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Ok, So this is Gen 9

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  • Ghosty12Ghosty12 Posts: 2,065

    I was playing around with the base last night, I had one G9 figure with the base texture, base clothing and the base hair and I saw that GPU-Z was reporting 5 Gig of vram was being used. Even turning down the figure render resolution did not do much, so could get interesting for multiple figure scenes.

  • richardandtracyrichardandtracy Posts: 5,866
    Richard Haseltine said:

    FSMCDesigns said:

    PerttiA said:

    Works fine on DS 4.15 

    Thanks for this. I like my 4.15 version and have no interest in moving to the newer versions, but wanted to check out genesis 9

    It will not work as designed, however, so don't complain if you use an older DS and get failures. You could always use the Public Build for Genesis 9 etc. without disturbing the general release 4.15

    Not true in my case. I have the release version of 4.21 alongside 4.15. 4.21 will not render in iRay on my hardware. Cannot ever render. I have the latest Nvidia drivers for my Win7/GTX1060 machine and 4.15 is the newest version that's fully supported. There do appear to be extra things attached to 4.21 to ease the use of G9, but given the total absence of adequate documentation, I'd speculate that the majority of hobby users will either miss them completely or not use them to their full extent, and effectively be in the same position as someone using 4.15 anyway.

  • xyer0xyer0 Posts: 6,018

    PerttiA said:

    Poses were said to be better, but loading the "G9 Base Pose 02 Stretching G9F" left me wondering if that's the way she's supposed to bend...

    Take a look at her elbow bend. Haven't seen that since Poser days.

     

     
  • xyer0xyer0 Posts: 6,018

    Pendraia said:

    The basic female shape is also way more muscular looking than the original genesis iirc.

    And basic male shape is way more womanly than the original Genesis. Sounds about right? 

  • AllenArtAllenArt Posts: 7,169

    xyer0 said:

    Pendraia said:

    The basic female shape is also way more muscular looking than the original genesis iirc.

    And basic male shape is way more womanly than the original Genesis. Sounds about right? 

    Try turning off parameters and dialing past 1.00 ;). Helps a little, with the head too. 

  • scorpioscorpio Posts: 8,469

    Daywalker Designs said:

    ...and the default female standing/walking poses mostly being set up for high heels.

    So are the base male ones they haven't actually bothered to redo the base poses for a male, if this is any indication of what is to come from PA's no attention to the male figure a all, G9 is a total waste of time for me. You would have thought the PAs would realise that poses for a female do not transfer to a male without alterations; men and women, as a rule stand ect differently and few men stand round on their toes with arched backs and their bums sticking out.

  • maikdeckermaikdecker Posts: 2,752

    scorpio said:

    Daywalker Designs said:

    ...and the default female standing/walking poses mostly being set up for high heels.

    So are the base male ones they haven't actually bothered to redo the base poses for a male, if this is any indication of what is to come from PA's no attention to the male figure a all, G9 is a total waste of time for me. You would have thought the PAs would realise that poses for a female do not transfer to a male without alterations; men and women, as a rule stand ect differently and few men stand round on their toes with arched backs and their bums sticking out.

    From a commercial standpoint (sic!) it would be better to ignore reality and facts and just make one set of poses to fit them all... a lot more cost efficient that is. And it avoids gendering the personalities of your G9 figures against their will. devil

  • TobiasTobias Posts: 109

    scorpio said:

    Daywalker Designs said:

    ...and the default female standing/walking poses mostly being set up for high heels.

    So are the base male ones they haven't actually bothered to redo the base poses for a male, if this is any indication of what is to come from PA's no attention to the male figure a all, G9 is a total waste of time for me. You would have thought the PAs would realise that poses for a female do not transfer to a male without alterations; men and women, as a rule stand ect differently and few men stand round on their toes with arched backs and their bums sticking out.

    This, more than anything else.  I am used to not getting a lot of male content and understand the reasons why that is.  The pose thing actually made me a bit angry. It felt like they are giving the middle finger to anyone who wants to render male characters. 

