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Ah, ok - that looks like it was either made without reference to G8 or imported at the wrong scale (but then some things look about right and you'd expect to catch that when doing promos or something).
I tend to use the world around me as a reference or just grab some pics from the net. I'm not measuring exactly but if my door-knob is 'there on me' and the head-clearance 'there', then it'll be close to that (slightly less head-clearance) for G8. Even when I'm making fantasy sets there's a scale to things (big fantasy doors in my latest set but reasonable-for-human sized steps).
was it an older set (pre Iray?) since polygon resources needed to be conserved more so back then - otherwise it's easier (IMO) to make a physical light and have an emissive polygon or few. I did have one set (over at Rendo) that used a painted light in one section but it also had an emission map so it still lit up.
I am an engineer & usually model everything I work with for my job in SolidWorks. There is a real world scale built into DS, and honestly, how hard is it to work to real world scales? As someone who works day-in-day-out at real world scale I have to say it's no problem. If modelling bought in equipment, because the supplier can't be bothered to supply them to customers, I take between 3 & 5 key published dimensions & roughly scale everything else from that based on photos of the items so the size looks right. One very rare occasions where the supplier is exceedingly unco-operative (as happened with a set of large castors we needed to use) where they wouldn't supply either a drawing or photo of the actual item, so I could get dimensions we needed, we bought one of the item so I could measure it in the detail I needed.
I am less bothered by G8F being 'oversize'. I come from a family where I, my wife & eldest daughter all range from 5'11" to 6'3", so the G8F heights people complain of as being 'abnormally tall' seem to be perfectly normal to me.
Now, small room architechture can be solved by removable walls. The bathroom in our last house was 4'6" x 7'0" (138 x 213cm) and had a bath, toilet & sink (getting it all to fit was a struggle as the room had only had a cast iron bath for a century 'til then). To model that sensibly for good camera views would need removable walls, but making it 15' x 8' instead would be ridiculous. Coming to think of it, in 2 models I am working on at the moment, removable walls would be useful for both lighting and camera views.
Actually yes. Without a good scale to work from it is al guess work. Is there a good daz ruller prop? I saw a freebie in the friebies forum but I could not make it work. Also, If I rescale the bed then the room may need to be resized or items on the counter etc. What is most needed I think is a univeral scale in daz where one inch is the same for everything.
There's Measure Metrics if you want precision, or you could just use a 1m cube primitive, scale to fit, and read the scale percentage as cm.
The floor grid is a scale by itself (1 meter x 1 meter) and it is quite easy to make one by yourself, just make a square box (I did 1m x 1m x 1m) and put a texture with chequered pattern to it, I used one that had 10x10 squares on each side.
I am a PA and I do agree with the OP that things should be to scale as best as possible.
Thank you, Mattymanx! You just became one of my favorite PAs. :)
Edited: Fixing autocorrect error.
Speaking of correct scale......... Yes, it has presets for centimeters or inches and they're accurate. But probably overkill to pay for just measuring things. A cube works just as well.
Everyday Tools
The set was post-Iray by quite a bit, but it was, IIRC, the first offering from this vendor. The one I kept was a full interior with several sets of shelves spotted about including a free-standing unit used as a divider. There were several sets of books on the shelves and I needed to get rid of one set on the divider. They were all separate material zones, so I found the one I wanted and set opacity to zero. Um - interesting; the pages are a different mat zone; find it and set opacity. And find out that none of the other books now have pages. So I had to track down all the other book mat zones, hide them, and then bring in prop books from another set.
All primitives can be created to accurate scale in both imperial and metric measurements within DazStudio. There is no excuse for inaccuracy. When a model is imported it can be checked for proper dimensions within1 inch accuracy in less than a minute. The people arguing the difficulty obviously are making unvalidated excuses or just don't know how straight forward it is to get it right. There is certainly room for improvement
Not only do you make your products to scale, but they are well researched too (as are maclean's, and other PA's noted here). I just wanted to commend you on the quality and attention to detail on your handgun. I'm more into pre 1896 firearms, which often have some glaring issues that I just am unable to get past. It seems that many of the modern varieties also suffer from similar problems. True, for many these inaccuracies may not be a huge problem, but they can definitely add to an image feeling off just a bit.
So anyway, a big thank you to you, and all the others who really try to model in proper scale and functionality based on real world objicts!
