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This might be another product rather than a feature but if you could devise some way to help skirts into a sitting position it would save me even more hours toiling with a deformer or sculpting program.
Some of the vendors have come up with morphs which fit commonly available pose sets but these garments are usually expensive and not that practical if you "pose your own". So I usually end up making the dress fit my own pose in Blender. As I say - hours of work to avoid a skirt which looks like a sheet-metal cylinder set at an angle. The "draped" effect is why dynamic clothing was invented but that has its own problems which make conforming clothes still more convenient.
The worst is a dress with pleats or vertical folds. They don't bend naturally on conforming cloth and again look like corrugated sheet metal that has been machine shaped into a curve.
I would pay serious money for a product like this.
Given the almost infinite variety in skirt lengths, silhouettes, and materials, not to mention possible sitting poses, creating a set of universal skirt helper morphs could be a neverending project. One possible means of simplification could be to choose a lower body sitting pose that could be useful in many situations, then creating helper morphs around that pose.
We're probably going rather off-topic here, but I have used that simplified workflow in my own morph creation for freebie add-on orphs. For specific dresses, I have chosen a generic sitting pose [knees at approximately 90 degrees, legs either crossed at ankles or shoulder width apart -- that's for long gowns] and used D-Formers to make sit morphs around that pose.
After doing this a few times, I've begun to identify the type of morphs needed to position the skirt, like flattening the rear of the skirt against the butt and back of thighs, draping the skirt and reducing bulk around the tops of thighs, sides of legs, and knees, moving the hem of the skirt forward, etc. I wonder if it's possible to create projection morphs on G2F that could do this.
Heck, maybe Fit Control can even do this already! Zev0, any insight on this particular use?
--MW
I'd love to stay around to see how this discussion develops but I have to go out now. Back on Sunday.
But nothing of what I have said is intended as criticism - especially where Zev0 and his co-developers are concerned. As I said, I have almost all of his store and they are always innovative and useful products.
I would pay serious money for a product like this.
Given the almost infinite variety in skirt lengths, silhouettes, and materials, not to mention possible sitting poses, creating a set of universal skirt helper morphs could be a neverending project. One possible means of simplification could be to choose a lower body sitting pose that could be useful in many situations, then creating helper morphs around that pose.
We're probably going rather off-topic here, but I have used that simplified workflow in my own morph creation for freebie add-on orphs. For specific dresses, I have chosen a generic sitting pose [knees at approximately 90 degrees, legs either crossed at ankles or shoulder width apart -- that's for long gowns] and used D-Formers to make sit morphs around that pose.
After doing this a few times, I've begun to identify the type of morphs needed to position the skirt, like flattening the rear of the skirt against the butt and back of thighs, draping the skirt and reducing bulk around the tops of thighs, sides of legs, and knees, moving the hem of the skirt forward, etc. I wonder if it's possible to create projection morphs on G2F that could do this.
Heck, maybe Fit Control can even do this already! Zev0, any insight on this particular use?
--MW
The way I normally tackle the sitting issue on skirts is by selecting the thigh bones on the item and scale that, normally on the Z or X axis. Sometimes I scale it so the leg pokes through so that smoothing does the rest to mould it. It's not 100% solution but it does yield better results at times. What I notice is that when in a sitting pose, most dresses are still floating above or below the legs. I will experiment with this a bit more. Now, it might not work on some dresses specially if they have custom bones, but it's worth a look into I suppose.
Haven't been in the forums for a bit, so this release came as a surprise.
It seems that every time I think 'Finally - I've got every product for DS I want and need and can give trying to find money a rest', within usually two days you release something new I look at and know I just HAVE to have, and have NOW ... Grrrr ... Will be purchasing as soon as I've finished this post. Clothing that appears to be spandex/spray-on over the breasts has been my single biggest complaint since I started into this stuff in 2004.
Extra feature request:
The one 'missing' morph that immediately sprang to my mind when looking at the product promos is a bra morph that shows the breasts by lifting the breast band and lower part UP, if that is possible, whether for flashing breasts or starting to take off a pull-on sports bra by pulling the breast band out and up.
