Awesome Iray Skin Shader Settings by FlorentMoon

Scavenger

Trying a darker skin. On the left is the default skin, still in the 3DL shaers. The Right has the formula applied.

Lips need to get toned way back...I think the skin is showing too much red still, but I really don't know how the interplay of settings work with the darker maps.

SixDs

"Reminder to image posters.  Please limit width on images to 800 pixels."

There used to be something somewhere on the forums regarding image size restrictions, but I'll be darned if I can locate it anymore. A sticky somewhere readily accessible would be appropriate, for everyone's benefit and especially new users. (and old users, too, since the rules have apparently changed with everything becoming smartphone-centric).

If the information is still available somewhere, a link would be helpful, but simply posting it here means that it will quickly be lost to the bowels of the forums.

Chohole

SixDs said:

"Reminder to image posters.  Please limit width on images to 800 pixels."

There used to be something somewhere on the forums regarding image size restrictions, but I'll be darned if I can locate it anymore. A sticky somewhere readily accessible would be appropriate, for everyone's benefit and especially new users. (and old users, too, since the rules have apparently changed with everything becoming smartphone-centric).

If the information is still available somewhere, a link would be helpful, but simply posting it here means that it will quickly be lost to the bowels of the forums.

you can attach larger images.  It's just that we ask you to restrict the displayed version to 800px width because of the variety of different devices that people use to browse the forums.  By using the 2nd tab and ticking to open full size in new window people can then see the full size version easily if they wish.

mjc1016

And very large images can get horribly squished by 'automatic' resizing...if they just don't break formatting.  And the autoresizing basically sucks...

3Diva

Jimbow said:

Artistically speaking, Colour Zones of the Face is a useful guide.

http://gurneyjourney.blogspot.co.uk/2008/05/color-zones-of-face.html

It's, sadly, not really possible with daz settings as settings effect the entire face and you can't really break it down into thirds like that. For digital painting though, it's helpful. 

Jimbow

divamakeup said:

Jimbow said:

Artistically speaking, Colour Zones of the Face is a useful guide.

http://gurneyjourney.blogspot.co.uk/2008/05/color-zones-of-face.html

It's, sadly, not really possible with daz settings as settings effect the entire face and you can't really break it down into thirds like that. For digital painting though, it's helpful. 

It could be done by colour grading a translucency colour map.

This probably a better example of colour zones: https://uk.pinterest.com/pin/451485931367264649/

Added2: Here's a quick five minute example, re-colouring my existing translucency colour map using the above link as a guide. Too blatant, but a proof of concept.

 

3Diva

Jimbow said:

divamakeup said:

Jimbow said:

Artistically speaking, Colour Zones of the Face is a useful guide.

http://gurneyjourney.blogspot.co.uk/2008/05/color-zones-of-face.html

It's, sadly, not really possible with daz settings as settings effect the entire face and you can't really break it down into thirds like that. For digital painting though, it's helpful. 

It could be done by colour grading a translucency colour map.

This probably a better example of colour zones: https://uk.pinterest.com/pin/451485931367264649/

Added2: Here's a quick five minute example, re-colouring my existing translucency colour map using the above link as a guide. Too blatant, but a proof of concept.

 

Ah that's true! I never thought about using the translucency zones for that. Interesting concept! I'll have to see about experimenting with it. :) Thanks! 

3Diva

Scavenger said:

Trying a darker skin. On the left is the default skin, still in the 3DL shaers. The Right has the formula applied.

Lips need to get toned way back...I think the skin is showing too much red still, but I really don't know how the interplay of settings work with the darker maps.

Yeah, looks like those settings are only good for light to medium skin. The darker skin here definitely looks better in the first one, imo. Though the texture/bumps look better/more realistic on the second skin. I think for dark skin the entire thing would have to be reworked for better compatability with dark skin tones - as it seams to make her look quite "plastic". 

Scavenger

COntinued working on it.  One problem I found was I hadn't plugged in any specular maps, which helped. And I dialed back the glossy weight.

I found that Trancluceny weight is either on or off...the level of the slider didn't seem to have any effect.

Also, at a certain level of darkness for transluceny, it stops mattering what color you're using...if it's lighter, than the changing the red to green or yellow etc changes the skin.

3Diva

Scavenger said:

COntinued working on it.  One problem I found was I hadn't plugged in any specular maps, which helped. And I dialed back the glossy weight.

I found that Trancluceny weight is either on or off...the level of the slider didn't seem to have any effect.

Also, at a certain level of darkness for transluceny, it stops mattering what color you're using...if it's lighter, than the changing the red to green or yellow etc changes the skin.

That's definitely an improvement. She still has a bit of a "plastic" look. I did some fiddling with it for dark skin and made three changes to his settings.1) Turn the "Translucency Color" to black. 2) Turn the "Glossy Reflectivity" way down or off. And the most important part - 3) Turn the "Backscattering Weight" all the way off. Here's a before and after:

FlorentMoon's settings:

As you can see she looks pretty plastic. 

 

Here's FlorentMoon's settings with the three changes I listed:

Better and more natural looking, IMO.

