New DS Filament Render Engine

2456730

Comments

  • MoreTNMoreTN Posts: 302

    Does this render 3DL textures? And is there a speed improvement over 3DL? Very excited if so, because that would mean I don't have to replace my 8 yr old, low end PC (which I can't afford to do anyways).

  • VyusurVyusur Posts: 2,235

    Did I miss something? What is Filament?

  • nonesuch00nonesuch00 Posts: 18,293
    edited October 2020

    I'm trying it on a recent scene and the brightness of it is way too high. Also, it's making too many surfaces look like they've been coated with ice in an ice storm. Other surfaces though have a lovely pastel chalks look to them with I like. I am using an MSI Radeon RX 570 8GB that is only slightly slower than a PNY GeForce GTX 1650 Super 4GB I have that is not installed. I will switch them tomorrow. It will be interesting to see if it improve the Filament renders (it shouldn't). I am wanting to see which recent scenes I'm animating in DAZ that will fit into the PNY GPU's 4GB RAM, some of those scenes have a lot of DAZ products in them.

    Attached: Fliment Preview of scene I've done within the past week. The rendering of the viewport is almost instantaneous but as you see it isn't done yet. The bright levels are too high. A great start though. Honestly the pastel chalk look I'm getting I would like in my hobby video games when I go on with that. Compare with the same scene in my forum icon or my render of the scene in my 2020 Caricature Gallery.

    I hope for a full blown Filament Render option in the renderer drop down menu!

    Notice that the new public beta created nodes in my scene tab for the Environment and Tone Mapping settings from the renderer. When I hide those in the scene tab two Render Settings subsections called 'Display' disappear. No sure what's going on with that. 

    +++++

    I found the Filament Render option as Viewport. I hope for improvements to that renderer.

    I did find bugs.

    And I did install my PNY GeForce GTX 1650 Super 4GB and if you look in my gallery 2020 Caricatures none of my last 10 render from there with fit in a 4GB nVidia card. Thast's zero. So if you are thinking of buying an nVidia GeForce RTX 30X0 series I advise based on that to save an extra month or two and get a 30X0 video card with no less than 16GB RAM. As you see the scene is complex because that's how it is in real life but from a customer perspective it was very easy to make that scene. So disappointing (not the PA or DAZ fault; the GPU manufacturers need to get on the stick)! I'm absolutely not interested in 'optimizing' my scene although rendering at 720P and using DLSS to upscale it is reasonable thing to do if that fits the scene in 4GB or 8GB or 10GB RAM. Are you willing to spend $499 or $699 though on a 30XX Series video card just to find out your simple scenes don't fit into them even at 720P? I'm not.

    Filament Demo 00.png
    1917 x 1045 - 1M
    Post edited by nonesuch00 on
  • nonesuch00nonesuch00 Posts: 18,293
    edited October 2020

    Cute Diva!

    However there are bad bugs that Filamernt has caused. I actually in my render settings lost the entire sections of 'Enviromental Settings' and 'Tone Mappings Settings'! Do NOT use Filament in the viewport or in the rending don't use 'Viewport' (really Filament) or you risk corrupting your scene duf file and get crashes of DS without crash dump files.

    I still like filament but it's not ready. Just test it on just scenes until it's fixed.

    ++++

    It's been said in the DAZ Studio Discussion by JellyBean that turning on and then off iRay Preview Mode in the ViewPort will restore your lost Environmental and Tone Mapping setting.

    Post edited by nonesuch00 on
  • LeanaLeana Posts: 11,817
    edited October 2020
    Vyusur said:

    Did I miss something? What is Filament?

    Filament is a real-time physically-based render engine. The new beta of DS (just released) added it as a preview mode.

    Post edited by Leana on
  • VyusurVyusur Posts: 2,235
    Leana said:
    Vyusur said:

    Did I miss something? What is Filament?

    Filament is a real-time physically-based render engine. The new beta of DS (just released) added it as a preview mode.

    Thank you very much for the explanation.

     

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,724
    edited October 2020

    It looks like it might not be suitable for animations - it renders dark "crosshair" type lines across the figures. It didn't show up in my other animations because my figures were "offset" from where they appear on the screen. They seem to only show up in certain spots. If the figure is off of those spots it's not noticeable. But BOY are they noticeable when the figure is on them:

    https://player.vimeo.com/video/468079602

    It's odd, because the lines don't show up in the preview mode, it's only when you render that they show up. :(

    It's REALLY too bad too. Because this would be really cool for animations. I hope that it's something they can fix. That animation of the muscle guy took less than 10 minutes to render.

    Post edited by 3Diva on
  • prixatprixat Posts: 1,590

    Cute!

    However there are bad bugs that Filamernt has caused. I actually in my render settings lost the entire sections of 'Enviromental Settings' and 'Tone Mappings Settings'! Do NOT use Filament in the viewport or in the rending don't use 'Viewport' (really Filament) or you risk corrupting your scene duf file and get crashes of DS without crash dump files.