My other suggestion for G2F/G2M is something to help with my OTHER bugbear about apparently spandex/spray on clothes, which is with muscular characters. Frequently even with muscular morphs that come with clothes, and especially with auto-fit, if one dials up e.g. thigh muscles and calf muscles, a pair of e.g. jeans will get corresponding bulges but still be thin at knee and ankle, leaving jeans where the owner clearly would have had to be sewn into them, and would have been incapable of e.g. getting their bulging calf through the tiny knee part of the jeans etc. In real life, except in something with a fair percent of lycra, the muscular man/woman would have pants that are actually just large in the thigh with an even taper all the way down, rather than figure hugging all the muscle bulges. So something to inflate the knee area would be great. There's a similar problem with arms and having elbow areas on the clothes which a muscular forearm could actually get through.
(Actually, for a lot of clothing it would give a more realistic result on muscular figures - though with more dial fiddling for the user - if one had something like your full set of Shape Shift morphs to put into the clothes and dial independently of the fitted-to figure, and then actually dialled the autofitting BodyBuilder/BBDetails/individual-muscle morphs completely out of the clothing, and fit using the Shape Shift type morphs widening and narrowing the various area of the clothes without all the muscle definition etc. A lot of looser clothing doesn't cling except on upper surfaces and e.g. a shirt on a man with wide chest and bulging pecs may well be wide all the way down, not tapering in over the lower ribs, not clinging to the pec cleavage and not showing abs definition. So a general set of inflate/deflate morphs in zones down each leg and arm and down the torso could give much more realistic results with loose clothes on muscular and/or fat characters after dialling the autofitted muscular and/or fat morphs down or off completely .... along with a left/right, down/up, forward/backward as appropriate for each zone to account for gravity in a particular pose.)
I have noticed this problem, and it is related to my request for wrinkles at the backs of the knees. I'd just like more realism at the arm and leg joints. They've done a decent job when working with bare skin, but the clothing comes up a bit short.
Hmm that sounds like an interesting thing to experiment on.
Reading this thread and the work Zev0 has put into this, all I can say is WOW. I'm still pretty new to Daz and rely heavily on prepackaged morph controls and such, still learning about shaders (the more I learn the cooler that stuff is!), and am pretty good at doing my own poses, but still... the talent that I'm seeing is incredible! I read threads like this one and totally get lost in a lot of the language that's used (honestly, you guys sound like you wrote this program), so I have to give a HUGE Thank You to those who spend so many hours, through the sweat and 'wish lists' that come in, to put these products together!! You guys are life savers and make my joy of creation so much easier and fun!
This is going into my shopping cart as soon as I get home from work!
Seriously... you guys (and gals!!) totally rock! :cheese:
The stay-pressed, over-starched look is my biiggest issue with the 3D clothing universe. REAL clothes have wrinkles--big ones, snall ones and everything in between. I know there's one product that purports to add wrinkles -- but it's PC only. Anything that can add wrinkles--even if only works on a list of specific products -- would be an instant purchase!
Well I tried adding universal wrinkles, but most clothing simply are not dense enough for them to come through. I will revisit this idea again as I work on more morphs.
Thanks for the kind words Stryder87 :cheese:
I will have to get this at some point.
I have an outfit I use as the uniform for most characters in my webcomic. But it's ... a somewhat older outfit and lacks a lot of control. So many headaches...
Anything that helps even a little is worth it. :)
Where is the Script Icon mentioned in the tutorial. Tried this in 4.7 and 4.8
The scripts can be found here.
People\Genesis\Clothing\Fit Control
People\Genesis 2 Female\Clothing\Fit Control
It is the blue Plus sign.
Oh yeah, I got mine! Can't wait to play around with this.
Now I just hope someone outbids me on Ebay or I may be in trouble :O
http://thefarshoals.thecomicseries.com/comics/6
shows the problem I've had with fitting. Fit control should help a lot, heh.
I purchased "Fit Control" earlier today, and it's very helpful with many clothes (even those converted from V4). There is one thing I miss - a function to remove the morphs again (there is only the "inject" and the "zero" script...). The background is that I store the favorite characters I use with a "basic" or in some cases "extended" set of clothes on my hard disk. Now the Fit Control morphs blow up the size of the *.duf file in a significant way - so when I modify the character or add a hair style or a shader i would like to store this new version without the "Fit Control" overhead to save hard disk space...