This is without a "Normal" map and with the Base Bump map settings pretty low. With the Base Bump settings up higher and a Normal map added, the skin would look even better. 

Scavenger

Getting rid of backscatering i think was the final bit.

 

 

The bump mask doesn't have anything on the eyebrows, so I guess they're supposed to be drawn on...I might add some in there though, as i'm not thrileld with the look.

Scavenger

I did something which caused a seam to show between shoulders and rorso...but I think I'm good now.

RAMWolff

YAY... looks really good now!

Scavenger

The three silver characters...

3Diva

Scavenger said:

The three silver characters...

They look great, @Scavenger! :)

Llynara

Just found this thread, very interesting stuff! How does this approach change with the G8 skins? Seems like a whole new ball game now. 

tkdrobert

Thanks for sharing

3Diva

Llynara said:

Just found this thread, very interesting stuff! How does this approach change with the G8 skins? Seems like a whole new ball game now. 

Some of the basics seam to still apply - but yeah, many of the "Official 8" figures have skin that needs a bit of a different approach, imo. And we now have the Duel Lobe shaders to add more depth to the skin.

Eustace Scrubb

Since the only major difference in life between "white" skin and the darkest "black" skin, and any shade or tone between, is the amount and/or variant type of melanin, shouldn't there be a way to standardize "human skin" so that everything else is pretty well covered and the melanin values (mapped or otherwise) can be realistically controlled across the whole range on a single dial?

nonesuch00

Eustace Scrubb said:

Since the only major difference in life between "white" skin and the darkest "black" skin, and any shade or tone between, is the amount and/or variant type of melanin, shouldn't there be a way to standardize "human skin" so that everything else is pretty well covered and the melanin values (mapped or otherwise) can be realistically controlled across the whole range on a single dial?

Yes there should be human color wheels in DAZ Studio for 'natural earthly skin color tones', 'natural earthly hair color tones', and 'natural earthly eye color tones' that doesn't allow one to stray from those natural colors. Then DAZ 3D and the PAs can move from replicating the same repetitive task done over & over again for nearly the same results to spending their time improving other aspects of their 3D models.

It needs to be in a place with standardized lighting, DAZ 3D being a professional 3D modeling business I am guessing they know the standards of whatever that is, and that standard lighting should be used as the default scene lighting for DAZ Studio and in the 1st non-featured ad copy render in DAZ human 3D models.

I bought the OOT iRay Hair shaders over at Rendo because it looked like a good subset of all earthly natural hair colors but it doesn't seem to be working properly. In fact since I installed it and applied it to the 1st hair model none of my polygonal hair models is rendering correctly but rendering too dark. I think it changed some hidden default shader in DAZ Studio 4.10.x. Only fibre mesh hair without image maps though seems to still render correctly.  

barbult

nonesuch00 said:

Eustace Scrubb said:

Since the only major difference in life between "white" skin and the darkest "black" skin, and any shade or tone between, is the amount and/or variant type of melanin, shouldn't there be a way to standardize "human skin" so that everything else is pretty well covered and the melanin values (mapped or otherwise) can be realistically controlled across the whole range on a single dial?

Yes there should be human color wheels in DAZ Studio for 'natural earthly skin color tones', 'natural earthly hair color tones', and 'natural earthly eye color tones' that doesn't allow one to stray from those natural colors. Then DAZ 3D and the PAs can move from replicating the same repetitive task done over & over again for nearly the same results to spending their time improving other aspects of their 3D models.

It needs to be in a place with standardized lighting, DAZ 3D being a professional 3D modeling business I am guessing they know the standards of whatever that is, and that standard lighting should be used as the default scene lighting for DAZ Studio and in the 1st non-featured ad copy render in DAZ human 3D models.

I bought the OOT iRay Hair shaders over at Rendo because it looked like a good subset of all earthly natural hair colors but it doesn't seem to be working properly. In fact since I installed it and applied it to the 1st hair model none of my polygonal hair models is rendering correctly but rendering too dark. I think it changed some hidden default shader in DAZ Studio 4.10.x. Only fibre mesh hair without image maps though seems to still render correctly.  

The OOT Iray Hair Pair shader from Rendo works fine for me in DS 4.10. Did you remember to apply the Apply First shader before the colors?

nonesuch00

barbult said:

nonesuch00 said:

Eustace Scrubb said:

Since the only major difference in life between "white" skin and the darkest "black" skin, and any shade or tone between, is the amount and/or variant type of melanin, shouldn't there be a way to standardize "human skin" so that everything else is pretty well covered and the melanin values (mapped or otherwise) can be realistically controlled across the whole range on a single dial?

Yes there should be human color wheels in DAZ Studio for 'natural earthly skin color tones', 'natural earthly hair color tones', and 'natural earthly eye color tones' that doesn't allow one to stray from those natural colors. Then DAZ 3D and the PAs can move from replicating the same repetitive task done over & over again for nearly the same results to spending their time improving other aspects of their 3D models.

It needs to be in a place with standardized lighting, DAZ 3D being a professional 3D modeling business I am guessing they know the standards of whatever that is, and that standard lighting should be used as the default scene lighting for DAZ Studio and in the 1st non-featured ad copy render in DAZ human 3D models.