    I still like filament but it's not ready. Just test it on just scenes until it's fixed.

    I'm not sure that's filament causing that. It seems to be part of this new "showing those settings as Nodes in the scene pane", and accessing them via the parameters pane.

  • SevrinSevrin Posts: 6,309

    I'd like tone mapping settings for Filament to be separated from Iray's tone mapping.  I like having an additional preview option, but the requirements of Filament and Iray are so different that its usefulness for the purpose of previewing is limited.  I can live with emissives not working.  If it's not intended for previews, but as purely its own thing, it would be nice to know.

  • prixatprixat Posts: 1,590
    3Diva said:

    It's odd, because the lines don't show up in the preview mode, it's only when you render that they show up. :(

    It looks like it had to make the large resolution out of 4 renders and has added a vignette round each of those. Try a quick check of the vignette settings in Tonemapping.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,513
    3Diva said:

    It looks like it might not be suitable for animations - it renders dark "crosshair" type lines across the figures. It didn't show up in my other animations because my figures were "offset" from where they appear on the screen. They seem to only show up in certain spots. If the figure is off of those spots it's not noticeable. But BOY are they noticeable when the figure is on them:

    https://player.vimeo.com/video/468079602

    It's odd, because the lines don't show up in the preview mode, it's only when you render that they show up. :(

    It's REALLY too bad too. Because this would be really cool for animations. I hope that it's something they can fix. That animation of the muscle guy took less than 10 minutes to render.

    that was the artifacting I was seeing in my render surprise

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,724
    edited October 2020

    Ok, this is so weird. The LINES that Filament renders appear to be related to the size of your preview window.

    This window layout:

    ...results in these lines:

     

    Whereas this window layout (making the preview window as big as I can make it):

    ...results in just a single line across his face:

     

    Filament Render Test - DS Layout H - Screencap.png
    2493 x 1440 - 1M
    Filament Render Test - DS Layout H - Render.png
    2200 x 1800 - 4M
    Filament Render Test - DS Layout I - Screencap.png
    2495 x 1440 - 3M
    Filament Render Test - DS Layout I - Render.png
    2200 x 1800 - 4M
    Post edited by 3Diva on
  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,724
    prixat said:
    3Diva said:

    It's odd, because the lines don't show up in the preview mode, it's only when you render that they show up. :(

    It looks like it had to make the large resolution out of 4 renders and has added a vignette round each of those. Try a quick check of the vignette settings in Tonemapping.

    No, I checked, Vignetting is set to 0.

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,724
    3Diva said:

    It looks like it might not be suitable for animations - it renders dark "crosshair" type lines across the figures. It didn't show up in my other animations because my figures were "offset" from where they appear on the screen. They seem to only show up in certain spots. If the figure is off of those spots it's not noticeable. But BOY are they noticeable when the figure is on them:

    https://player.vimeo.com/video/468079602

    It's odd, because the lines don't show up in the preview mode, it's only when you render that they show up. :(

    It's REALLY too bad too. Because this would be really cool for animations. I hope that it's something they can fix. That animation of the muscle guy took less than 10 minutes to render.

    that was the artifacting I was seeing in my render surprise

    Yeah, it's so bizarre. It appears that the lines have some kind of relationship to the size of the preview window. It seems the smaller the preview window the more lines show up upon rendering.

  • UthgardUthgard Posts: 866

    So, with the new way of accessing the tone mapping options, do the already existing presets (like tonal rage) still work? Because if they don't, this will be a huge drawback.

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,724
    Uthgard said:

    So, with the new way of accessing the tone mapping options, do the already existing presets (like tonal rage) still work? Because if they don't, this will be a huge drawback.

    It appears you can get the old way of tone mapping back in the Render Settings Tab by switching back to the Iray Engine.

  • SevrinSevrin Posts: 6,309
    3Diva said:
    Uthgard said:

    So, with the new way of accessing the tone mapping options, do the already existing presets (like tonal rage) still work? Because if they don't, this will be a huge drawback.

    It appears you can get the old way of tone mapping back in the Render Settings Tab by switching back to the Iray Engine.

    I'm not clear what issue people are having with tone mapping.  I have the additional options in the Parameters tab, but I still have the same old Environment and Tone Mapping options in Render Settings, whether I'm in Filament or Iray or whatever.

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,724
    Sevrin said:
    3Diva said:
    Uthgard said:

    So, with the new way of accessing the tone mapping options, do the already existing presets (like tonal rage) still work? Because if they don't, this will be a huge drawback.

    It appears you can get the old way of tone mapping back in the Render Settings Tab by switching back to the Iray Engine.

    I'm not clear what issue people are having with tone mapping.  I have the additional options in the Parameters tab, but I still have the same old Environment and Tone Mapping options in Render Settings, whether I'm in Filament or Iray or whatever.

    In the Render Settings Tab if you switch to "Engine: Viewport" the Tone Mapping and Environment disappear, even if you're in NVIDIA Iray viewport mode in your preview window.

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,724
    edited October 2020

    Strangely the lines also appear to be related to the Render Size as well.

