REAL Hairy for G9

MikeyFTL

Great news on filesizes. I did a search of My Library for the two assets I've created so far and apparently DAZ3D is using a much better compression when converting OBJs into DSFs. It's been awhile since I created a product for DAZ Studio and I don't remember the filesizes being so small back then. I thought the chest hair and morphs were going to be over 100MB, but DAZ Studio crushed them down to 20MB. So it looks like the end product will be nowhere near as big as I thought. Looks like clumping and wetness morphs are a go!

nonesuch00

Except for closeups at certain camera and lighting angles fibre body hair vs body hair cards are like an MP3 file at 320bit vs 128bit. Most renders are from a distance and resolution as to make the fibre body hairs visually effective for most casual viewing only for closeups. However, the G2 body hair product fits well enough to G9 to make repeating that exercise unneeded but maybe that product can be refitted to G9 as part of this new G9 fibre hair product. 

MikeyFTL

nonesuch00 said:

Except for closeups at certain camera and lighting angles fibre body hair vs body hair cards are like an MP3 file at 320bit vs 128bit. Most renders are from a distance and resolution as to make the fibre body hairs visually effective for most casual viewing only for closeups. However, the G2 body hair product fits well enough to G9 to make repeating that exercise unneeded but maybe that product can be refitted to G9 as part of this new G9 fibre hair product. 

I've tested the old REAL Hairy on every new Genesis that comes out, and while it does "sorta" work, I think it looks dated compared to what people are doing with body hair today. Plus, porting it over to G9 would be incredibly time comsuming since the polygons won't be the same. That means the hairs and how they're styled (including their morphs) won't port over either. The whole thing would have to be done from scratch, which is why I never bothered with G8. Best to leave it behind and look to the future.  

Psyckosama

MikeyFTL said:

Instead of using flat polygons, I switched to more fibermesh-like geometry. This allows for better shadow and light capturing and better closeups. Depending on the hairs color and thickness, it's capable of creating some freaky realism.

It also helps if it's in the correct position. 

Please make a polygon like one too. It's better for distance shots and the like.

MikeyFTL

Psyckosama said:

MikeyFTL said:

Instead of using flat polygons, I switched to more fibermesh-like geometry. This allows for better shadow and light capturing and better closeups. Depending on the hairs color and thickness, it's capable of creating some freaky realism.

It also helps if it's in the correct position. 

Please make a polygon like one too. It's better for distance shots and the like.

Don't think too many people would prefer the old polys. Don't worry....if filesizes and load times are a major factor to you, they're going to be reduced drastically when I lower the smoothing of each hair bend. If DAZ Studio can handle the hi-res ones, the low-res should be even easier for it to deal with.

Psyckosama

MikeyFTL said:

Psyckosama said:

MikeyFTL said:

Instead of using flat polygons, I switched to more fibermesh-like geometry. This allows for better shadow and light capturing and better closeups. Depending on the hairs color and thickness, it's capable of creating some freaky realism.

It also helps if it's in the correct position. 

Please make a polygon like one too. It's better for distance shots and the like.

Don't think too many people would prefer the old polys. Don't worry....if filesizes and load times are a major factor to you, they're going to be reduced drastically when I lower the smoothing of each hair bend. If DAZ Studio can handle the hi-res ones, the low-res should be even easier for it to deal with.

Size isn't the issue.

It's that I find Fibermech rarely gives better results and always at a penalty to things like hair color compatability and viewport speed.

Richard Haseltine

MikeyFTL said:

Instead of using flat polygons, I switched to more fibermesh-like geometry. This allows for better shadow and light capturing and better closeups. Depending on the hairs color and thickness, it's capable of creating some freaky realism.

It also helps if it's in the correct position. 

Iray does now offer curves http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dazstudio/4/change_log_4_21_0_5#4_20_1_20

Roman_K2

AlmightyQUEST said:

I would defintiely love to see a new Real Hairy version for G9!

I have never heard of "Real Hairy".

MikeyFTL

Psyckosama said:

MikeyFTL said:

Psyckosama said:

MikeyFTL said:

Instead of using flat polygons, I switched to more fibermesh-like geometry. This allows for better shadow and light capturing and better closeups. Depending on the hairs color and thickness, it's capable of creating some freaky realism.

It also helps if it's in the correct position. 

Please make a polygon like one too. It's better for distance shots and the like.

