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Comments
xyer0,
Wow! Sorry to hear that you have to reinstall your Daz asset library. I've done that a few times and know the hassle it can be. The upshot is that it does force one to ration disk space, asking prudently which asset is a must have and which can be left out for some other day.
I'm impressed with the roster of non-Caucasians you lined up here. Daz should reward your kindness with a nice coupon. Even I didn't realize there were so many. And like the OP, I was operating under the belief that there's a dearth of Asian figures in the asset store.
More to the larger theme this discussion has taken on, I believe it's safe to say that ethnicity is one of those things that falls under "whatever the eye of the beholder sees." A Filipino friend who's lived in the US southeast for decades often relates how locals never fail to assume he's African-American. Then there's another who's puzzled how anyone of brown skin and dark, silken hair living in the New England is quickly mistaken for a Central or South American.
No harm to it ... except that, speaking candidly, ethnic perceptions can come with loads of negative baggage, i.e. bigotry.
To set the record straight, that misunderstanding happens in other countries as well. Faced with ethnic strangers, people will likely start with their stock knowledge or their gut feel. I remember an elderly person who lived in Asia all her life and knew of Westerners -- caucasians to be exact -- only from what she's seen in film and TV. Upon arriving in the America, she marveled at the great variety of people here. ("Huh? And I all thought they looked like Hollywood movie stars!") And that's just caucasians she was remarking on.
It goes w/o saying, there's always room to grow one's perception, and few things are more edifying than spending time in a foreign land.
PS. nemesis10, I always appreciate the knowledge and the experience you share. Regarding the tragedies of history written in one's DNA, I'm reminded (once more) of Filipinos. Taking a humorous view of Western colonialization, a fair number of them boast of having one or two Catholic priests in their family tree!
That would partly account for their "distinct look" that NotAnArtist pointed out.
Cheers!
Thanks for your kindness. I got a new 8Tb SSD; so I decided that rather than simply copying the 6Tb HD over (and its DS duplicate file errors), I would instead viciously weed out the G8F bloat as well as V4/M4, G1, 2, & 3 that aren't up to my standards.
There are tons more non-Caucasians than the ones I listed, those are only the ones I owned that look Southeast Asian, speaking as a Singapore permanent resident.
I believe you and you yourself do a variety. Also I think some assuming that most of you creators are white males is wrong, many of you are from all over te world and there are a lot of female and other creators as wll as ethenticities. sad thing is is when any of you do diversify and try and release stuff asked for or unique/different you guys sometimes get ripped on more than if you didn't release something different damned if you damned if you don't
I am going to beg to disagree. From my point of view, I often see an arguement that if a creator makes a a product that is a public facing representation of people who have easily researchable and defining characteristics and does it in a slapdash way, they are going to be criticized no matter what. There are numerous examples of works that contradict this; glance at David Simon who created the HBO series the Wire or Michael Dante DiMartino and Bryan Konietzko who are the creators of the animated series, The Last Avatar as opposed to someone like Kathryn Stockett who create the dreadful "The Help". Both the Wire and the Last Avatar have been embraced by the respective communities they are suposed to embody. I have actually communicated with many Daz3d creators who have made ethnically diverse characters and what sticks out is a commitment to research, an interest in the culture, and a willingness to learn. This is one of the reasons that you end up with high heel armor in the store. The creator doesn't really care about armor and is just using it a prop to make something that will sell well and look pretty to someone who doesn't know what armor looks like or what the function of each piece is... cosplay writ large! I think a) every creator should be prepared to be criticized as it is one of those things that go with the job as long as the criticism is accurate and can have them lead to better products, b) every creator should be observant which is pretty much the first lesson in any art class, and c) be respectful of their customers.