    Also, lets be honest, there aren't a whole lot of women who stand around that way either.

  • MelissaGTMelissaGT Posts: 2,611

    xyer0 said:

    PerttiA said:

    Poses were said to be better, but loading the "G9 Base Pose 02 Stretching G9F" left me wondering if that's the way she's supposed to bend...

    Take a look at her elbow bend. Haven't seen that since Poser days.

     

     

    My biggest gripe about G9 so far. The head/face/eyes/lips is gorgeous...the rest of the body is...oofta. 

  • TynkereTynkere Posts: 834

    Yes without body morphs, had to resort to scaling pectorals-- looks like G9F is wearing a sport bra.  Shoulders look a little buff too-- like she's on the swim team.  

    G9M just looks odd.  A matter of taste I guess.  Out of the box, he looks sort of androgynous imo.

    Hopefully body morphs-- body habitus, fitness details, waist, chest, etc. will solve most issues.

    ---

    PS: I hadn't zeroed in on elbows, but now that it's been mentioned. : O !  Nice render though.  She looks much better than my attempts at scaling and tweaking what few morphs "essentials" have given us so far.  : )

  • CHWTCHWT Posts: 1,183
    edited October 2022
    The wrists!
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    Post edited by CHWT on
  • digitelldigitell Posts: 577

    I think with the morphs and some good character sets, G9 can make a great looking male. I renedered this and I kept looking at his face and thought he looks

    familar..I kept thinking of a paticular actor and it dawned on me. He looks kinda sorta like a younger Jerffery Donovan from Burn Notice!

    This is G9 Male dialed in head and body with the provided G9 male skin. The provided basic pixie hair. Clothing is DeNimes Outfit for G8 Male. Autofit worked perfectly.

    Donovan.jpg
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  • CHWTCHWT Posts: 1,183
    digitell said:

    I think with the morphs and some good character sets, G9 can make a great looking male. I renedered this and I kept looking at his face and thought he looks

    familar..I kept thinking of a paticular actor and it dawned on me. He looks kinda sorta like a younger Jerffery Donovan from Burn Notice!

    This is G9 Male dialed in head and body with the provided G9 male skin. The provided basic pixie hair. Clothing is DeNimes Outfit for G8 Male. Autofit worked perfectly.

    Nice render! I like G9's eyes (which makes closeup renders fantastic for sure), but I always find the wrists and knees a bit off, which I really can't overlook... maybe the shape/size of the wrist/knee bones when the wrists/knees bend?
  • benniewoodellbenniewoodell Posts: 1,982

    CHWT said:

    The wrists!

    Yeah, that looks wonky. When I opened up the base G9 to see what they "fixed" for animation and posing, I saw there were separate twists for the upper and lower shoulder and forearms and I thought to myself who can twist that way? The joints were fine before but now things are starting to look really messed up. They can "fix" that, but they can't do a thing to make IK work where if I'm doing a walk cycle, the feet and thighs don't move all over the place like the character is balancing on ice when I move the hips to make the second contact pose. 

  • 3DRT3DRT Posts: 62

    Tynkere said:

    Yes without body morphs, had to resort to scaling pectorals-- looks like G9F is wearing a sport bra.  Shoulders look a little buff too-- like she's on the swim team.  

    G9M just looks odd.  A matter of taste I guess.  Out of the box, he looks sort of androgynous imo.

    Hopefully body morphs-- body habitus, fitness details, waist, chest, etc. will solve most issues.

    ---

    PS: I hadn't zeroed in on elbows, but now that it's been mentioned. : O !  Nice render though.  She looks much better than my attempts at scaling and tweaking what few morphs "essentials" have given us so far.  : )

    G9M definitely has more androgynous features compared to G8M. I attached a quick render and it's quite noticeable in the shoulders and especially the chest area. Even the face looks 'softer' in comparison. I think it's still possible to create very masculine characters from this base, it would just take a bit more extra work on the part of the sculptor. 

    g8m_g9m02.jpg
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  • remcovanembdenremcovanembden Posts: 106

    I think you can morph/model every shape you want with every mesh. You just have to have a bit of patience. It are only polygons after all. This took my like15 minutes in Zbrush.