Don't think too many people would prefer the old polys. Don't worry....if filesizes and load times are a major factor to you, they're going to be reduced drastically when I lower the smoothing of each hair bend. If DAZ Studio can handle the hi-res ones, the low-res should be even easier for it to deal with.

Size isn't the issue.

It's that I find Fibermech rarely gives better results and always at a penalty to things like hair color compatability and viewport speed.

Well it's not actually fibermesh tech. I use a hair generation setup within Cinema 4D. It can generate hairs in a few different forms (flats, circles, triangles, squares). Circles triangles and squares are what make up the hair by following an invisible hair spline. Then the geometry is exported as an OBJ. I use the method that makes the smallest file sizes, aside from flats.

MikeyFTL

Roman_K2 said:

AlmightyQUEST said:

I would defintiely love to see a new Real Hairy version for G9!

I have never heard of "Real Hairy".

It was discontinued years ago. 

Richard Haseltine

MikeyFTL said:

Psyckosama said:

MikeyFTL said:

Psyckosama said:

MikeyFTL said:

Instead of using flat polygons, I switched to more fibermesh-like geometry. This allows for better shadow and light capturing and better closeups. Depending on the hairs color and thickness, it's capable of creating some freaky realism.

It also helps if it's in the correct position. 

Please make a polygon like one too. It's better for distance shots and the like.

Don't think too many people would prefer the old polys. Don't worry....if filesizes and load times are a major factor to you, they're going to be reduced drastically when I lower the smoothing of each hair bend. If DAZ Studio can handle the hi-res ones, the low-res should be even easier for it to deal with.

Size isn't the issue.

It's that I find Fibermech rarely gives better results and always at a penalty to things like hair color compatability and viewport speed.

Well it's not actually fibermesh tech. I use a hair generation setup within Cinema 4D. It can generate hairs in a few different forms (flats, circles, triangles, squares). Circles triangles and squares are what make up the hair by following an invisible hair spline. Then the geometry is exported as an OBJ. I use the method that makes the smallest file sizes, aside from flats.

Daz Studio can actually do something similar http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dazstudio/4/referenceguide/scripting/api_reference/object_index/linetessellationmodifier_dz

Gordig

I would certainly prefer something like this be dForce hair instead of actual mesh, but Mikey would need to become a PA again to have access to that.

lilweep

Richard Haseltine said:

MikeyFTL said:

Instead of using flat polygons, I switched to more fibermesh-like geometry. This allows for better shadow and light capturing and better closeups. Depending on the hairs color and thickness, it's capable of creating some freaky realism.

It also helps if it's in the correct position. 

Iray does now offer curves http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dazstudio/4/change_log_4_21_0_5#4_20_1_20

y'all keep saying this, but i can never get a strand to render with 'render line tesselation sides = 0'

Have Daz Studio 4.21 pro, latest nvidia studio driver, render mode set to Photoreal...

setting tesselation to 0 just results in nothing showing in render.

 

Knittingmommy

Looking forward to a Real Hairy update. I have both Real Hairy for Genesis and Real Hairy (G2). I still use them whenever I need body hair.

beregar

MikeyFTL said:

Great news on filesizes. I did a search of My Library for the two assets I've created so far and apparently DAZ3D is using a much better compression when converting OBJs into DSFs. It's been awhile since I created a product for DAZ Studio and I don't remember the filesizes being so small back then. I thought the chest hair and morphs were going to be over 100MB, but DAZ Studio crushed them down to 20MB. So it looks like the end product will be nowhere near as big as I thought. Looks like clumping and wetness morphs are a go!

This is awesome new.

I also have to second the filler pieces as I often end up using different kind of fillers to mix hair colors (like the S&P you mentioned) and to help with clipping issues for example when the figure is wearing a V-neck or open coat. You can also get some extra variety within same product with them. Sometimes geometry editor helps but not always so it's nice to have the options out of the box.

MikeyFTL

beregar said:

MikeyFTL said:

Great news on filesizes. I did a search of My Library for the two assets I've created so far and apparently DAZ3D is using a much better compression when converting OBJs into DSFs. It's been awhile since I created a product for DAZ Studio and I don't remember the filesizes being so small back then. I thought the chest hair and morphs were going to be over 100MB, but DAZ Studio crushed them down to 20MB. So it looks like the end product will be nowhere near as big as I thought. Looks like clumping and wetness morphs are a go!