It would be nice if we could just buy skin packs instead of buying complete actors/characters. I would love to see African skin packs with different skin tones. So many of the dark skin color characters available on the store all have the same dark tone which is generally too dark if you use them in the same scene with light skin characters, it's hard to setup good lighting then that looks good with both skin types. Often I have to change the transulency setting of the dark skin to make it a bit lighter or I have to make the light skin a bit darker to make both look good in the same scene and lighting setup.
I would like separate skins and morphs too because otherwise one's texture folder gets bloated with what is often the same skin resources reused with slight alterations
No amount of research and willingness to learn is going to get you the perfect tone of your skin. That is solely dependent on the resources that are available to the PA. There are very few resources available for a wide range of versatility.
I can see that. Skin is a complicated surface, anyway. At the very least, it's translucent, reflective, pigmented, surprisingly rough and textural with a cell structure that varies in appearance from place to place on the body. The closer you get, the more such detail shows. Then you conflate that with our inner concept of skin as seen in photos and magazines - Frequently, "photorealism" in media means the skin has been artificially smoothed and adjusted using post-processing and retouching techniques. There are portrait programs specifically designed to turn any lumpy human into a magazine cover model. Also, everybody has their own idea of what makes skin look good, and that may or may not be true to life. Just one example, I've seen 3D skins with low percentage of ambience applied to give the skin a particular and consistent tone. It looks great in some promos, but can cause problems in actual use. And there is no way to know this before buying the figure. A skin treatment that works for me in my work may not suit someone else.
I don't think it's right to say that fantasy armour is bad, or badly researched, realistic or even historical armour. Most, probbaly nigh all, of it is made to be the way it is quite deliberately and with awareness. By all means lobby for more historical or plausible-fantasy outfits, and complain about things like mis-oriented chain mail, but don't assume that things that don't meet your standards represent a failure as far as the maker's goals were concerned.
...that used to be the case back in the old Gen4 days. There were also several sets of skin only material resources released for G3 (both male and female). This is why I adopted Zev0's Skin Builder plugins as they eliminated the need for purchasing a lot of characters just for the skin maps. There are special cases that require purchasing a character (like vitiligo skin which was released with a G3F character) which are difficult to impossible to create with the utility, but for most general purposes Skin Builder works just fine.
...it's not just the high or spike heels. often times when the same basic outfit is made for both male and female characters the female version tends to be low cut to show cleavage as well as more skin in general. One example of this is the Tactical Assault Outfit for G8F and M. The male version has a full vest that covers the chest which the female one has a deep V neck (with a pointless zipper that doesn't close) to purposely show off cleavage. The Same was the case for the Martial Arts suit for G3F and G3M. The female version was open further down to again show off cleavage with no "close morph" while the male version is closed over the upper chest. Fortunately with the Tactical Outfit one can fit (with a little adjustment) the male vest to a female character.
As to medieval armour, only the men wore it as women were usually not trained as knights. or soldiers When someone like Joan of Arc did. ithe breastplate still has a smooth flat front.
Also some of the so called "authentic" old west clothing for females would get them in trouble if they walked around town wearing it in the 1870 - 80s.
I know, it's the old "sexy sells" thing, which frustrates those of us who want a little more practicality and "realism" (and not all of us are into or good at modelling). At the very least could we have button/zip up or close and lengthen morphs (the latter to deal with all the "bare belly" clothing and even modern/SciFi armour).
I just get hung up with the thinking that goes along the lines of...
Well, (insert group) should do (this thing).
Or, as in this case: PAs should make more ethnically diverse characters.
WTF? Daz isn't a govenment agency compelled to spit out equity of outcomes.
Daz is a business. They provide a 3d software that allows others to create things to sell and they have a profit sharing agreement between them.
Daz wants you to buy its stuff. PAs want you to buy their stuff. They have been making/selling for some time now, and what we are seeing in their store are the results of it. You can look in the catalog and get an idea of what sells. So folks pony up money for the things they want. The more money that is put down/spent, the more types of that item arrive in the store.