    These were all rendered with the same preview window size and layout.

     

    Render Size 1000x1000 (maybe a very faint line across his forehead?):

     

    Render Size 1400x1400:

     

    Render Size 1400x2000:

     

    Render Size 2000x2000:

     

    Filament Test - 1000 by 1000.png
    1000 x 1000 - 874K
    Filament Test - 1400 by 1400.png
    1400 x 1400 - 2M
    Filament Test - 1400 by 2000.png
    1400 x 2000 - 3M
    Filament Test - 2000 by 2000.png
    2000 x 2000 - 3M
    Post edited by 3Diva on
  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,513

    my Win 10 with the 980ti it barely touched my GPU but used half my RAM (15+ of 32GB)

    my Win 7 without a graphics card my intel graphics being used 88% again  my RAM(10GB of 16GB)

    and it is definitely faster on the integrated  intel graphics 

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,513
    3Diva said:

    Strangely the lines also appear to be related to the Render Size as well.

    These were all rendered with the same preview window size and layout.

     

    Render Size 1000x1000 (maybe a very faint line across his forehead?):

     

    Render Size 1400x1400:

     

    Render Size 1400x2000:

     

    Render Size 2000x2000:

     

    it might do what DAINapp does with larger sizes, split the image, but that overlaps them to avoid the joins

    the size of your VRAM may be a factor too

  • UthgardUthgard Posts: 866
    3Diva said:
    Uthgard said:

    So, with the new way of accessing the tone mapping options, do the already existing presets (like tonal rage) still work? Because if they don't, this will be a huge drawback.

    It appears you can get the old way of tone mapping back in the Render Settings Tab by switching back to the Iray Engine.

    Phew, that's a relief. Thanks for checking.

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,724
    3Diva said:

    Strangely the lines also appear to be related to the Render Size as well.

    These were all rendered with the same preview window size and layout.

     

    Render Size 1000x1000 (maybe a very faint line across his forehead?):

     

    Render Size 1400x1400:

     

    Render Size 1400x2000:

     

    Render Size 2000x2000:

     

    it might do what DAINapp does with larger sizes, split the image, but that overlaps them to avoid the joins

    the size of your VRAM may be a factor too

    Hmmm But that doesn't really seem to explain why the same sized render has more lines depending on the size of the preview window: https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/6106362/#Comment_6106362

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,513
    3Diva said:
    3Diva said:

    Strangely the lines also appear to be related to the Render Size as well.

    These were all rendered with the same preview window size and layout.

     

    Render Size 1000x1000 (maybe a very faint line across his forehead?):

     

    Render Size 1400x1400:

     

    Render Size 1400x2000:

     

    Render Size 2000x2000:

     

    it might do what DAINapp does with larger sizes, split the image, but that overlaps them to avoid the joins

    the size of your VRAM may be a factor too

    Hmmm But that doesn't really seem to explain why the same sized render has more lines depending on the size of the preview window: https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/6106362/#Comment_6106362

    I am running some tests now on my intel graphics on my Win7

    so far I am not seeing any lines there at all but will know for certain once it's done and animated

    am trying making preview window so small it disappears as well as full screen 

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,513
    edited October 2020

    mmm minimising it gets a line, full screen it doesn't so your viewport needs to match your render size by looks, interesting 

    Post edited by WendyLuvsCatz on
  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,724
    3Diva said:
    3Diva said:

    Strangely the lines also appear to be related to the Render Size as well.

    These were all rendered with the same preview window size and layout.

     

    Render Size 1000x1000 (maybe a very faint line across his forehead?):

     

    Render Size 1400x1400:

     

    Render Size 1400x2000:

     

    Render Size 2000x2000:

     

    it might do what DAINapp does with larger sizes, split the image, but that overlaps them to avoid the joins

    the size of your VRAM may be a factor too

    Hmmm But that doesn't really seem to explain why the same sized render has more lines depending on the size of the preview window: https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/6106362/#Comment_6106362

    I am running some tests now on my intel graphics on my Win7

    so far I am not seeing any lines there at all but will know for certain once it's done and animated

    am trying making preview window so small it disappears as well as full screen 

    Cool. I look forward to seeing your results. :)

     

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,724
    edited October 2020

    mmm minimising it gets a line, full screen it doesn't so your viewport needs to match your render size by looks, interesting 

    Oh my goodness, I think you've solved it! Full Screen Mode rendered it without any lines!

    So it appears that as long as your Viewport Window is larger than (or around the same size as) your Render Size, there are no lines?

    Filament Test Render - 2200x1400 - Shift F11 Full Screen Mode.png
    2200 x 1400 - 3M
    Post edited by 3Diva on
  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,513

    yes

  • 3Diva3Diva Posts: 11,724

    I rerendered the muscle man animation in full screen mode and NO MORE LINES! Yay! Thank you for discovering that @WendyLuvesCatz ! :)

    https://player.vimeo.com/video/468139470

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,513

    he's a bit naughty with that finger kiss

Sign In or Register to comment.