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OK, thanks @PerttiA and @Wonderland !
My best guess remains that Daz did not want PAs creating characters for G8.1 to have to support corrective morphs for both sets of expression controls, as would have had to have been the case if those controls were officially supported.
(Also, as noted, there is a minor conflict between the sets, as both sets have controls labelled "Mouth Smile" and "Mouth Frown" that will merge into one slider on default DS settings, although that is not fundamentally something that had to be an issue and can be resolved by editing the files to change the labels, which should not affect presets, as those use the internal naming to set their values).
Nothing. Your 8 content is still there and won't be modified (at least for the content from starter essentials).
OK, thanks - I think I saw posts from people who had some things mixed up but maybe that was with Victoria 8.1.
then LIE shouldn't be so colorful
Create another layer above the tattoo layer. Copy and paste the skin layer to the new layer and adjust the opicity to 5-10%, now LIE isn't so colorful.
And what about the "smudge" effect that happens to maps in the translucency channel? Is there none of it going on in the spectral mode when you need to use 100% translucency?
On the other hand... The way they did it is interesting, maybe giving the user too a way to block G8 morphs from loading on G8.1 - You don't want/need the BimboBumpers on G8.1, just write a similar placeholder file in the corresponding G8.1 morphfolder and it doesn't load.
I have not tested this, but I think the same rules would be followed.
Just playing around with the PBRSkin and it occurs to me that one way of making the over-bright tattoos look (and act) more like the real thing is not to place them above the skin like paint but perhaps include them in the Translucency Color channel - use the LIE to add the tattoo image to the body part that's already used in that channel, perhaps dial down the opacity a bit and it seems to produce an effect when rendered that is more faded and 'under the skin' rather than on top of it. This might warrant some further exploration...
So nice to finally have realistic eyes, thank you Daz! V8.1 HD with some morph mixing.
Just a summary of what others have said:
Using G8 geoshell based clothing on G8.1 likely requires G8 (source) figure and G8.1 (target) figure side-by-side. UVs are not relevant in this case: both geoshells can use the Base Female UV. Surfaces are the issue and, provided you use Base Female UV on the geoshell, and with the G8 figure’s geoshell having a ‘torso’ surface and G8.1 figure’s geoshell having a ‘body’ and ‘head’ surface, you can copy and paste ‘torso’ surface to ‘body’ and ‘neck’ surfaces. This works equally well using G3 geoshell based clothing on G8 or G8.1. For geoshell based clothing this is simple, repeatable and reliable. Not quick (if you have many styles/MATs for each product and many products. . . ).
These later facts might point to an opportunity for automation but that would be beyond me. BTW the body suit is G8 geoshell on G8 and G8.1 and the bottom bruises are G3 geoshell on G8 and G8.1.
Thanks so much for this. Appreciate it. I have used the 'trick' of changing the ID and preferred base to overcome the 'won't install' problem in a trial case (so that needs to be checked more broadly perhaps) and have found an instance where the MAT copy script was not encrypted and at least in that case can confirm what you suggest above that a manual copy paste will work/is equivalent (provided shaders match). It is more complicated with the PBRskin as it doesn't have all the same channels so some layers (shells) will end up with different shaders and UVs: not unheard of.
You mention the new DAZ G8F addon - is this with V8.1.
Thanks again.
Nope as the SSS effect in the spectral-mode is muted due to it being based on real-world lighting, plus I use both a customized default SSS that uses the chromatic channel instead of mono such as with the default old default iray uber shader...
Here are some renders I did to compare the default Uber shaders with my own with spec rendering on and off, note: I replaced the default SSS maps with the diffuse mats and changed the translucency color to white so you can better see the underlying texture, I left the arms/legs at the default for comparison...
I also turned the translucency down to 0.25% for use when the spec rendering mode is turned off, also note that you can add color to the diffuse and translucency setting to make the character darker, see my second to last portrait pic!
Also, lastly, my SSS shaders that were based on this guide!
EDIT: My mistake, I posted the wrong custom setting!
EDIT 2 STUPID FORUM DELETED MY PICS WHEN EDITING!
Old morphs from genesis 8 works amazing on 8.1,only thing that dont work are 3rd party genitals,products like Golden Palace and New Genitalia for V8,does anyone have luck with this,applying it to G 8.1 figure?
What happens if you first load those to G8.0, load the G8.1 and move them over (Fit to G8.1) after you have applied the G8.0 materials to G8.1 first?
Yes, now I see that there are duplicates of many like Eyes Squint vs Eye Squint.. Next time I open G8 I'll screenshot the G8 controllers to see which ones are for it and not G.81 They could have labeled things Eye Squint 2.0 or something though.
