necks at every point. Of course our products were implanted into bodies and inspected by the FDA and had to pass their inspections before they touched a human.
But still, Tafi, you need to beef-up your QC department.
After playing around with V9 and G9 for a while, I'm not convinced I'll stay on the train much longer. The noodle bends on many of the joints are such a huge step backwards that I'm actually contemplating returning V9. I'll probably keep her, but I'm rather annoyed that I had to purchase a separate makeup set to make her usable (for me), but she also needs to have some serious joint bend fixes to be usable in most poses and positions. I was really hoping G9 would feel like a step forward, not a step backward (except for expressions).
OK, enough ranting.