    James.jpg
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  • beregarberegar Posts: 269
    edited October 2022

    3DRT said:

    G9M definitely has more androgynous features compared to G8M. I attached a quick render and it's quite noticeable in the shoulders and especially the chest area. Even the face looks 'softer' in comparison. I think it's still possible to create very masculine characters from this base, it would just take a bit more extra work on the part of the sculptor. 

    It looks to me like G8M is more fit and has overall more muscle tone than the G9M shape rather than being particularly more masculine (unless you mean to say that having muscle/fit body is a necessity to be masculine in which case many men fail at that). The G9M definitely has softer features and more pronounced chest area and the face gives vaguely more androgynous vibe to me, so I think can see your point there. For the body shape I'd say it's more a difference between a person with more fat vs person with less fat. Not that I think G9M looks particularly overweight, just soft. Overall the G8M character is more thin because he is proportioned more like a tall athlete.

    I have also seen the reverse complaint saying that the G9F basic shape (and even Victoria) is too masculine.

    Anyhow. I don't think the base male is meant to be end all and Michael 9 will likely have more traditionally masculine shape. On a positive note it should be easier for content creators to create less fit male characters now. A lot of G8 males on the more, ahem, robust side... had visible abs even with big bellies. I didn't see too many "triangle" or "oval" shaped bodies for G8M that didn't face this issue.

    I'm not sure I notice the shoulder thing unless you mean that the G9M shoulders seem to be hanging lower and aren't as defined?

    Edit: Is the shoulders thing more because he doesn't have pronounce deltoids (edit2: wrote traps when I meant deltoids)? Unlike in remcovanembden's image.

    Post edited by beregar on
  • remcovanembdenremcovanembden Posts: 106

     

     

    beregar said:

    3DRT said:

    G9M definitely has more androgynous features compared to G8M. I attached a quick render and it's quite noticeable in the shoulders and especially the chest area. Even the face looks 'softer' in comparison. I think it's still possible to create very masculine characters from this base, it would just take a bit more extra work on the part of the sculptor. 

    It looks to me like G8M is more fit and has overall more muscle tone than the G9M shape rather than being particularly more masculine (unless you mean to say that having muscle/fit body is a necessity to be masculine in which case many men fail at that). The G9M definitely has softer features and more pronounced chest area and the face gives vaguely more androgynous vibe to me, so I think can see your point there. For the body shape I'd say it's more a difference between a person with more fat vs person with less fat. Not that I think G9M looks particularly overweight, just soft. Overall the G8M character is more thin because he is proportioned more like a tall athlete.

    I have also seen the reverse complaint saying that the G9F basic shape (and even Victoria) is too masculine.

    Anyhow. I don't think the base male is meant to be end all and Michael 9 will likely have more traditionally masculine shape. On a positive note it should be easier for content creators to create less fit male characters now. A lot of G8 males on the more, ahem, robust side... had visible abs even with big bellies. I didn't see too many "triangle" or "oval" shaped bodies for G8M that didn't face this issue.

    I'm not sure I notice the shoulder thing unless you mean that the G9M shoulders seem to be hanging lower and aren't as defined?

    Edit: Is the shoulders thing more because he doesn't have pronounce deltoids (edit2: wrote traps when I meant deltoids)? Unlike in remcovanembden's image.

     

    Yes, but because the body is so bland, you can shape it into anything. Like you said, overweight people, pronounced bellies etc are much easier to create withouth smoothing out every ab there is on the body.

  • TynkereTynkere Posts: 834
    edited October 2022

    Still on the fence, but after seeing "Digitell's" render, males don't look quite so "cylon imitation human" or whatever.  Smooth youthful skin sort of reminds me of "Lucas 8"

    We've talked wrists & elbows.  Call me odd but one of the first things I noticed was the lack of detail for the vaunted HD belly button.  (Why bother to encrypt a belly button morph?  Seriously.  Is there some reason for it?)   

