A plea to clothing content creators regarding M6/G2M
DaWaterRat
Posts: 2,885
With the new gent around the corner, I have to finally recognize that my migration to Genesis 2 figures is indeed inevitable.
However... There is something the PA's here (and elsewhere) can do to ease my pain that will benefit you financially (however small, I do have a very small and limited budget) I may not be able to get everything in that two-week golden window right after release, but I will try to get everything I can.
I realize that Guy-Stuff sells at maybe a quarter of the rate girl stuff does, if that. So I'm not asking for a ton of guy stuff (though I'd love you forever if you did.)
All I want, and I've said this before, all I've ever wanted, is to be able to put a male and a female figure of the same generation in the same scene and have their wardrobe be appropriate to the scene and each-other.
V6 is in a bikini? I need at least board shorts for M6. (Speedos work too. :D )
V6 is in clubwear? Then M6 needs to look like he's dressed for the same club. Be it a semi-casual suit, or something more suited for a biker bar, or even hailing from Club 54... as long as it belongs in the same club V6 is heading out to.
V6 is in something skimpy and spring-ish? Shorts and a polo/t-shirt, at the least. And decent Shoes. Not just flip-flops. Especially if she's wearing heels.
V6 is in an evening gown? The Business Suit and Tux for Genesis are great, but I'd rather not rely on Autofit.
V6 is in something skimpy and elfin while Hunting Orcs? M6 needs something of a similar elfin line to be hunting them beside her.
V6 is in ridiculous Skimpy armor fighting Dragons? M6 can wear ridiculous skimpy armor while fighting dragons too (And if it's okay for girls, but not guys... wait, that's a different rant...)
V6 actually has a decent set of covering armor for fighting dragons? M6 should (and probably will) have a decent set of armor too.
That's all I ask. If you make 17 clubwear outfits for V6, spare two for M6, so that he can be in the same club without looking out of place (too rich, too poor, too casual, too formal, too ... whatever.)
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Comments
Your request is too sensible. I fear it will be ignored - although I hope not.
DENIED.
V6 in evening gown? M6- wearing M4's tux, and if he's lucky not the holiday one with snowflakes.
V6 in undies? M6- futilely searching for that underwear pack.
V6 in sting bikini? Autofiting that Casual Wear pack right now....
V6 in skimpwear.... M6 checking out the clothing options at Content Paradise to see if he can find something comparible.
LOL.
Sorry, couldn't resist.
I totally agree. I seriously hope some normal everyday clothing is included in this pack.
I agree, although I don't really do the normal everyday wear thing.
I really do hope there is some dragon fighting skimpwear for M6.
it's easier for me to come up with comparisons using modern day clothing without referencing specific G2F outfits, but yeah, Girl 6 got something that could pass for a pirate outfit, so I'd love to have one for M6, etc.
I agree, it would be nice to have outfit that look like they belong together. Especially if we are talking about cultural, historical, and vintage clothing. We got some nice 50's clothing for GF2 including a vintage bathing suit. How about a vintage 50's bathing suit for M6? Men's clothing may not have changed much in two hundred years, but the details and accessories has.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: But seriously...
I wish content creators would listen to suggestions like this. I don't think we are just looking for skimp-wear or evening wear, or swimwear or even underwear for both males and females of the same generation, but the point is to make these look like they would actually belong to a couple with similar interests or in the same household or in the same environment. I Rio or on the Riviera men don't often wear board shorts and surfer outfits as they walk down the beach with their bikini-clad (or topless) companion. Likewise not all men's formal-wear is a classic stuffed-shirt tuxedo. so PLEASE merchants let's give this generation a little more thought than usual and look at what G2F already has in the pipeline to get inspiration for M2F.
TYVM :smirk:
Pa make what sells for them. Each PA has a certain skill set and plays that to their advantage. Most products are made based on previous sales figures. The thing most people forget is that this is a lot of our career and we need to run it like a business. A business don't sell that's that they get a low return on. Same goes with this industry.
I understand that, having been a PA myself, however it is a very poor merchant who does not listen to his customers
It is a sort of two-edged sword. If it isn't sold, people can't buy it either and people won't come to daz looking for it either... =-) While I realize the majority of folks here are looking for female garb, I'm not one of them. I prefer men's content, so I guess I'm part of the 'low return' consumer base.
It is frustrating to know that I'm not a valued customer. =-(
..........This says it perfectly
The forum members make up for at best 5% of the customer base here at DAZ. What people say in the forum may not make up what the majority wants. Sad truth is, as a PA your always gonna tick someone off for not meeting there expectations. I know I don't speak for the other PA's but I know in my own experience that I make stuff that the forum customer wants and its a total flop on release. It doesn't even pay for my time. As a PA you look at trends of whats being said and talk amongst others about sales figures. We aren't going to sit here and continue to make products that are a flop. We won't be in this business long. If I sell one product of a certain theme and only sell 50 units and then sell another of a different theme and sell 300 units, we're obviously going to pick the 300 units. We are in this to make money to support our families not to take continued losses.
I don't sell my Genesis clothing, but give it away. I have been waiting for G2M/M6 so I can make some things for them.
What sort of everyday items do you want? Not fantasy etc, I don't make those.
And those previous sales figures are based on WHAT WAS OFFERED. They can't have statistics on things they haven't done!
I don't do modeling yet, just Curvy3D experimenting at the moment, but with their level of talent, making some of these aforementioned items seems reasonably within their capabilities.
If we are only offered 95% skimpwear, the statistics will say, "Wow, skimpwear sells!"
Sorry, but IMO your logic is skewed about the forum members. It's called demographic sampling, and if you have 5% (where did you get that figure? Interesting!) of the MOST INVOLVED CUSTOMERS, then perhaps they should be listened to. And as a business owner myself, if the active people who buy buy buy are saying (and have been for years, and they are PERSISTENT) that men's outfits are sorely in demand, then the smart business owner needs to pay attention.
@Wilmap, do you mean "skimp" fantasy, or actual fantasy overall?
As my request would have been Primitive clothing, stuff tribe clans would wear through to cave men, simple clothing made of pelts, fabrics and leathers... I guess that counts as historical perhaps, but such clothing would also class as fantasy. The same goes for G2F also. I'm not a fan of Skimp clothing in any genre, and its been tough finding decent variety of modest and non-skimpy tribal clothing for her.
In modern stuff, jewelry and accessories would really be awesome: Bangles, bracelets, arm bands, necklaces, watches, gloves, earings etc (for both Male and Female genesis2) These could also made for historical stuff too. Theres allot around for V4, some here and there for M4, not so much for gen5, and next to nothing for G2F and will certainly lack for G2M. In terms of G2M clothing alone, Id like to see some street wear, casual stuff, but with age ranges, styles are completely different between elders-adults-teens-children, most stuff available in past male clothing is pretty much only adult wear. The elders and young need clothes too! LOL
(This is my requests/hopes in general, not necessarily directed at wilmap, but it was his comment which prompted my reply to this thread)
But as far as you go Wilmap, your freelance, you could cover anything on G2M cos nothing is available yet and it will take a long time for G2M to build a wardrobe LOL
@Spyro I have already made some Primitave items which Jaderail asked for. I could convert them to G2M when he is out.
I have also made everyday clothing which are suitable for adults and children - most of these could be converted I would think.
I have only made a few pieces of jewellery as yet, still practicing!
Armour type items I haven't been able to do yet because I haven't mastered the rigidity maps yet.
I don't make fantasy or skimp wear.
Yes you certainly have build yourself quite a library, allot of great stuff in there :)
I myself have been learning clothing/accessories, but my work-flow needs improvement, takes me ages to finish wearable items, you come out with them so fast haha!
I do see great potential in you becoming a PA btw.
I have no intention of becoming a PA.
I've only recently started working on items for male figures......my "Fabulous" ladies need a dinner/dance partner!
I'm currently working on a debonair gentlemen's (think James Bond without the tie) set that I think will fit the bill..........
I've actually been half considering getting Hexagon or Zbrush or such, and having a stab at making my own clothing.
Wont be great stuff to start with but hey; I spend that much time putting characters in different poses and rendering them I could probably just as easily divert some of that time to making stuff for them.
Thank you Novica. =-) I agree 100%
Men's wear can also be sold as unisex. So people won't miss out on the female clothing market either.
I admit I felt slightly disappointed to hear that my dollar and interest as a customer were being minimized.. When I hear someone say 'no one buys men's stuff.' I think, jeez when did I become 'nobody.' =/
The forum members make up for at best 5% of the customer base here at DAZ. What people say in the forum may not make up what the majority wants. Sad truth is, as a PA your always gonna tick someone off for not meeting there expectations. I know I don't speak for the other PA's but I know in my own experience that I make stuff that the forum customer wants and its a total flop on release. It doesn't even pay for my time. As a PA you look at trends of whats being said and talk amongst others about sales figures. We aren't going to sit here and continue to make products that are a flop. We won't be in this business long. If I sell one product of a certain theme and only sell 50 units and then sell another of a different theme and sell 300 units, we're obviously going to pick the 300 units. We are in this to make money to support our families not to take continued losses.