A couple of quickly thrown-together renders using base G8.1 but with V8.1 skin and tattoos applied. The only difference is that in the second after applying the tattoos I have used the Layered Image Editor to strip them out of the Diffuse channel - I hadn't realised but when you apply these tattoos from the materials menu it also adds them to the map in the Translucency Color channel, so I didn't need to add anything else. The result is more faded inking - closer to the real thing, I think - than the default and obviously can be further adjusted either by changing opacity in the LIE or the translucency strength (although that will also affect overall skin tone as well).
What are we missing?, maybe we are overthinking how humans must be rendered.
I'd love to see your reaction to a human that actually didn't have SSS and specular. These photos have all of that, I assure you
Ok, this time I think I'm using only the new controllers, but there's a learning curve to get the look you want. I think this is like my 15th try and with G8 I could do expressions I like in a few minutes. Still on the fence about the benefits of G8.1 but I'll still try experimenting to see if it's worth switching. Does this look OK? I can't even tell anymore LOL.
Because there are artists that want to actually create their own pores, wrinkles, and vellus hair and photography/renders do show that as well as stylized renders, the examples you gave are from a cheap camera shot far away... if artists didn't strive for realism we'd still be rendering with posette, or stick with naked Vicky in a temple!
If you want to create stylistic art that's absolutely fine and great as that really shows the effort and freedom of creating much more than realism, which mimics real life, I started out and still draw stylized art, but to stifle those striving for realism in the place of stylistic art alone is not what this industry is about, it's about artists striving for realism, and also for highly detailed stylized art!
There is plenty of enough room for both realistic and stylized artists alike!
Well I'm impressed. Overall there are huge improvements.Have you check out her teeth? This 8.1 is something to be grateful for...
No, it's an update to the G8M anatomical elements pseudo-product. If you have that product the update will include a new geograft which will apply to G8F Basic Female. It doesn't show up in Smart Content Anatomy/External for a G8F; it seems to be marked as G8.1F specific, but it does seem to apply just fine. I assume there will be a similar update to the G8F anatomical elements when G8.1M appears. The "MAT copy" approach doesn't work with the new add-on because it has a single surface; for the MAT copy to work there have to be one or more surfaces designed to place the copied torso (or body) texture maps in the right place.
Those were not my examples. My response was to someone who said if you don't use total realism with pores and vellus hair you are "wrong." Of course all shaders are good, even for non-realistic renders.
I guess because I've done work touching up actual photos to remove wrinkles and pores and skin imperfections. And professional photographers usually try to minimize that unless they are papparazzi trying to purposely make someone look unattractive. Most people find it unflattering. I've never even actually seen a woman with vellus hair on her nose... I suppose it depends on whether your goal is to make characters attractive or not. I guess I was thinking commercially, where it's the norm to make people look attractive or for artists who just use renders as a base for something like comic books, book covers, movie posters, children's art or wall art. In those cases, pores, vellus hair are not needed. The OP made it sound like there is no use for unrealistic renders at all.I still like V4 a lot and the MANY expressions and morphs I've collected for her face (mostly from Rendo). Although she is in most cases not as realistic as G8, her face is still good for beauty images not meant to be photoreal.I've had art I created with V4 in art galleries and magazines.I am working on more photoreal images now as well, but more beauty oriented which does not require pores and vellus hair. The OP literally insulted me because I don't use that kind of realism.
Looks like an improvement. Can you please post the surface settings you used on the eye surfaces?
I have a question. In the 8.1 page, the new "skin hair" is advertised. Exactly where is this? Even tough I apply PBR Skin shader manually to G8.1 skin, nothing there. Is it enabled somewhere or?
I believe the vellus hair is only included in V8.1 not G8.1
Oops my mistake, I was quoting/snipped the wrong post...
As for insulting you for not using realism exclusively, that is the antithesis of being an artist... forget that guy, as I've said, there's enough room in our hobby to go both routes, realistic and/or stylized, and anyone that spurns other artists due to taking either route cannot rightfully call themselves an artist!
It seems to be a pseudo-product like the anatomical elements; here is the "Description" from the product library page:
It's in the "University" bundle, as that comment implies, but it is also listed as part of the bare Victoria 8.1 product. It consists of "all", "body" and "face" wearables which load specific hairs for "Abdominal" (zip line down the front), "Sacral" (zip line down the back), then on the head "cheeks", "ears", "mouth" and "nose". If it were exactly like the anatomical elements there would be one vellus hair set for G8F, one for G8M and then each skin author will have to provide materials however the vellus hair doesn't have the geograft seam issues of the anatomical elements and the F product does ship with a range of MATs - "default", "more natural" and "whiter".
I know that, I've made a reference in how we trying to emulate so much than in real life is not so visible or important.