Of course it is or I hope it is, esp. male support for Gen1. Though most G2M clothing does not have this problem, clinging clothes can still ruin an outfit-- I'm talking about the pecs, abs, the spine showing through the shirt, and rounded rather than sharp shoulders (which if you haven't already, it would be nice to have in the female product as well) Unless the fabric is made from a thin material, real shirts and tops sharpen on the shoulders where the arm and torso seams meet. This problem is most noticeable on male characters who have bigger, rounder, more muscular shoulders.
So, the useful morphs IMO for both sexes from most to less essential:
FEMALE
--Bewbs
--Butt (rear and spine are hard to rank-- I ultimately put butt above spine only because the former is more noticable, but the latter is almost never seen in real clothing)
--Back/Spine
--Shoulders
--Crotch
MALE
--Crotch
--Shoulders
--Back
--Abs (abs and back were hard to rank-- I think they're tied, here.)
--Pecs
Maybe back and shoulder support could be released for all three characters in a future product *gives Zev0 puppydog eyes* Seriously, I've wanted shoulder-sharpening for SOOOO long.
For the male version I already have crotch, pec and shoulder options along with a few others done. For the genital area, I also included some bulge and pulling morphs so if you want, can fit clothing while having the gens loaded, but will work just as well without any gens on. When it is time to work on new morphs, I will consult the thread at all suggestions made, but for now want to finish the ones I have running first:)
I just noticed that the morphs are added to hair as well as clothing. That surprised me, but also surprising was that I found a few of the beast morphs useful on long hair!
Lol!!.... Yeah it gets copied to all items loaded on the figure. Maybe load the hair last after the script is run on the clothes. That way there won't be any Fit Control morphs on the hair. Or just don't be tempted to dial up the boob morphs. :lol: We will see if there is actually way that the script can identify between different product types. Right now we haven't really looked at that. Might not be a solution to this but you never know..:P
So if we add items to the scene after running the script, will those items not have the Fit Control morphs?
Ah ok lol. Yes Correct. The morphs are only applies to what is currently loaded on the figure. However you can run the script again if you add more clothing. Just click on the figure and same process. It won't over ride the morphs with values:) It will ignore the morphs already loaded on existing items and just add it to the new one.
OK I will leave it lol. Funny enough I was going to try this same principle but for hair. Who knows, if it works, maybe we can add control to hair as well. I won't know till I actually sit and try this :P Would be a fun experiment:)
Wow! You know one of the reasons I bought this immediately was the fantastic support and expansion you have provided for Pose Builder. It sounds like owners of this new product will enjoy the same top notch customer service. I hope you sell a million of these!! (But not so many that you retire and stop making new stuff!!! :lol: )
:lol: Nah I still have a lot of things I want to finish so I'm not going anywhere:):. Will not rest easy knowing these prototype products are just sitting here starring at me lol. When I'm sleeping, sometimes at night they whisper in the air "finish me................." and when I look up a magical cup of coffee just appears. See how they lure me to work?.............:-P
Will this only be figure hair, or could it be workable for prop hair as well? I was working the other day on a character with prop hair and her head tilted right back, and it took a bit of fiddling with the existing morphs to stop the hair ends from sticking into her shoulders.
BTW, bought and installed, will have time to play with it over the weekend.
You could have a script add a hidden property to all selected items and then have the actual Fit Control script ignore items with that property (or make it non-hidden and set it to 1, then people could zero it if they wanted to include the items after all or include them in a different round of shaping).
Will this only be figure hair, or could it be workable for prop hair as well? I was working the other day on a character with prop hair and her head tilted right back, and it took a bit of fiddling with the existing morphs to stop the hair ends from sticking into her shoulders.
BTW, bought and installed, will have time to play with it over the weekend.
Thanks Kitty:) Well it would have to be hair auto fitted. Don't think there is a way to transfer morphs from figure to a prop.
That sounds viable, but people found some use of the morphs being copied onto places where it shouldn't, if included while script is run. Don't think I want to delete that function yet. It could prove useful. Plus if you don't want to dial them in you don't have to :lol: