Announcing The Platinum Club Plus [Beta] Program
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Seems you are comparing the apparent model complexity against the price to determine the profit potential. As said above you need to compare EULA to determine value not just the complexity. Furthermore other crucial variables need to determine sales & profit viability- over how much time, merchandise visibility (traffic to store), search-ability and need is helpful. A 1.99 BBQ Grill may make more profits than an exotic, highly detailed or complex set may because it is needed in more scenes, and conveniently accessible not to mention price competitiveness. In general items that are in high demand will earn more profits when priced competitively, and those lower demand should have a higher price so the few sales they garner cover more cost. The reason this makes sense is because popular theme products will be more likely to have competition from clones in the 3d digital marketplace, while obscure items _will_ sell once the rare need occurs, but it takes time or broader base. This is why it makes no sense to rush the market for profits and worry about the all mighty launch offering. Its what it cost to make, and what it will earn over its product lifecyce. In 3d digital ip, that's a looooong lifespan.
Its ONLY use license terms you are purchasing when buying 3d figures & props in the PC, you do not get ownership of the virtual object, just rights to use it under the EULA Its likely the 3d product you see at TurboSquid may have a more permissive EULA or have some limit of distribution or exclusivity. Many of the TurboSquid products are priced for licensing with commercial 3d publishing (like in 3d video games) included. Complexity of the product excluded, if you do not compare EULA terms, then its an "apples vs oranges" comparison.
I concur with the "apples vs oranges" argument, but the example was just to help create a sense of perspective. I don't want to get into semantics, but perhaps my stock photography point was more relevant in this instance. Sure, the photographer retains rights to their image, but the licence grants the customer commercial use. Again, it's not uncommon for a single high-res image to sell for over $1000. Most activities are expensive for hobbyists, but many people use Daz as part of a professional practice.
Exclusivity with that photo right?
Sure - it could be expensive for hobbyists, but that's the middle belt in the pyramid. Companies like E-On try to split the market (Pro & Artist) to go after both ends of the spectrum. A lot of modelers (me incl) give away or sell their stuff because the opportunity exists, others make a living from it. I also dig for gold in the deserts nearby. Make a few nuggets here and there, but I would have to change my ways of mining if I wanted to live off the activity. Same goes for 3d modeling, texturing and rigging figures. You can do it for yourself, relieve some cost to the hobby or make a biz plan to compete with the big boys. What ever your goal, your going to optimize your approach to what suits the objective.
Back to the issue at hand - The PC and how to best way to acquire, package, merchandise, and price DO's through it.
I think the BOTTOM layer of the pyramid is what will make the store hugely successful.
Those arguing about value and price need to be aware that this is slippery ground to justify price increases. Right now I can buy a Fast Grab 70% discount item, 'Pure Hair: Sleek', with one texture for $6.59. At another content provider right now there's a whole kitchen scene with props at 50% discount for $5.72. Now either the kitchen scene developer has lost the plot and is making no profit or alternatively the hair product is still priced too high even at 70% off. Why would anyone sell models if they couldn't turn a profit? If a whole scene can still make a profit at $12 then a hair item costing $22 is overpriced imo. That is the competition DAZ is facing. Sticking heads in the sand or putting fingers in ears and making noises so as not to face these facts isn't going to convince those of us who are experiencing the price of content falling across the board.
Now compare that kitchen scene to a scene that say, Stonemason has done, and you'll see a significant difference. Whereas Stonemason's are extremely detailed and textured, etc., I would say this kitchen scene is not so detailed. I'm not saying the kitchen scene is a bad product or that it is sub par, I'm just saying look at the difference and you'll see why Stonemason products run much higher in price. As for hair, again it depends on the vendor and the details, textures, etc., that they put into it. You can't judge the worth of a product by how much it costs. You judge it by how much it means to you, the person buying it. Sorry but your examples are not good ones. Also, keep in mind that some products are bought out right by the 3D sights, and some others are just hosted. PAs have no control over how pricing is done after their product is purchased by DAZ or other sites.
Your comparison isn't a good one because as you say Stonemason's scenes are much more highly detailed than virtually all developers for DAZ/Poser except perhaps Jack Tomlin and cost almost four times more than the kitchen scene. But the hair example I gave isn't more complex than the kitchen scene which renders very well in Octane Render and is less than half the price of the hair. If it's not possible to compare such items then the whole argument that content costs more now to develop than it did a couple of years ago is meaningless. What criteria is being used to make these assumption then? I bet the kitchen scene took far longer to create than the hair. By what measure is the hair better quality than the kitchen scene? Yet the kitchen scene is half the price! Look around the content providers and prices are going down not up.
Judging products by what they mean to me would be great - I value fur coats far less than wool ones yet I doubt I could walk into Harrods and buy a fur coat for my preferred price which would be zilch. So your argument that products are worth what they mean to the purchaser has nothing to do with how they are priced or what they're worth in the content market. The only way to value content is to compare it with other content which is what I've done. These commercial products don't fall in the category of works of art which are assigned value in a completely different and arbitrary way. 3D content is more baked beans than Warhol pop art. Sorry if that deflates a few egos but that's how 3D models are perceived by the market.
Once the initial development of content has been completed then only distribution costs and a very small amount of updating are left - every copy sold is a duplicate of the initial one and costs nothing to reproduce. Unlike art which is usually a one off, every item of content is an exact duplicate - develop it once, sell it by the truck load. Even baked beans require reinvestment in beans, sauce and tins but content requires no investment in physical resources apart from the initial outlay and the distribution costs.
Ok, I'm done here. Back to posting statuses.
:blank:
My two cents worth: after my first week in Platinum Plus, I am very satisfied with it. There wasn't anything I really needed in the recent Platinum Club offerings, but the 30% off two Stonemason and a RawArt item would more than make up the extra I would have paid for the new platinum products if I had decided to buy them.
Plus I just picked up three old PC items with my $6 coupon for a total cost to me of $1.05. There was much more to chose from since PC items were eligible, not just Daz Originals, so it wasn't nearly the chore it usually is to spend the money at the end of the month!
Finally, I bought a 3D Universe product for a steal using the $6 PA coupon--nearly 66% off after all of the stacking and coupons!
I am sure there will be times that I mourn for the old PC $1.99 price, but for me the PA discounts more than make up for it.
I ended up with a lot of content that I would not have purchased otherwise, which is good for Daz and the PAs, and I am very happy.
Hey - I am really impressed with the past 2 dozen posts or so. This is precisely the type of perspective that will generate ideas to benefit the club: members and store. We need a healthy store to be able support a great PC. We understand the PC is a promotional tool used enhance store sales, however the cost of the program is subsidized by money from the sales of DAZ Original assets and our membership fees. We also recognize The DAZ 3D store help makes the PA's successful by providing the best digital 3d product merchandising and market visibility and that benefit comes at cost to the PA in each sale brokered.
These past few posts get to the heart of the issue, and shows how we all want a better program - not at the expense of the members, PA's or DAZ. Because members are asking for PC benefits to include PA' products the PC + Beta was conceived. Just as the PC leverages profits from DAZ Originals to help fund operations the PC + program is (probably) subsidized by the participating PA's. That subsidize cost puts more pressure on sales volumes but if the market growth is not sufficient, the tendency will be to drive future sales with even more costly discounts and promos.
Now we recognize the key is to bring in more users, the ones who do not see a need and then the ones that think that 3d is out of reach. Not by discounting and giving away all the 3d stuff we cherish - that devalues everything and drives the store into a death spiral. ..
V6 for free today... ok. PA's win. But at the expense of DO - who is going to pop for the V7 when she arrives?.GIVE it away when EVERYBODY NEEDS IT* and there is competition and there are greater revenue potential in its use to capitalize on. They would not have given away DOOM level 1 if did not know EVERYONE under 29 that had access would want to play with it. Otherwise you blow your investment before maximum opportunity exists.