I assure you, if Napoleonic Hussar Uniforms sold like hot cakes, despite the time it took a PA to make them, they'd be in the Daz Store.
What would be fascinating information, is to see what is the ethnic breakdown of the Daz Software users as a whole. Who they are and what they like/buy.
Regardless, if you don't see something you want in the store (or in any other store) you have the tools at hand to make it yourself (Daz3d & Blender are FREE software).
If You can't, try making the suggestion in the "Product Sugguestions" Forum.
If neither of those work, then pony up the money and go to FivR and commission somebody to make it for you.
But asking a PA to make something on speculation that may or may not appeal to the masses enough for them to recoup the time spent making it really isn't fair (especially if you yourself are not willing to do it).
I wanted to get this in, because I can smell the thread cooking and I am thinking its about done.... the mods can take it out of the oven.
I think the thread is fine. I can see the different viewpoints. PAs can do what they like and I'll buy the stuff that appeals to me. The rest will take care of itself.
Learning how to draw or build things for yourself is a veritable way of solving this problem with not being capable of finding what you need in the store. Whilst at the beginning it can be slow, excruciating even, it gives a lot of satisfaction and you will get faster the longer you will practice.
Oh, extra benefit will be your wallet loving you for this.
I also like Zevo's Skin Builder. You can get some great skins with those plugins.
You can also look at it like this - because there are so few of them, the ones that are there can become rather prominent and stand out with the right amount of attention.
Let's assume plenty of people know what to do - It's fairly common here, I think. It's generally quicker to modify something that's already available, and sometimes (sometimes!) things even work as desired right out of the box. It's all good.
Not sure what you're saying there.
And that is the annoying thing, I have yet to find a female Police Officer / Firefighter outfit that doesn't make them look like they have just at some costume party. Although in saying that of all the ones in the store, there is only one Police Officer outfit that fits the bill, and to show its age it was made for Genesis 1.
Actually...
https://www.daz3d.com/night-cop-for-genesis-2-female-s
https://www.daz3d.com/h-c-sexy-police-costume-for-genesis-3-female-s
https://www.daz3d.com/fg-police-woman-outfit-for-genesis-8-females
That last one might be useable if you could button it up a little.
How about dForce Police Officer Outfit for Genesis 8 Female(s) | Daz 3D?
...now that looks reasonable.. Added to wishlist.
Ahh forgot about that one, and is the most decent and realistic of them all.
Yeah the first two are no good as they are more of what someone would wear to a costume party. The third is better but there is no option to do up the shirt buttons, and from looking at images of real Police officers what I have noticed is that they will only have the first button undone, unless they are wearing a tie.
As a lumpy human, I approve of this.
+1 & Thanks for the chuckle!
It doesn't seem the OP was too interested after all, but the rest of you take note, Zev0's Skin Builder for Genesis 9 will be working on the unified G9 Male - Female mesh so it will be easy to make your own unique characters. I doubt my commitment to learning how to make skin materials well enough myself to make good use of it but some PAs armed with Skin Builder for G9 and their own custom skin material templates should have a much easier time of many a varied characters.
The presupposition of the OP's question---which was taken as fact by many of the other posters---is that there is a dearth of Southeast Asian characters in this store. That is patently false, and I wanted to prove it as such. The implications of this false presupposition are used to promote more errors. If you look at Renderosity and RenderHub (warloc), there are even more Southeast Asian Daz characters, although not more than here.
...there is a way to use Skin Builder skins on G3 and G8 male characters (if you don't use or need the "naughty bits") by using the Male <=> Female UI Swap scripts.
That's true too. I had forgotten about that, because I was satisfied with what the PAs have always provided, although I've bought the Skin Builder product for Genesis 2, Genesis 3, and Genesis 8 I've actually yet to use them. Buyers of a Skin Builder for Genesis 9 may still have the same problem you site and we've see from Victoria 9 the skin materials are laid out differently between the male & female character.