There are a couple of different free measuing tools available, if you need measurements finer than 1 grid = 1 meter:
https://sharecg.com/v/95479/browse/21/DAZ-Studio/Measuring-Tools
https://sharecg.com/v/69559/browse/21/DAZ-Studio/Measuring-Wall
https://www.deviantart.com/spyrorue/art/MWall-2-0-for-Daz-Studio-793218213
In general, they're meant for measuring people, but if you lay them down flat, they can measure pretty much anything. That said, unless vendors who have these issues (a) know that they ARE an issue, and (b) are pointed to these tools to use, it'll still be left to the user to decide to do something with them after the fact, which may or may not be ideal.
For whatever it may be worth: that specific PA has gotten MUCH better about both scale, and especially about not having things as all one item.
If this is the PA that I'm thinking of, I have been burned twice. There won't be a third time.
Here's a quote from an interview of Sebastian Bielecki, 3D modeler of the recently released Secret Labs at another site: "So as usual I started with a block out, to get all my proportions and scale of the elements. I imported a UE4 character and just started blocking shapes out, while looking at the concepts on my other screen. I don’t usually import them as a plane into 3dsMax, because they are ¾ sketches and it won’t work well that way. I usually just focus on maintaining proper size and proportions of elements. Even if in concepts they might be a bit smaller or larger, I’m always adjusting them to the size of the character."
After it's imported is a bit late (by then it's been through uv-mapping and texturing) unless it's just scaling the whole thing. Blender has handy tools for measuring and I'm sure other modellers do too.
I'm not an engineer - I'm an artist. I'm not sitting in Blender typing out numbers (well, sometimes I am) but rather pushing and pulling polys to a pleasing vision. So while I certainly want it to look good with G8 in the scene, I'm not going to worry if my doorknobs are 38" off the floor instead of 40"
Google gives me this: "The International Building Code has established doorknob height between 34 and 48 inches above a finished floor." - I just tested my Old Shopping Arcade set and found the doorknobs to be 39 inches off the floor - guess I'm good?
...
I agree that accuracy starts in the modeling software. Personally, it would bug me to not use actual, real world measurements. To each their own.
Just a note here.
I created an 8' measuring stick freebie for this very purpose a while back:
https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/257086/8ft-measuring-stick-prop-for-daz-studio/p1
BTW, an English + Metric texture is also available in the OP for this freebie, for those that are used to working in centimeters instead.
There's also a measuring wall freebie and of course Measure Metrics for those that have that product, but this stick, well you can easily rotate it to measure length, width, etc.and it's low poly, so not very resource intensive. Plus, the way I named it, it should show up towards the top of your props list in My Library or wherever you put it.
I'll often import this after loading a genesis character and set the z axis back slightly, to help with dialing in character height (measuring wall is good for that too). 'Cuz a lot of people are shorter than 6' in real life.
And yeah, part of the reason I created this prop was because of what the OP is noting. Too many times I've tried to fit a 'standard' character in a car or something only to find that his/her knees were embedded in the steering wheel, or the head was poking out of the roof, or the chair/couch was simply the wrong height.
Do keep in mind that sometimes PA's design larger than 'usual' rooms, to help accomodate camera angles more easily, which is a fair point. Trying to position a camera in say an 8' x 8' room, well that can be really annoying sometimes.
So yeah, I'll often place this measuring stick on the floor, then start adjusting the scale of a table, couch, room, etc. so that the height is more 'correct'.
You PA's are of course welcome to use my freebie to 'double check' your measurements in Daz Studio when designing things, or after you import them into Daz Studio. That's what it's for!
Of course, if you need something longer than 8', there's always Measure Metrics, or you could create a primitive at the height you need, as noted earlier in this thread.
Carry on!
Thank you!
For sure - everyone's got their preferred way of working - some approach it on a more technical level, but for me I'm halfway through blocking out a room before I stop to think - more 'sculptor' than 'architect' I guess, lol.
Still, if my end result is noticeably out of whack, I'd want to fix it.
Silent Winter believe me your sets seem fine, the one's we are discussing are wildly inacurate
some PA's have improved with later releases but none are more than a couple years old and quite frankly I was shocked they passed Quality Assurance
not DAZ people, even rescaling the one duplicated chair (the rest are one block and won't then fit the tiers) I could not fit DAZ people
was rendered in Twinmotion
Doesn't really matter.
5'11" is not way out for a woman, and certainly not for a man; adults are roughtly 5' 2" to 6'2"; so Daz models fit within those guides almost without exception.
I'm buying less, in part I have less need; in part: I want to check what I buy, because some of the stuff I've bought and never looked at, I can't return depsite it being poor due to being out of the 30 days. Hell some of it is out of the 30 months.
Not checking and returning shoddy work is my responsibility because Daz give us 30 days - no questions asked.