Concerning third party compatibility, the sdk hasn't been updated for two years! With each update of DAZ there isn't complete documentation about what's been updated so 3rd party developers (such as the Octane Render) have to guess what to fix. If the plan is to reach out beyond regular customers then that has to improve.
Its HERE... Affordable VR for the Planet! https://developers.google.com/cardboard/
V OK, Pardon the diversion. v
Please can you bring the discussion back to the topic of the thread. Thankyou
I went ahead and converted over to the PC+ program, figuring I ought to be fair and give it a try (an easy enough decision, since it guarantees converting me back to the original PC plan at the end of the beta period).
My first impression is that PC+ seems to be geared towards people willing to spend a lot more money each month than I'm going to be able to afford for the foreseeable future. (I could almost see it as a corporate account for a small studio.) Some great deals if you can afford to take advantage of them -- I just don't see how I can at the moment, tho'.
The jump in PC item prices was also a bit of a shock: $1.99 items shot up to anywhere between $3-$3.5 and $5.50 or so. That's probably a more sensible price range for these items, given the amount of work that went into them, but I still had quite a few PC items on my wish-list to eventually pick up, and doing so under the PC+ plan would increase my cost by at least 50% to 125% or more.
The coupons are a definite plus.
I could see DAZ offering a two-tiered PC plan: PC Basic, which is pretty much what we've been using up to this point, and PC Plus, which is what this new plan seems to be.
My suggestions:
1. Eliminate the Value category, merge its contents into the PC category, and price everything at $2.99~$3.50.
2. PC Basic
* PC Basic discount of 30%.
* Extend the monthly coupon to include non-new PC items.
3. PC Plus
* PC+ discount of 35~40%.
* Extend the monthly coupon to include ALL PC items (new or not).
Price the two plans accordingly.
Exactly, let alone the fact that we actually dropped the sign-up fee too..!
Wasn't that mostly to draw in new members to replace the ones that left in a huff over the last batch of improvements? I'd not that there is a minimum 3 month membership now that you've removed the sign-up fee.
Not necessarily complainin', just mentioning things.:-)
Very well said and almost exactly my feelings.
Your point on what/who the PC+ program seems to be is geared toward is spot on.
I'm not going to flame the PC+ program.
1) it is a Beta program, 2) its not for me
I can see a value in the PC+ program. Its just not in my budget to be in it.
In July, I will happily convert back to the basic plan and continue on as normal.
So I finally got around to opting in to the beta, much later than planned but haven't much time too, is there a bug in Jack's store, all or close to all the pc items are 79% off not just the new ones.
OK, I got into the Beta too (not going to buy new PC items for sure this month), that was one freebie too much to pass up.
dkgoose:
http://www.daz3d.com/aslan-court-3
70%
Wooo Hoooo!!!!
Dx30 is participating in PC+
Now I just need this Pump Up promotion to last through Saturday (payday), and Genesis and Genesis 2 Female are going shoe shopping!!!!!
OK,some feedback.
I looked at the new releases and saw a nice pair of shoes for G2,great,nice price (same price logged in or out).
If I bought the shoes I would get 30% off selected PA stores,great,Jack Tomalin,extra great.
I thought I do an experiment and selected a a bunch of Platinum items.....great.
I filled my cart with enough items so I could also use the $18 voucher...great.
As these are old Platinum items maybe I could also use that other $6.00 voucher too...great.
The $6.00 voucher however did not stack,would not apply..........the 30% discount I got from buying the newly released item,together with the $18.00 cart voucher ($6.00) discount (which worked) resulted in everything being exactly the same price as buying the items via the old Plat membership.
So to conclude,I bought a new item and filled my cart ($18 plus worth) in order to take advantage of the max discount and ended up saving absolutely nothing...????