You are so RIGHT! It's all about the money, When I originally started using Poser it wasn't that way - my how things have changed. It's probably why 95% of the customers gave up on the forums (like me) Sure we still buy stuff, but that alone does not make us satisfied customers. Sales figures alone can become a self-fulfilling prophecy. People's tastes change if you are always looking backward at the past, how will you see that?
also... have you ever considered that possibly more than 50% of the purchases are made by 5% of the customers? I think we should get one vote for every dollar we spend - LOL! :lol:
I get that, honestly, I do. I understand the marketing angle. That doesn't make my request unreasonable. I'm not asking for Menswear to even equal Woman's wear. I'm asking for whatever Menswear is produced to be designed with an eye to being able to work with what is already there for woman's wear. There are a few PA's who do an excellent job at making Guystuff in a few select Genres. There are a decent number of PA's who do mostly girlstuff who can afford to produce the occasional guy item. These are the PA's I'm hoping will listen.
I still firmly believe that a good proportion of the PA's are blaming the wrong factor. It's not that it's menswear, it's that it's menswear that doesn't suit enough customer's needs. I get that that task may border on Sisyphean. The menswear market for Poser/DS is small, and made even smaller by having different genres we're interested in. But damnit, we do exist. And I'm just as tired as others of being told we don't matter.
I can't afford to buy every single guy-item that comes out in that two week window after release. Some of it just doesn't suit my needs at all. But if I don't buy it - Whoops, it didn't sell. Must be because it's guy stuff. Never mind that maybe I didn't buy it because it's sci-fi, and I don't do Sci-Fi. Or it came out in Mid December and I have to save my pennies for actual Christmas presents for my family. If I didn't buy it, I must be lying about wanting Guy stuff. Seriously, that's the attitude I take away from these discussions. If those of us in the Forum don't buy EVERY SINGLE guy item that comes out, regardless of whether it suits our genre or if we can afford it at the time, we must be lying about wanting guystuff. Because Guy stuff Doesn't Sell. Well, if it's not in the store, I can't buy it at all. All I can do is periodically whine in the forums about it.
You betcha. I like that plan! People who do not post would have to buy a heckuva lot of items each day to be considered my equal as a consumer. That "only 5%" really didn't sit well with me as an argument. I know it wasn't meant as a dismissal, but I agree it came across that way.
But what bothers me here- immensely- is no matter how much money you spend, that is really not what is important. Everyone, every single person who takes the time to post on these forums and who tries to make a difference with their input- everyone is just as valuable as those of us who are fortunate enough to be retired and invest in our hobby. And because they ARE taking the time to participate, DAZ needs to wise up and listen. Or the business goes elsewhere. Or they go to Wilmap. Appreciate what you do btw!
And what a great point- the timing of when the products are released, is NOT OUR FAULT.
Also, DAZ needs to take responsibility for their marketing and site screw ups- My concern is the "this isn't working" factor. Aka the link is broken, the gallery page has one price and the product page another, the codes don't work in the cart, or "this page is 404 not found" etc and those impact sales. (The site is getting better, kudos for that.) But then they are going to look at their "history" and say, "Wow, that product doesn't sell."
Get good general menswear that has quality and it will sell.
I've only recently started working on items for male figures......my "Fabulous" ladies need a dinner/dance partner!
I'm currently working on a debonair gentlemen's (think James Bond without the tie) set that I think will fit the bill..........
Thank you! This kind of post gives me hope, because that's all I'm asking. I'm perfectly fine with V6 getting seven different dresses, and M6 getting one suit, as long as he gets the suit. Because you're right. They need a dinner/Dance partner. (Or a partner in crime, or whatever...)
Please keep in mind that there are many different kinds of suits! So it be nice to have different tailors.
If you're offering, I'd really love a cardigan ala this: http://hollyroden.tumblr.com/post/64492368878/isaacs-outfit-in-3x04-requested-by
I've also been hunting around for a lacrosse outfit, but the padding would probably make that overly difficult.
No worries if it wasn't an open offer, though. :)
That's a nice cardigan- good choice!
Understand the issue that male clothing doesn't sell as well as the female clothing. I mean I have 4 pairs of shoes total and any woman has 40 pairs of RED shoes, so it's perfectly reasonable.
But, just an observation. Add on items are a huge deal in retail. All those little knick knacks are at the checkout counter for a reason. If you were to make an "attempt" at a matching outfit or at list "eye patch" for G2 Male to go with each outfit you release for G2 Female and make the deal that I can buy the V6 Armored Bullet Proof Bikini of Invulnerability with the G2 Male Eyepatch of Invulnerability and save $1 by buying them together. I'm likely to buy them together because IT'S A DEAL! ^_^