In fairness I'm not finding loads, but I'm finding enough if I include walls I can't hide, or ceilings; doors missing, or that don't open; or stuff combined into objects that should be separate. I returned a scene a few weeks ago that had books on it that were part of the desk, so couldn't be moved; I could invis them using the materials but I shouldn't have to imo.
Yes, and I have bought your stuff, and will continue to do so; I know what I'm getting.
Especially this passage from the linked text tells more about americans than about IKEA: "Eventually, executives realized that Americans were buying the vases to drink out of, as the Swedish company’s glasses were too small for local tastes." I wonder if in Texas IKEA sold more of the biggest vases, because we all know "everything's bigger in Texas"
And more to the OP:
Living in Germany I've encountered lots of different styles for rooms. Right now, I'm living in a house built in the 17th century, which has no rooms to live in on the ground floor, but only a former carpenter's workshop and a room for the heating. The rooms are about 10 feet high. Then there's an upper floor, added around the 1950's, which has rooms of about 8 feet height. "About" means, that a wall can be 7'11" on one side of the room and 8'1" on the other side... Another floor was added to this house in the 1970's or so, which only has 7 feet high walls. No a single part of the whole house is build with drywall - it's all bricks and mortar..
In early times of my life, I visited a friend living in a historical part of my hometown, in a buidling from the 13th century. The rooms there were about 6 feet high, with some wooden bars on the ceiling, reducing the height to 5'6" or so beneath them. With me being about 6'3" moving in that room was an interesting and nearly backbreaking experience...
So there's lots of different options for the size and height of ROOMS... but usually everything inside these rooms is measured to an average human height, modified only by age, as in the olden times the average height of people used to be a bit smaller than now. Therefor you're right to expect models to be scaled properly - and in fact a little bit smaller than for G8 figures, as these tend to be above average height of modern people - or for historical furniture maybe even a bit smaller - except for the beds of royalty, which to my knowledge in some - rare - cases were large enough to accompany a group of people.
And yes, I've got some PAs kinda blacklisted too for trying to sell stuff that obviously was made in "hurry up and take a lot of shortcuts" mode... and I don't talk about old stuff, but some quite recent things in the shop...
A long time ago, I heard to an industrial engineer who was asked about the seating space in cars, planes, etc. as there were tall people who had difficulty sitting in those spaces. He replied that for a long time the industry takes 1,75 m (5' 9") as a reference measure for humans. The current world average for humans is approximately 1,71 m for men and 1,60 m for women. Industry cannot mass produce for each country or region. Especially if you want to export. So what is valid for one 1,75 m human being is perfectly valid for another 1,70 m or 1,80 m. The range covers a large number of the world population, and still has a long way to go if the world average height continues to rise.
My parents used to own a farmhouse built in about 1590 (suggested by building historians at English Heritage based on a joint in the roof that was in fashion 1100-1350 and 1585-1595. The rest of the house indicated the later date.). The house was 22ft wide externally. The cob (mud) walls were 4ft (1.2m) thick at the base and 18" (45cm) thick at the top. The external walls were vertical, meaning all the taper was visible inside. The upstairs floors had a sag of 9" (22.5cm) in the middle of the span. We had to block all firniture legs up towards the middle of the room to keep things reasonably stable. The roof timbers were trees that still had the bark on, and were hacked back with an adz where the tree would have gone outside the roofline. Where the tree went far inside the roofline, there was timber blocking nailed to the tree to pack it out. The floor in places was round river stones hammered on edge into the mud floor so closely the stones couldn't move. The rest of the floor was flagstones laid on the mud.
To be honest, it'd be a nightmare to model the house. There wasn't a straight line or flat surface anywhere. The internal walls were angled every which way and the plastering left dips up to 2" deep over a distance of 2ft. It was obviously built by very casual labour over a couple of centuries. Anyone modelling it would be accused of sloppy work if they modelled it accurately.
Regards,
Richard.
Why yes, yes it is! There are no real-world dimension indications in Studio. Shrink or expand your bed easy-peasy, but determine when it's 80 inches long. Priceless. True, there are otherways to skin a cat but we shouldn't have to. So, perhaps a step in the right direction would be for the next version of Studio to contain a measuring tool that one could calibrate for a scene and attach to an object to read-out in realtime it's "real-world" dimensions as one is scaling the object.
Sounds like hell to model, but fun to live in
I requested a feature for DS a couple of years ago. I asked if the Scene Info pane (which gives the poly count) could be adapted to include measurements of an object in the scene. Never heard any more about it.
A hewn wooden cave.