    Anyway, the following is a silly render meant for testing and very small audience, but what they hey.  Provides side by side comparision with a customized V8/FSWA Elizabeth and RY Steve.  It's sort of poking fun at G9F's buff looking athletic shoulders (swim team) then of course they compare HD bellybuttons.



    Will continue to have an open mind about G9.  I'm sure PAs will eventually give us quality male & female characters, face & body moprphs, etc.

    Best wishes & happy rendering 

    G9Compare.png
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    Post edited by Tynkere on
  • CHWTCHWT Posts: 1,183
    Tynkere said:

    Still on the fence, but after seeing "Digitell's" render, males don't look quite so "cylon imitation human" or whatever.  Smooth youthful skin sort of reminds me of "Lucas 8"

    We've talked wrists & elbows.  Call me odd but one of the first things I noticed was the lack of detail for the vaunted HD belly button.  (Why bother to encrypt a belly button morph?  Seriously.  Is there some reason for it?)   

    Anyway, the following is a silly render meant for testing and very small audience, but what they hey.  Provides side by side comparision with a customized V8/FSWA Elizabeth and RY Steve.  It's sort of poking fun at G9F's buff looking athletic shoulders (swim team) then of course they compare HD bellybuttons.



    Will continue to have an open mind about G9.  I'm sure PAs will eventually give us quality male & female characters, face & body moprphs, etc.

    Best wishes & happy rendering 

    Hahaha, I love this render (with no intention to diss G9 whatsover) OT mind if I asking if the background is a product in the DAZ store or an HDRI?
  • nonesuch00nonesuch00 Posts: 18,284
    edited October 2022

    CHWT said:

    The wrists!

    It's close but the side opposite the thumb needs more flexibility, that notch at the end of the ulna, and then I think it all falls into place. 

    Post edited by nonesuch00 on
  • nonesuch00nonesuch00 Posts: 18,284

    3DRT said:

    Tynkere said:

    Yes without body morphs, had to resort to scaling pectorals-- looks like G9F is wearing a sport bra.  Shoulders look a little buff too-- like she's on the swim team.  

    G9M just looks odd.  A matter of taste I guess.  Out of the box, he looks sort of androgynous imo.

    Hopefully body morphs-- body habitus, fitness details, waist, chest, etc. will solve most issues.

    ---

    PS: I hadn't zeroed in on elbows, but now that it's been mentioned. : O !  Nice render though.  She looks much better than my attempts at scaling and tweaking what few morphs "essentials" have given us so far.  : )

    G9M definitely has more androgynous features compared to G8M. I attached a quick render and it's quite noticeable in the shoulders and especially the chest area. Even the face looks 'softer' in comparison. I think it's still possible to create very masculine characters from this base, it would just take a bit more extra work on the part of the sculptor. 

    I don't know. It looks more realistic to me and less like a simplified male as in a manniquen (that many of us may have grown used to seeing and accepting as normal.)

  • AllenArtAllenArt Posts: 7,169

    I think the male body looks sufficiently male to build upon. The face, however, is where it breaks down for me. G9M looks VERY young. Like teenager young. Here's hoping we get some really good male sculpts :) And we need those morph packs!!

     

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 102,291

    Tynkere said:

    Still on the fence, but after seeing "Digitell's" render, males don't look quite so "cylon imitation human" or whatever.  Smooth youthful skin sort of reminds me of "Lucas 8"

    We've talked wrists & elbows.  Call me odd but one of the first things I noticed was the lack of detail for the vaunted HD belly button.  (Why bother to encrypt a belly button morph?  Seriously.  Is there some reason for it?)  

    HD morphs are not encrypted-to-protect-the-data, they are in an unreadable format as it is proprietary technology.

    Anyway, the following is a silly render meant for testing and very small audience, but what they hey.  Provides side by side comparision with a customized V8/FSWA Elizabeth and RY Steve.  It's sort of poking fun at G9F's buff looking athletic shoulders (swim team) then of course they compare HD bellybuttons.