I bought the OOT iRay Hair shaders over at Rendo because it looked like a good subset of all earthly natural hair colors but it doesn't seem to be working properly. In fact since I installed it and applied it to the 1st hair model none of my polygonal hair models is rendering correctly but rendering too dark. I think it changed some hidden default shader in DAZ Studio 4.10.x. Only fibre mesh hair without image maps though seems to still render correctly.  

The OOT Iray Hair Pair shader from Rendo works fine for me in DS 4.10. Did you remember to apply the Apply First shader before the colors?

Yes, I saw your gorgeous render of the new hair and the Alexandra affilated model and noticed it looks just how one would expect but when I render it shows up way to dark like two hair shades darker or more.

Does it get lighter the more iterations you do (because of translucency & top coat need more iterations to show up maybe)? 

barbult

nonesuch00 said:

barbult said:

nonesuch00 said:

Eustace Scrubb said:

Since the only major difference in life between "white" skin and the darkest "black" skin, and any shade or tone between, is the amount and/or variant type of melanin, shouldn't there be a way to standardize "human skin" so that everything else is pretty well covered and the melanin values (mapped or otherwise) can be realistically controlled across the whole range on a single dial?

Yes there should be human color wheels in DAZ Studio for 'natural earthly skin color tones', 'natural earthly hair color tones', and 'natural earthly eye color tones' that doesn't allow one to stray from those natural colors. Then DAZ 3D and the PAs can move from replicating the same repetitive task done over & over again for nearly the same results to spending their time improving other aspects of their 3D models.

It needs to be in a place with standardized lighting, DAZ 3D being a professional 3D modeling business I am guessing they know the standards of whatever that is, and that standard lighting should be used as the default scene lighting for DAZ Studio and in the 1st non-featured ad copy render in DAZ human 3D models.

I bought the OOT iRay Hair shaders over at Rendo because it looked like a good subset of all earthly natural hair colors but it doesn't seem to be working properly. In fact since I installed it and applied it to the 1st hair model none of my polygonal hair models is rendering correctly but rendering too dark. I think it changed some hidden default shader in DAZ Studio 4.10.x. Only fibre mesh hair without image maps though seems to still render correctly.  

The OOT Iray Hair Pair shader from Rendo works fine for me in DS 4.10. Did you remember to apply the Apply First shader before the colors?

Yes, I saw your gorgeous render of the new hair and the Alexandra affilated model and noticed it looks just how one would expect but when I render it shows up way to dark like two hair shades darker or more.

Does it get lighter the more iterations you do (because of translucency & top coat need more iterations to show up maybe)? 

Well, I haven't noticed it gettng lighter. Sometimes early on, the render has lots of black specks, so when that clears up, I guess it would appear lighter, but that happens pretty fast with a GPU render.

nonesuch00

barbult said:

nonesuch00 said:

barbult said:

nonesuch00 said:

Eustace Scrubb said:

Since the only major difference in life between "white" skin and the darkest "black" skin, and any shade or tone between, is the amount and/or variant type of melanin, shouldn't there be a way to standardize "human skin" so that everything else is pretty well covered and the melanin values (mapped or otherwise) can be realistically controlled across the whole range on a single dial?

Yes there should be human color wheels in DAZ Studio for 'natural earthly skin color tones', 'natural earthly hair color tones', and 'natural earthly eye color tones' that doesn't allow one to stray from those natural colors. Then DAZ 3D and the PAs can move from replicating the same repetitive task done over & over again for nearly the same results to spending their time improving other aspects of their 3D models.

It needs to be in a place with standardized lighting, DAZ 3D being a professional 3D modeling business I am guessing they know the standards of whatever that is, and that standard lighting should be used as the default scene lighting for DAZ Studio and in the 1st non-featured ad copy render in DAZ human 3D models.

I bought the OOT iRay Hair shaders over at Rendo because it looked like a good subset of all earthly natural hair colors but it doesn't seem to be working properly. In fact since I installed it and applied it to the 1st hair model none of my polygonal hair models is rendering correctly but rendering too dark. I think it changed some hidden default shader in DAZ Studio 4.10.x. Only fibre mesh hair without image maps though seems to still render correctly.  

The OOT Iray Hair Pair shader from Rendo works fine for me in DS 4.10. Did you remember to apply the Apply First shader before the colors?

Yes, I saw your gorgeous render of the new hair and the Alexandra affilated model and noticed it looks just how one would expect but when I render it shows up way to dark like two hair shades darker or more.

Does it get lighter the more iterations you do (because of translucency & top coat need more iterations to show up maybe)? 

Well, I haven't noticed it gettng lighter. Sometimes early on, the render has lots of black specks, so when that clears up, I guess it would appear lighter, but that happens pretty fast with a GPU render.

OK, I'll have to mess around some more with it but something seems off on mine, even when I load a hair brand new again and render without the OOT iRay addon on a OOT hair from the DAZ Store it is rendering much darker than it was before I bought and used that product for the 1st time. I CPU render though. Very odd.