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imo, it's latent homophobia and sexism. There are items in the store that are completely gender neutral, but still labeled for female characters. Example: https://www.daz3d.com/sci-fi-hand-gadgets-1-for-genesis-2-3-and-8-female-s
From what I remember, many people want modern military-styled uniforms, and they want "stylish" contemporary clothing where the pants aren't "tubes" and the shoes aren't "lumps." I think formal wear is wanted to. The male equivalent to female clothing was varied.
There used to be a thread about what people wanted to see from a male Pro Bundle, but I don't know what happened to that thread. It gave a good idea of what forumers wanted.
Time to link this again
Why isn't there more male clothing? by SickleYield on DeviantArt
Though I agree that there's really no reason why a random prop item shouldn't be supported for both male and female...
I'm not sure the lack of male-centric clothing items is due to latent homophobia. I've only been 'Dazing' for a couple years now, and whenever I mention Daz to someone outside of the core group, the first assumption is 3D porn. There has to be a reason for that assumption...and the amount of 3D porn I see on DeviantArt certainly supports that assumption. Most 3D porn is aimed at the male gaze...granted some of those men want to see men, most want to see women (as objects, which means naked or nearly-naked, so there's your sexism) (don't even get me started on what happens to the female models of questionable age...ick). So that's where the market is. That leaves folks like me, the ones who have no interest in thongs n' boobies, to hope stuff comes along that fits into what we want to see...and unfortunately, when you're in the minority, you're pretty much forced to go along with whatever the majority is given.
Exactly this x1000
The male issue comes up from time to time, along with the various theories and apologetics.
There is a core buyer base who renders females, but there are core buyers of male figures as well, judging from deviant art and other places, albeit smaller. I am one of the latter.
At some point the store, has to decide if it is serious about marketing to game and animators and produce usuable content for that market. It can't all be female.
I own most of the male content in the store. And there has been a downgrade in clothing quality since dForce became the new thing. dForce is not a subsitute for style and fit, and yet, it appears to be judging by quite a few recent male offerings. Dforce doesn't work well in complex scenes, for layered business wear, or couples images, without a lot of tweaking.
There is no solution, except to foster the production of men's content via the store. But I think as long as there is a core buyer base who just wants female and female skimpwear that appears to be low hanging fruit that will get made and sold.
With the change to the bundles, it is sad that there are even fewer men's items in the store. I used to rely on male bundles for men's outfits and clothing, and now they contain female characters, unisex hair, and environements.
I looked at the product and thought I recognized some of the shaders and looked up nelmi on Daz's store and found, yes I had bought their wool tartan shader package here. As a jeans, tee shirt and flannal person, I love generic, simple, washable clothes. And as a woman, I have to buy my flannel shirts in the male section of stores to get ones that are 'girlyfied' with lace, fitted to show off a bust, nip in the waist, have too short sleeves and waist... And men's tee shirts are so much better in quality. Would like to see that for the guys in DAZ.
I appreciate clothes that look like a man or a woman or child could wear them to work, be it an auto repair shop, a class room, a hospital, grocery store, courtroom, professional office, or out in the field for a geologist or working on a farm or ranch. Realistic is my point. Now take those areas and think what folks might have worn in the past or in the future.
The super rich, elegant outfits and environments don't interest me so much. Others can buy them. I want real world, or the historic or future versions would be.
If you look at that prop set, it supports both male and female. The original name included Males in it as I recall, and I suspect the name got truncated at some point by accident during the store upgrade. It's not a conspiracy, and it's *definitely* not homophobia.
+1
I was just going through my library to find dirty hands for my character... Still haven't decided if he would be wearing a tuxedo or a shiny starship captains uniform to the outhouse.
I buy a lot of games on Steam, and sometimes I buy the stuff geared towards adults. This is, by far, where I see the most Daz assets used "in the wild." There are a ton of Steam games made with Daz Assets, seemingly all of them adult, and for every male, there are 5 or 6 females. Some games feature a total of 0 males. Of course, there is the "other" rendo, which is all adult content, and they have their own busy gallery, filled with mostly women.... And I won't go into any more detail than that. So there is definitely a reason why Daz might make people think of 3D pron, and yeah... the male gaze definitely seems to dominate.
Same here, and I don't really care so much whether it's for men or women. Just no skimp or super-luxury wear, there's waaaaayy enough of that in the store. Sometimes I'm just plain baffled by the sheer number of Sexy SciFi Skimp Suits people are apparently willing to buy ... But maybe these are the people who buy new items first day which I sadly can't afford most of the time, and so naturally make the market drift in the ever same direction? If so, then it probably can't be helped, and there will always be a certain dearth of 'non-skimp or luxe', and especially male, items.
Will preface this by saying that I am gay.
I agree with what's been said by everyone so far, but what has been a weird additional wrinkle for me of late is also all the this androgynous and "camp" clothing and accessories. I feel weird saying this as a middle-aged gay man, but the store has taken on a distinctly " gender bent" taste of late. It's aggravating to have a dearth of regular clothing that works on men in general, but of late (like today) the few male options are basically queer clothing like drag queen dress for g8m or androgynous outfit for g8m. I wouldn't have an issue if male clothing was more plentiful, but it's frustrating to be looking for average/every day clothing, and instead I'm finding dresses and androgynous outfits.