This is awesome new.

I also have to second the filler pieces as I often end up using different kind of fillers to mix hair colors (like the S&P you mentioned) and to help with clipping issues for example when the figure is wearing a V-neck or open coat. You can also get some extra variety within same product with them. Sometimes geometry editor helps but not always so it's nice to have the options out of the box.

Since the chest is really the only area that S&P usually occurs, I don't see why I can't include a filler for that. Gray chest hair doesn't really occur on the full area. Mostly in the center and below the neck and shoulders. That's why I created the V-shape for the original REAL Hairy. I will probably make a similar shape filler plus a full area filler as well.

beregar

MikeyFTL said:

beregar said:

MikeyFTL said:

Great news on filesizes. I did a search of My Library for the two assets I've created so far and apparently DAZ3D is using a much better compression when converting OBJs into DSFs. It's been awhile since I created a product for DAZ Studio and I don't remember the filesizes being so small back then. I thought the chest hair and morphs were going to be over 100MB, but DAZ Studio crushed them down to 20MB. So it looks like the end product will be nowhere near as big as I thought. Looks like clumping and wetness morphs are a go!

This is awesome new.

I also have to second the filler pieces as I often end up using different kind of fillers to mix hair colors (like the S&P you mentioned) and to help with clipping issues for example when the figure is wearing a V-neck or open coat. You can also get some extra variety within same product with them. Sometimes geometry editor helps but not always so it's nice to have the options out of the box.

Since the chest is really the only area that S&P usually occurs, I don't see why I can't include a filler for that. Gray chest hair doesn't really occur on the full area. Mostly in the center and below the neck and shoulders. That's why I created the V-shape for the original REAL Hairy. I will probably make a similar shape filler plus a full area filler as well.

I also do fantasy mixing and matching so I'd like to see a separate diamond shaped patch as well similar to what Varric has (well, more like A or cross shaped I guess) but V-shape and full area fillers are definitely "good enough" for me. Looking forward to see this in action.

MikeyFTL

Sorry guys, but I don't think I'll be continuing with REAL Hairy for G9.

The folks at DAZ3D weren't pleased with my recent hiatus and will not reinstate me as a PA unless I guarantee them that I'll be creating multiple products (like immediately), and provide images of proof of their existence before reinstating me. These kinds of demands are not how I wanted to start up again because it forces me to concentrate on other projects that I really don't have the time and energy to start now. 

Maybe down the road I will release this product on an alternative site with less restrictions. 

Tobias

That's disappointing but understandable.

nonesuch00

Sorry, well that's a bit of a disappointment but I guess the onboarding & QA cycle is so involved that they need consistent contributors. Good luck!

UncannyValet

I started making this one for my own purposes (Within a couple of hours).
 

It's obviously not even close to finished. But when i finish (after i complete all the other things i am working on) then i will try to sell on Daz or other marketplace, or if that fails make it as a freebie.

Gordig

Stupido3D said:

I started making this one for my own purposes (Within a couple of hours).
 

It's obviously not even close to finished. But when i finish (after i complete all the other things i am working on) then i will try to sell on Daz or other marketplace, or if that fails make it as a freebie.

Somewhat off topic, but your render makes me wonder if it would be at all possible to use a normal map to dictate the direction of hair growth.

MikeyFTL

Stupido3D said:

I started making this one for my own purposes (Within a couple of hours).
 

It's obviously not even close to finished. But when i finish (after i complete all the other things i am working on) then i will try to sell on Daz or other marketplace, or if that fails make it as a freebie.

I like it, especially as a wet morph. Give it frizz, thicken and length morphs and you got a product.

beregar

MikeyFTL said:

Sorry guys, but I don't think I'll be continuing with REAL Hairy for G9.

The folks at DAZ3D weren't pleased with my recent hiatus and will not reinstate me as a PA unless I guarantee them that I'll be creating multiple products (like immediately), and provide images of proof of their existence before reinstating me. These kinds of demands are not how I wanted to start up again because it forces me to concentrate on other projects that I really don't have the time and energy to start now. 

Maybe down the road I will release this product on an alternative site with less restrictions. 

Ah, that is too bad but understandable. It's news like these that dampen my enthusiasm to G9... but to be honest it isn't that high to begin with. I still own only the character essentials and the morph pack, and Nathy's morphs. I'll see what comes out with M9.