    Will continue to have an open mind about G9.  I'm sure PAs will eventually give us quality male & female characters, face & body moprphs, etc.

    Best wishes & happy rendering 

  • TynkereTynkere Posts: 834

    CHWT said

    Hahaha, I love this render (with no intention to diss G9 whatsover) OT mind if I asking if the background is a product in the DAZ store or an HDRI?

    Thanks.  If makes even one person smile, then it's time well spent. : )

    The actual background is a 10 meter room made up of six planes + four cubes for baseboards.

    On off chance anyone is curious, here's list of products for most of the props and actors.

    ----

    Fitness Club by Polish -- treadmill, weights rack, etc

    Fit and Strong by Zedicus -- weights, benches, etc

    Competitive Gymnastics by Zedicus -- crash mat

    Vintage Vending Machines by Those Things -- soda machine

    The Works Mega Prop Set by SloshWerks -- water cooler

    (forget where I got the rest of the clutter.  Can never have too many props!)

     

    ---

    Lizzy: (FWSA Elizabeth for V8 customized with face, body, fitness morphs, etc.)

    Super Messy Updo for G8 by OOT

    Velocity Outfit Top for G8 by OOT

    FM Crop Top Pack for G8 by Flipmode

    XF-Uniform Shorts for G8 by Xtart-3D

    Running Shoes for G3 by Cute3D

    ---

    Jenny Nine (Genesis 9 Essentials)

    Voss Hair for G8 by DAZ & AprilYSH

    Sport bra -- DAZ G9 essentials

    Mall Rats for G8 (shorts & flip-flops) by NewGuy

    ---

    Steve (RY Steven for M8 by Raiya) + assorted body/fitness morphs

    Summer Vacation (shorts & shirt) by DAZ & DirtyFairy

    Boardwalk Casual Outfit for G8 (flip-flops) by DAZ + Yannek & Barbara Brundon

    If I've overlooked any of our talented PAs it's because of my absentmindedness.  Not intentional! 

    Enjoy week everyone.  : )

     

  • TynkereTynkere Posts: 834

    Richard Haseltine said:

    HD morphs are not encrypted-to-protect-the-data, they are in an unreadable format as it is proprietary technology

    Thanks.  Hadn't thought about intellectual property rights, but if thieves can make money from it.  : /

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 102,291

    benniewoodell said:

    CHWT said:

    The wrists!

    Yeah, that looks wonky. When I opened up the base G9 to see what they "fixed" for animation and posing, I saw there were separate twists for the upper and lower shoulder and forearms and I thought to myself who can twist that way? The joints were fine before but now things are starting to look really messed up. They can "fix" that, but they can't do a thing to make IK work where if I'm doing a walk cycle, the feet and thighs don't move all over the place like the character is balancing on ice when I move the hips to make the second contact pose. 

    The twist and bend are separated as they need different weight maps - the bend is at the joint, the twist is distributed along the limn as it is performed by relative movement of two bones. The way that the bones are separated is an improvement over the rpevious as the twist bones no longer interupt the chain.

  • PerttiAPerttiA Posts: 10,024

    It looks like left and right eyeball has a different geometry and the area that has the most dense mesh is the nose, probably for taking close ups of nose pores.

    As I predicted, the details done in HD were a disappointment. When the geometry doesn't support the shape, it doesn't help if it's made HD. Setting the dial to 500% shows how they distort when the geometry isn't there for the shape.

  • PixelSploitingPixelSploiting Posts: 898
    edited October 2022

    Going to need morphs like Skin Folds & Creases, Auto Shape Enhancer and Ultimate Natural Bends. G9 mesh might need extra corrective JCM more than G8.

    Post edited by PixelSploiting on
  • PerttiAPerttiA Posts: 10,024

    PixelSploiting said:

    Going to need morphs like Skin Folds & Creases, Auto Shape Enhancer and Ultimate Natural Bends. G9 mesh might need extra corrective JCM more than G8.

    They said posing/bending was better than on previous generations... Still trying to figure out how.

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