Yeah, but to be fair, there weren't many of those for the longest time, and I guess they wanted to catch up. If the trend continues, however, there will need to be a serious conversation. They do have the benefit of relying on dForce for fitting, so they're taking a page out of the playbook of makers of a lot of female-oriented clothing. There's not that much well-fitted everyday clothing for female characters, either, so when there's something decent for males, I buy that.
Of note: There are a grand total of nine (9) Daz gallery entries linked to @mal3Imagery's two nice outfits for G8M on male characters. Two of them are mine. That's me, who buys the good stuff and doesn't complain about the lack of clothing for dudes. If people want to see nice stuff for male characters in the store, they'll need to represent in the store and the gallery. Forum chatter alone doesn't get stuff in the store.
I never get feedback in the galleries here. I post my art over at Rendo and Deviantart, where i do get feedback. I did buy that outfit and I will consistently support the vendors who make quality male content, however I will not buy male content just because it exists. I don't have the money for that and I don't want a library full of stuff I will never use. And frankly requesting more male stuff is like beating a dead horse over here, so I just don't bother.
But that's just my opinion.
Some recent custom males:
https://www.daz3d.com/gallery/user/5999567703113728#gallery=newest&page=1&image=1125477
https://www.daz3d.com/gallery/user/5999567703113728#gallery=newest&page=1&image=1123752
https://www.daz3d.com/gallery/user/5999567703113728#gallery=newest&page=1&image=1123751
People forget this is a creative field. People make stuff because generally it interests them creatively (obviously they also do it for money, more or less, but we'll ignore that for a bit). So there's more than a small chance they actually don't care about making as much guy stuff, or it doesn't interest them.
Someone might get an idea for something for one gender but redoing the almost the exact same thing again isn't really going to be as exciting or something they even care to do. It's not a production line of made to order items by robots, so you can't really demand other people's creativity takes a particular direction. Which might in part be the reason for some of the "lower quality" mens stuff, it's no longer a "passion" project, but forced mundanity to appease an audience.
Really, the only solution to get what you want, is to make it yourself. Theres loads of things you never see here (or elsewhere), for men and women characters.
Very valid point. I model lots of my own content, could be a PA if I felt the need, but really don't have a desire to create male content, mainly because I have less of a use for it. I have been down that road of having to create something I was less than enthusiastic about creating and the quality suffered (If I even finished it at all). I am a hetro male and most of my creative images involve women, usually half naked. For when I do use males in images, I have most of what I need in the way of quality clothing. Only thing I am missing is a realistic looking suit, none of the ones in the store fit the bill so far.
Just like with womens cothing, when I find a quality 3D outfit, I get a lot of use out of it with retextures and personal mods.
I'm a hetero female and most of my creative images involve women too, haha. Though not half naked. I don't think artwork needs to be driven by one's preference as to who they wants to see nekkid. I'd rather see man-butt than boobies if I'm looking to have my trolley tripped, but when it comes to artwork, artwork I create and artwork I want to view, my trolley is not what I'm looking to trip. I dunno, maybe I'm in the minority. For my own personal artwork, I stick to wormen I guess because I like to identify with them...kinda like why I always play as female characters in video games.
Are PA's being asked to make content for these new bundles? The recycled nature and the rushed nature of them, makes me wonder. I mean aside from the outfit, nothing new in the new Vizier bundle.
Most likely they are. There's a higher proportion of G8M items than G8F items that are Daz Originals. That means that if Daz wasn't commissioning stuff for male characters, there would probably be even less of it available.
we have Mike 8.1 dOn't complain
Mike 8.1 doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid.
I am skeptical pas were solicited to make men's content for the Vizier bundle, otherwise there would be some. I see only female content and a male outfit.
By "Vizier bundle" are you referring to "Curses of Ancient Egypt - Second Cleopatra Bundle"? Besides, Daz can solicit, but that doesn't mean PAs will necessarily jump, and there's also a limit to how much Daz can spend subsidizing the production of stuff for male characters.
Cleopatra's Royal Vizier Bundle is what I see. The fact no one knows what daz can solicit or afford.
But apparently, the powers that be have been reaching out to Artstation artists lately.
Why do you say "rushed"?
It seems rushed if you produce a bundle labeled Cleopatra's Royal Vizier Bundle and then recyle a character and a freebie snake to pad it out.
"Curses of Ancient Egypt - Second Cleopatra Bundle" is the subject of Daz's newsletter promo today. I don't claim to know what Daz can solicit or afford, but there are almost certainly limits to it. As far as ArtStation, that started at least a year ago with Underbelly.
Yep, and the store page calls it https://www.daz3d.com/cleopatras-royal-vizier-bundle
What can you do. Not the first time, the store, alters the name of a bundle or content.