Maybe I did some thing wrong,maybe some thing doesn't work,maybe I'm just too stupid.....I don't know,so I cancelled the whole cart and spent the voucher on a free Plat item before it ran out. This is not fun.
As far as I know you can only apply one coupon per cart.
As far as I know you can only apply one coupon per cart.
Seems that way but the point is,buying a new item gives you 30% off a selected vendors stores,using either voucher on top of the discount results in the saving of...... nothing (in this case),when compared to the old system.I don't even have to be a plat member to get the new item mentioned at the price its offered at.
PC items don't count towards the $18 rule, if I remember correctly. It was said a couple of pages back in this thread.
Seems that way but the point is,buying a new item gives you 30% off a selected vendors stores,using either voucher on top of the discount results in the saving of...... nothing (in this case),when compared to the old system.I don't even have to be a plat member to get the new item mentioned at the price its offered at.
Erm, that is stacking. Buying one item gives you 30% off of 30% or 51 % off. Buying three gives you a total of 65% off (50% off of 30%). If you have the cash, this is the time to stock up.
I think you're missing something, though I'm having trouble pointing at exactly what.
The coupons don't stack. Never have.
The No-Minimum coupon is best spent exactly as you did.
The $18 minimum coupon is best used on PA items. Preferably PA's who are part of PC+. I used my June cart, so my math may be a little off, but provided that the Pumped up sale lasts, I'll be spending $22.21 after my I use the $18 Minimum coupon, with 1 pair of shoes at $6.27 (the new ones that are one of the qualifying Pumped Up sale), and 5 more at what will average out to a little more than $3 per pair ($22 (roughly) before the coupon is applied, roughly $16 after)
Without PC+, that same cart would cost me (provided I did my math right) $34.60
Yes, PC items will cost us more, or at least not less, than they do currently. That part was fairly clear to me from day one. But the coupons weren't applicable to PC items *at all* before, and now we have a second one that we can use on PA items as well (or Daz O's that cost over $18... like most character bundles.)
Was there another PC+ freebie but the Weazel ? Just asking..
Was there another PC+ freebie but the Weazel ? Just asking..
Yes, 'Wine Me' is free for a limited time http://www.daz3d.com/wine-me
On a different note,
Zev0 & DraagonStorms Skinbuilder Pro (http://www.daz3d.com/skin-builder-for-genesis-and-genesis2-female-s) is not showing the 'Pumped Up' discount despite not being flagged as New, but does show the 30% PC+ discount.
Thanks, I just missed the small promo image about that.
Yes, 'Wine Me' is free for a limited time http://www.daz3d.com/wine-me
On a different note,
Zev0 & DraagonStorms Skinbuilder Pro (http://www.daz3d.com/skin-builder-for-genesis-and-genesis2-female-s) is not showing the 'Pumped Up' discount despite not being flagged as New, but does show the 30% PC+ discount.
Skin Builder products were new up until yesterday so when we built the list of exclusions for the sale (on Friday) they fit the criteria. Since they are no longer new I have included them in the sale.
Yes, 'Wine Me' is free for a limited time http://www.daz3d.com/wine-me
On a different note,
Zev0 & DraagonStorms Skinbuilder Pro (http://www.daz3d.com/skin-builder-for-genesis-and-genesis2-female-s) is not showing the 'Pumped Up' discount despite not being flagged as New, but does show the 30% PC+ discount.
Skin Builder products were new up until yesterday so when we built the list of exclusions for the sale (on Friday) they fit the criteria. Since they are no longer new I have included them in the sale.
Thanks, now showing the extra discount :)
Both free items I already bought at previous purchase. Bummer. But I am a pc+ member now, not sure why though.
All PC items were Jack tomalin items,who is part of the present PC+ vendor lineup and the $18 cart coupon actually worked.
Just converted my account and got JULY coupons and not JUNE. SHould have waited til; next week and got an extra July coupon, so I'm less than 30 seconds into trying PC Plus and already feeling burned.